Interested in MazdaSpeed Protege for Autocross D Stock

[powersmx5]

I am looking very seriously at the Mazdaspeed Protg as my next car to autocross. I am a current Miata owner that has campaigned that car in the New England region SCCA for the past 3 years and had a decent amount of success with it winning SM2 and CSP class championships. I am a decent driver I have taken five Evolution Performance Driving Schools and instruct with a few clubs but I think it is time to move onto a new challenge. The Mazdaspeed looks like a great overall package plus it will be easier to live with everyday unlike my CSP car.

Pros: lsd, wide wheels, good factory suspension, low end grunt, relatively narrow

Cons: Weight, limited front camber, mac strut suspension, power, offset and coil spring cup limit tire width. ABS issues

So I have been reading about the prior attempts to make the Protg a D class contender and I want to push that a little farther and put more setup time into the car. I have great competition to test the car David Gott, Matt Murrary (Multi time national champ) GJ Dixon (National Champ) Sam Krauss (multiple National Tour and Pro Solo wins)

Future Plans:
Wet rebuild Koni DAs
Larger front sway
Alignment specs borrowed from the work that was done to the 6th place finishing car
17 inch light weight wheels (Enkei, Volk, SRR)
Tire size? Can I fit a 245 on the front end of this car? A 245/40/17 is available from Hoosier and would provide tremendous grip. Run allowable spacers on the front and leave the rear tires a 225 size tire to get heat into them.

The competition is tough over the last 4 years at nationals ITRs represented 52% of the top 10 finishers while BMW was 25%. Dodge, Eagle, and VW made up 5% of the class finishers. Lexus, Mazda, and Subaru each scored 1 top ten finish or 2.5%.

Are there any large performance difference between the 03 and 03.5 Proteges besides rear wing weight difference?

Looking for any suggestions or ideas on things I could change or worked on your car for autocross wheels, tires, sway bar?

 

[Shadow102]

why are you looking to do a larger front sway bar? Everything i have researched has pointed to a large rear sway making the car easier to rotate.

 

[susamafone]

why are you looking to do a larger front sway bar? Everything i have researched has pointed to a large rear sway making the car easier to rotate.

+1

 

[moxnix]

Read the MSP in DS thread again.

245s - People are already running the 245/40/17in the front on 50 offset wheels and 225/45/17 in the rear.

Who are you going to get to build you a bigger front sway?

K1-TS wheels are pretty lightweight and not the expensive.

Spicy is fastest . The 03.5 has the damn body cladding that does not stay on with the 3M tape.

 

[xelderx]

You can drill an extra endlink hole in the stock sway to increase the rate a little. You would be hard pressed to get much more bar crammed in there.

 

[powersmx5]

The front sway bar on a stock class McStrut FWD car, generally the school of thought is that the bigger front bar will actually reduce under steer because it helps keep the car flatter, and thusly, from gaining positive camber on the outside front. The car will transition better, but in doing so you may introduce (more) inside wheelspin as you come off of some corners...that is the potential tradeoff. I was hoping the larger contact patch of the 245 would mitigate any inside wheel spin. Also I was under the impression that a few manufactures make a larger front bar for the Protg like AWR and maybe Small Fortune Racing. What is the size of the stock front bar? About the rear bar since I cannot change it I have to work around it the larger front bar may not be the best way but it is better than leaving it alone.

 

[Shadow102]

i believe AWR only makes a rear replacement bar

 

[moxnix]

I have not seen anybody make a new front bar for the protege. The stock bar is 25mm IIRC.

 

[powersmx5]

AWR sells an adjustable 21.5 mm bar is that larger than the stock piece?

 

[xelderx]

AWR sells an adjustable 21.5 mm bar is that larger than the stock piece?

That is the rear bar they sell. The MSP already has a bigger front bar than all the other Proteges from the factory.

 

[apexlater]

I think there can be some interesting things to try with a MSP in D-stock. I ran my old MP3 in GS 2 years ago and was only successful regionally. Got my butt handed to me at Divs to Pilson in the rented Carpenter Celica. But the MP3 and MSP are mechanically identical.

I ran 225-45-17, 17x7 50mm offset front and rear. The rears rubbed on the strut body, but Racerxgirl never mentioned any fitment issues on her speed. I'm wondering if the 225-40 may give you better gearing and turn-in.

Be prepared to use some, maybe alot of toe out in the rear. The stock front bar makes transitioning very crisp, but I battled wheelspin like crazy (open diff).

Weight saving. I never really explored it, but I would try and see if there is any documentation about removing the rear seat and folding the seat-backs down like the P5 can. Straight-pipe off the cat if you can get past the sound meter (I imagine the turbo muffles pretty well). Trunk deck sub-woofer: Here is where I was going to try and get creative (the MP3 has a huge tube). Replace that (which is high weight) with a small speaker, maybe even a tweeter. You could probably even wire it to work. Since you can't remove it completely you have to retain some sort of stereo speaker there, and I think that you could win a protest.

Edit: Nevermind my sub-woofer idea.

13.2 BODYWORK
A. Accessories, gauges, indicators, lights and other appearance,
comfort and convenience modifications which have no effect on
performance and/or handling and do not materially reduce the
weight of the car are permitted.

It would materially reduce the weight of the car, oh well.

You might want to consider going with a slightly softer/smaller front bar. The stock springs aren't that bad at controlling roll, and it might just be a matter of getting someone to weld an extension on the existing bar for a softer setting, plus the new shocks will help. And get some adjustable endlinks, having pre-load in the bar sucks.

Alignment: Rotate the strut tops for max neg. camber and caster in the front. I was also able to squeeze out an extra -.5 from prying the control arms and sub-frame slop (to a whopping -1.25 in the front). The rears I tried to get as little negative camber as possible (can't remember what I ended up with).

 

[Vanimaniac]

As far as custom swaybars, I've heard good things about the quality of work by a company named Saner. However, I've heard the turnaround is frustratingly slow. http://national.citysearch.com/profile/40972296/?brand=smx_yp-nc I had a website for them but not sure if it still exists or not.

I'll be running DS at the Milwaukee Tour next month in an IS300. It'd be nice to see a Mazdaspeed out there.

I say go for it, though!

Van

 

[powersmx5]

Thanks everyone for the suggestions.

I need to see an underside pic of the car to see how difficult fitting a 3 inch cat back exhaust would be.

Weight savings is always a good Idea but it looks like I am only really going to get it from

exhaust assuming stock muffler is huge and heavy

wheels and tires

Maybe even the speaker idea

Looking forward to the build I am hoping to give a few of the local national guys a run for their money.

225's would provide a nice gearing bump but I like the idea of 245's for overall grip increase.

 

[aMaff]

I co-drove RacerXGirl's MSP in DS last season, and we never had a problem rubbing the struts in the rear w/ the 225s.

I think the MSP could very well be one of the more under rated cars in DS. About the same power as the ITR w/ MUCH more turque.

 

[Rogue]

i believe the ITR is rated at 197bhp

 

[aMaff]

about the same...

 

[evilmonkeyMSP]

only about 30 hp difference there

 

[Macs MSP]

MSP in DS

Why are we starting a new DS thread. Look up the "MSP in DS" post and you will find all of these answers.

powersmx5,

PM me and I'll let you know anything you need to know.