Split Second AFC w/ MP3 ecu or ES ecu?

[blueprotegelx]

I've decided the next mod to get will be the split second air fuel controller. I have been doing searches and have been unable to answer my own question:
Should I use the SS AFC w/ my MP3 Ecu or my stock ecu? If I use MP3 I will have to retard it correct? Which would be best to use?

EDIT: Since I'd either have to retard the MP3 ecu or advance the stock ecu would it be best to sell the MP3 to get SS AFC?

 

[Captain KRM P5]

I've decided the next mod to get will be the split second air fuel controller. I have been doing searches and have been unable to answer my own question:
Should I use the SS AFC w/ my MP3 Ecu or my stock ecu? If I use MP3 I will have to retard it correct? Which would be best to use?

EDIT: Since I'd either have to retard the MP3 ecu or advance the stock ecu would it be best to sell the MP3 to get SS AFC?

are you boosted or not boosted? if you are doing this for N/A, leave in the mp3 ecu. if you are boosted use the non mp3 ecu.

 

[808MP5]

ahhh if you sell the mp3 ecu please let me know

 

[blueprotegelx]

are you boosted or not boosted? if you are doing this for N/A, leave in the mp3 ecu. if you are boosted use the non mp3 ecu.

I am non boosted, can you explain the benefits of leaving the mp3 ecu vs stock ecu w/ SS AFC? Thanks Ken...

 

[Captain KRM P5]

I am non boosted, can you explain the benefits of leaving the mp3 ecu vs stock ecu w/ SS AFC? Thanks Ken...

there is no reason to get rid of the advanced timing when you are staying N/A. high timing causes pinging under boost because of increased combustion temps, requiring either more fuel or pulling timing. on an N/A application, more timing is beneficial to make power. you want to leave that alone and tune the car with the AFC to pull or add fuel as needed to make more power.

 

[blueprotegelx]

I will most likely be getting this part from you ken as not many show up on the forums. When I come up with the money should I email you about a map for the SS AFC? I noticed on the listing on your site it says:
"Protege Garage is now in possession of naturally aspirated fuel maps for the Split Second, call or email for information."

 

[Captain KRM P5]

yes please do that

 

[blueprotegelx]

does anyone know how much i can gain, or atleast what type of numbers i will be putting down with short ram intake, obx header, 2.5 catback with hi flo, mp3 ecu, split second and i may or may not have my intake manifold w/ out vtcs and ported on, atleast not for a while til i get a grinder.

 

[Captain KRM P5]

does anyone know how much i can gain, or atleast what type of numbers i will be putting down with short ram intake, obx header, 2.5 catback with hi flo, mp3 ecu, split second and i may or may not have my intake manifold w/ out vtcs and ported on, atleast not for a while til i get a grinder.

send a PM to jamesk. i wish i could answer that but i dare not hazard a guess.

 

[808MP5]

i'll let you know when i get $300 for a tune... I have everything you just mentioned except the mp3 ecu... but i also have a 626IM + more but should make up for not having an ecu... hopefully you beat me too it so i can see what numbers your pushing

does anyone know how much i can gain, or atleast what type of numbers i will be putting down with short ram intake, obx header, 2.5 catback with hi flo, mp3 ecu, split second and i may or may not have my intake manifold w/ out vtcs and ported on, atleast not for a while til i get a grinder.

 

[blueprotegelx]

i'll let you know when i get $300 for a tune... I have everything you just mentioned except the mp3 ecu... but i also have a 626IM + more but should make up for not having an ecu... hopefully you beat me too it so i can see what numbers your pushing

if installing the split second right away, my car should run ok correct? it just will not have it's full potential until i tune? b/c i would like to get the afc and install before christmas, and then by next summer w/ my school loan i hope to come by cams and udp. i know i should invest into cam gears so that it makes my cams easier to tune, but i'm not sure my budget will allow that right now.

i will send a pm to jamesk, i had been recently talking to him through pm's and he is the one who recommended me get the SS AFC. I will recommend him this link...

808MP5: I noticed you have a bored throttle body w/ your mani, I have been curious if that will help me out as well even though i am using the stock mani? I will most likely try to find a spare rather than bore out my current and only stock?

 

[808MP5]

im currently running the map made by jamesk but its only tuned for WOT... as for the bored throttle body im not too sure what kinda gains i got from it but... corksport sells the autoexe 60mm TB but i think it is way over priced for a measly 5hp bump. You'll definently feel more with the 626im... I put both the IM and TB in at the same time and it did change the sound of the car. I would like to think it got faster.

 

[jamesk]

having a mp3 ecu is the big part of using the ss afc. having a more advanced timing curve will smooth out the powerband dramatically and will allow tuning to be easier. ignition timing and fuel management are different, but do relate to one another.

"Timing and fuel interrelate because they both have an effect on the tendency of an engine to knock, and because air/fuel mixture affects flame speed, which affects ideal timing, air/fuel mixtures burn faster with increasing richness all the way to an 11.1:1 air-gasoline mixture."- jeff hartman

so having more advance timming means that adding a little more fuel to create a ratio of around 12.5-13.1 should be a good gain with added timming. not having the mp3 ecu and stock timming map, i would probably shoot for a ratio fo 13.0:1 to 13.5:1 since the combustion chamber doesnt run as hot.

the air fuel controller with the mp3 ecu is a great and easy way to take advantage of bolt ons, even on the stock engine. the stock ecu runs to lean all the way up to around 4500 rpms, then gets way to rich all the way to redline. having a air fuel ratio of 13.3 switching to around 12.5 all the way to redline throughout the whole rpm range will get you a nice bump in power helping out the aggresive timming curve.

NOTE - remember, 91 or higher octane is required. if your ratios are perfect with premium gas, runing a lower octane with a pacific fuel map and aggresive timing map could hurt the engine.

 

[blueprotegelx]

i did not realize i needed to run a wideband 02 with the SS AFC. I thought a a/f ratio gauge would do the trick to run the afc, but after speaking with JamesK I was wrong. So it's going to take me a little longer to apply the afc since the wideband's are a little more pricey and does not fit my budget as of right now.

anyone know of a used wideband and ss afc?

 

[blueprotegelx]

wideband and afc have been ordered, and wideband has already been shipped. i'm thinking about going ahead and installing the wideband when i get it so that i can see how the car runs and record various afr at certain rpm's etc. i just wanted to post to confirm, but i did searches, and from what i can tell the wideband needs a bung installed 12" before hi flow so that it can get more accurate readings? i have a custom 2.5" catback w/ hi flo welded on. i'm going to try and run the wiring before i take it to the shop and zip tie it to underneath the car so i can just put the sensor in once their finished w/ the install.

i need to jack my car up, i tried to look underneath for the 2nd O2 sensor but i could not see it. did the 2nd O2 sensor go into the cat? maybe that's why...

EDIT: Do I need to order a certain type of bung or will any exhaust shop carry a bung for the o2 sensor? I was unsure if there was a certain size or type (stainless steel etc) that I would need...

 

[Tom03es]

Do you have a header? Both of my o2 sensors are in my OBX header.

And yes, a competent exhaust shop should have the needed bung on hand to get you going.

 

[blueprotegelx]

Do you have a header? Both of my o2 sensors are in my OBX header.

And yes, a competent exhaust shop should have the needed bung on hand to get you going.

yeah i have the obx header as well. so both sensors are located within the header. thanks tom! i was going to take a look at it tomo morning....actually i still am going to so i can familiarize myself. i have not looked at my exhaust in forever and it being custom i can not recall what they did.

but the shop should install the bung 12" before the hi flo correct? how far is the 2nd O2 sensor away from the hi flo? just asking so that the 2nd o2 and w/b do not run into eachother or what not.

 

[blueprotegelx]

Wideband

I installed my AEM UEGO Wideband. Maybe it's just b/c it's my first time having a w/b but, i'm worried I either do not have it hooked up right or my car need tuned bad, or maybe it's normal. Below are pics of the sensor in my exhaust. I connected the long wire connector to the sensor plug, then ran through engine bay and into driver side firewall leading to gauge. Ran red to power source, and black to ground source and zip tied blue/white out of the way. I started the car and the w/b did it's loading. After that it was all over the place which I figured was due to warming up. After that at one point it stayed around 14.5, then after idling more it stayed at 16ish. when giving gas it was all over the place and at one point it would go past 17 and then 3 dashes would appear and then back and fluctuate then idle. i have not driven it yet. This was all within a 10 minute period parked in driveway. I'm pretty sure everything is hooked up correctly....I'll be driving tomo to work and will monitor more. Is all this normal mentioned so far?

 

[blueprotegelx]

Are there any preloaded NA maps for the ssafc?

 

[blueprotegelx]

got my afc yesterday! sweet...