P5 on the track, brake issues?

[zumi]

thanks for the advice. i think i'll go 91 just to be safe...what's a few extra couple bucks anyway...

well, the shop was out of Motul 600 so I went for ATE Super Blue, and I just found out TireRack sent me the wrong Hawk Pads!! I'm pretty pissed, now I have to use my stock ones for the event cuz it's too late (and too much of pain, as i learned) to swap in new ones. =( Oh well, I'll just pray that my pads die gracefully out there. at least i have the fluid in there.

anyhow, any other input would be great. thanks again =)

 

[SFC01v2]

I don't really see how the rotors would present a problem.

[snip...]

The stock rotors are just cast iron rotors like any other. Specual rotors such as slotted/drilled for this situation are unnecessary.

I disagree. Cast iron isn't just cast iron. That is like saying steel is steel. Granted slotting/drilling has nothing to do with metallurgy - but it would be fair to assume that a manufacturer who goes to the bother of offering a slotted/drilled rotor would use an iron composition more suited to spirited driving.

As someone else wrote rotor warping isn't necessarily caused by brake application - it is more than likely a result of uneven cooling.

Some additional information:
http://www.mrtrally.com.au/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=403
http://www.mrtrally.com.au/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=117

 

[Lt. Dan]

on a Protege, cross drilled rotors will do jack squat. Just stick with blank rotors...

Dan

 

[rowan]

Motul 600 is not what you want anyway. You could make use of Motul DOT 5.1 though.

In all likelyhood, if you're running the stock all season tires and they're not shaved and still have a fair bit of tread on them ... the tires will start to overheat before your brakes do.

 

[zumi]

Hooray, so I finally got some pics posted from the event.

The event was great. First I gotta say, if you haven't been to a driving school yet, spending a few hundred bucks this way is far better than any mod you can buy for your car. If you wanna be fast (and safe) the best mod you can do is to yourself.

OK enough blabbering...The school consisted of 3 cone exercises: slalom, threshold braking, and emergency lane changes...they were helpful in finding and pushing the limits of my car. Then there were 6 sessions on the track of about 25-30 minutes in length. Add in the time I rode with my instructor and that's quite an amount of time on the track.

The first 3 sessions I took my P5 out...and it must have been a combination of my good instructor and beginner instincts because in these sessions I was one of the faster cars, passing much superior cars like S4's, RS6's, Porsche 944's and the like.

Then, people got better, so it was time to use my instructor's S4 =). Not like it was a race or anything, but it's a lot easier to concentrate on your own line and your own driving if you don't have to let people pass all the time. It was also good to switch over because my stock pads were complaining too (stupid TireRack..grrrr). S4 handled much differently of course, loads more power and also a lot more weight. Quattro was great for powering out of turns. Feels much more stable in general. P5 might be funner tho =P

So after those first 3 sessions my brakes had seen better days...I wasn't even braking that hard either, nowhere near threshold like in the cone exercises. I think the pads are fairly glazed now; the pedal seems to travel a lot farther before anything starts happening. Rotors are fine as far as I can tell as I made sure to cool off appropriately and not set the ebrake.

Without further ado...here are pictures...

here i am in turn 13

over the eagles nest in turn 5

stuck behind a bunch of slow audis =P

then in my instructor's S4

thanks everybody for their advice. I hope to be out there again soon. =)

 

[kcbhiw]

Beautiful pics! Road courses are fun, aren't they? I've been bitten by the bug. I'll be attending a driver's school next month at Roebling Road in GA to obtain my novice liscense for SCCA Club Racing. After that, I'll be racing at Road Atlanta several times this season. I can't wait.

As far as your brakes go, bleed a bit of the fluid off of each corner, change the pads, and just for good measure, run a medium grain sandpaper over each side of the rotors (to remove any glaze that may exist).

Two years ago, I attened my first track day at Road Atlanta with my (former) 88HP automatic Ford Escort. The track was the blast, but the car was bloody slow, lol. I couldn't break 90 MPH going into 10-A.

Anyway, just watch yourself. You've gotten a wiff of real driving; it only becomes more addictive . With that, more money gets spent, hehe.

 

[2k2s4]

Looks like tons of fun, I can't wait for the season to start up again. I ran 15 days in '03 in my S4, got bit by the track bug hard and just couldn't stay away. Hoping to get the girlfriend out in her new P5 this spring. Hopefully Pagid or Cobalt makes a pad to fit he P5's calipers. I'm reading a lot of people saying they they've warped their rotors, I'm not going to say they have or haven't, but please read the article below. StopTech is legit and the guys there know their stuff. Their brakes can haul my 3800 lb. S4 (with driver) down from 140 MPH at Watkins Glen; good stuff.

<a href="http://www.stoptech.com/whitepapers/warped_rotors_myth.htm">The "Warped" Brake Disc and Other Myths of the Braking System</a>

 

[kcbhiw]

Looks like tons of fun, I can't wait for the season to start up again. I ran 15 days in '03 in my S4, got bit by the track bug hard and just couldn't stay away. Hoping to get the girlfriend out in her new P5 this spring. Hopefully Pagid or Cobalt makes a pad to fit he P5's calipers. I'm reading a lot of people saying they they've warped their rotors, I'm not going to say they have or haven't, but please read the article below. StopTech is legit and the guys there know their stuff. Their brakes can haul my 3800 lb. S4 (with driver) down from 140 MPH at Watkins Glen; good stuff.

<a href="http://www.stoptech.com/whitepapers/warped_rotors_myth.htm">The "Warped" Brake Disc and Other Myths of the Braking System</a>

Ahh!! That's the article I've been looking for. (Bookmarked it, then lost it with PC crash).

 

[Jawaiian23]

I've recently took my Protoge5 Willow Springs and a local auto-x. Willow Springs in a high speed road course, but it's easy on your brakes. I didn't have any problems there. The brakes performed just fine. As for the auto-x... my heel-toe didn't work out so well. I think the rotors are fine, just need to upgrade the pads. I've raced Thunderhill before... you shouldn't have any problems. Don't worry about brakes... worry about finding your own line, tire pressure, lug nut torque, and driving smoothly. Have fun!

 

[Maxx Mazda]

I've been auto-xing my P5 for awhile now, and I jsut recently upgraded the stock brakes to KVR cross drilled rotors, carbon pads, and stainless lines. Going to the track in about 2 hours to try them out, but when I pulled the stock ones off, they were just cooked from autox.

 

[fifthgearonline]

So you dont believe in either cross drilled, slotted, or both being able to dissipate heat faster?

in the kind of racing that 99% of the people on this board do....Blank rotors and great pads and fluid are MORE then enough. there is no need for slotted and or cross drilled rotors for the casual HPDE driver

 

[Maxx Mazda]

in the kind of racing that 99% of the people on this board do....Blank rotors and great pads and fluid are MORE then enough. there is no need for slotted and or cross drilled rotors for the casual HPDE driver

No way man. I ******* cooked (and I mean char-broiled) my stock brake equipment within like 5 track days. Since I upgraded to the iON kit, it's a fuckign dream. No more fade, a way stiffer pedal, and the heat dissapation is awesome with the cross drilled rotors and carbon pads. True, the "casual" Solo2 driver may not need it, but if you take your racing seriously, it's a must to have good brakes. once you spend the money and it is worth it, you'll wonder how you ever stopped before.

 

[jaje]

No way man. I ******* cooked (and I mean char-broiled) my stock brake equipment within like 5 track days. Since I upgraded to the iON kit, it's a fuckign dream. No more fade, a way stiffer pedal, and the heat dissapation is awesome with the cross drilled rotors and carbon pads. True, the "casual" Solo2 driver may not need it, but if you take your racing seriously, it's a must to have good brakes. once you spend the money and it is worth it, you'll wonder how you ever stopped before.

i agree...autox and track events are two completely different animals...stopping from 130-140mph is a much different abuse on your brakes than 80mph (tops you get in autox)...the heat that builds up is much greater