Instrument Cluster & Title Questions

[Juben]

What's up, guys? I have a couple of random questions for you that I haven't been able to find definitely answers for.

1) Did all ES models come with the white instrument cluster gauge faces? I have an '02 model (10/01 build date) that has the black cluster. I recently purchased my Protege, and upon some poking around underneath the car, I began to question the mileage of 130k. I'm not a fan of the green gauge lighting on the speedo and tach, so I was going to change the bulbs and in doing so discovered that the ES models appeared to have the white gauge faces. With that said, I'm beginning to wonder if it was swapped out and what the true mileage is.

2) Are all Proteges shown as being a DX on the car's title or insurance papers? I was going through the car today cleaning it out and came across some insurance papers from the 1st owner (I'm the 3rd afaik). It listed the car as a DX, but it has ES on the fenders, a sliding sunroof, spoiler on the trunk, fog lights, etc like every other ES I've seen. I've been trying to do some searching on the title to find any reported mileages (see above No. 1) and they're all showing the car as being a DX. I found some other ES' online with their VIN numbers and ran them to show the same thing as mine is showing. It's very peculiar to me, so I thought I'd ask.

For what it's worth, I've been mulling the above over for a few days now and have been searching both on here and Google to circumvent making this post, but nevertheless, my searching has been fruitless, so here I am. Thanks for your help and input!

Edit: I also forgot to add that my trip meter isn't working either.

 

[HA-Y-N]

OK so to me it sounds like you have an ES unless someone did a full conversion which I highly doubt. The gauge cluster was probably changed out to reflect lower mileage because as you said ALL ES trim level cars came with a white gauge cluster.

Another big difference with the DX/LX and ES models is the 4 way dis brakes and 5 lug rims. If you still got 4 lugs and drum brakes then you got a DX or LX.

I know vehicles with ABS and vehicles without ABS use different sensors to determine vehicle speed and mileage. If your car has ABS it will need a gauge cluster from a car with ABS and vice versa. This may explain why your Odometer is not working.

Hopefully that helps you out a little.

 

[HA-Y-N]

Also you could try contacting the previous owner and see if they know anything. Just a thought.

 

[Juben]

OK so to me it sounds like you have an ES unless someone did a full conversion which I highly doubt. The gauge cluster was probably changed out to reflect lower mileage because as you said ALL ES trim level cars came with a white gauge cluster.

Another big difference with the DX/LX and ES models is the 4 way dis brakes and 5 lug rims. If you still got 4 lugs and drum brakes then you got a DX or LX.

I know vehicles with ABS and vehicles without ABS use different sensors to determine vehicle speed and mileage. If your car has ABS it will need a gauge cluster from a car with ABS and vice versa. This may explain why your Odometer is not working.

Hopefully that helps you out a little.

I have the 4 wheels discs and 5 lug wheels, so I too feel confident that I have an ES. It's just odd that the title shows it being a DX. Perhaps Mazda shows them all that way? The VINs dont appear to have been tampered with in any of the locations either and all match, so it's possibly a fluke.

The gauge cluster being changed out concerns me more than anything. I bought this car based around the fact that it was a "low mileage" car at 130k. The timing belt, etc had been changed out at a little over 100k, but now, who knows how long ago that's been. I wish Mazda would have stored the mileage in the PCM.

Also you could try contacting the previous owner and see if they know anything. Just a thought.

I've been checking into that. I found some old papers from the previous owners, so I've been searching them online. I found a number and it's out of order, but I found a matching address showing the original owner, so I might just stop by and see if they're receptive about discussing the car. I hate to bother anyone like that, but I just want to know if this car has 200k+ miles on it. I'd imagine it's something like that because why would they otherwise change a perfectly good cluster.

In any event, thanks for your help and input. I'll make sure to update what I come up with over the week. I'm gonna make some visits to the original owners address(es).

Sent from my SM-N910C using Tapatalk

 

[hornsfan10609]

If it has a black interior it's an ES. Does the rest of the interior light up orange or green? ES models starting in 2001 all have white clusters and orange illumination inside.

 

[horseflesh]

I have an '02 ES. Mine are Black, however the back lighting is red. As it is a canadian cluster.

There was a how-to on how to switch them ( the why i believe is for the red lighting).
https://www.mazdas247.com/forum/sho...Swap-Out-Gauge-Cluster-or-Change-Gauge-Lights

 

[Juben]

If it has a black interior it's an ES. Does the rest of the interior light up orange or green? ES models starting in 2001 all have white clusters and orange illumination inside.

The rest of the interior lights are red. I'm fearing that the worst is going to be true.

 

[hornsfan10609]

What is the worst? That the car has more mileage than the cluster shows? Mileage is just a number, just replace parts as they fail and keep on rolling. Proteges are reliable cars. Even if the trans or engine fails they are relatively easy and certainly inexpensive to replace.

 

[Juben]

What is the worst? That the car has more mileage than the cluster shows? Mileage is just a number, just replace parts as they fail and keep on rolling. Proteges are reliable cars. Even if the trans or engine fails they are relatively easy and certainly inexpensive to replace.

The worst is paying $2,000 for a car with what's thought to be 130k miles. That's right at KBB value for that mileage and I paid it because the car was clean and pretty nice. However, the car could have 300k miles, and at that point, I'm going to be replacing a lot of stuff. It wouldn't be bad if I was in it for $1,000 or so, but I specifically looked for a car with lower miles to mitigate having to work on it all the time as I want to use it for a daily. I've absolutely fallen in love with these little cars and would like to keep it, but unknown mileage concerns me. In any event, whether I would sell this one or keep it, I plan to keep a Protege. Like I said, I really dig this car.

On a different note, I've been searching and looking at options if I keep the car and have two questions:

1) If I sourced a FS-DE (not the FS-ZE) from a JDM importer (they tend to have low miles, 50k-60k), would everything bolt up with the exception of changing over some sensors and brackets? I've been looking for a solid answer but haven't uncovered anything yet.

2) On the driver's side of the transmission (manual, G15?), there's a black plate that bolts to the end of the transmission, like a large end cap. Can that be removed easily and resealed without the guts coming out? I was under mine to change the oil and noticed that it appears to be leaking on the bottom of that black cap. As far as swapping engines and such, I'd feel comfortable doing any of that and have many times over, however, I'm not terribly savvy with transmission internals and don't want to pop that off to reseal it if it's going to cause major problems. I had saw a thread a week or so ago about rebuilding them, but I cannot find it again (and I'm still searching).

 

[HA-Y-N]

1) Yes everything will bolt up. If you get an FS-ZE you will want to upgrade the computer to take advantage of the different cams (main difference), if you don't you will be fine but wont get the extra HP, which is the whole point of "upgrading" to an FS-ZE. A few differences in the intake manifolds but you could just swap over your old parts. I know there are a few minor differences but I cant think of them right now. nothing the average Joe couldn't figure out.

2) The black Cap your looking at is your reverse gear assembly cover. Your trans guts wont fall out if you remove it. One thing to look out for underneath the cover is a small plastic piece which directs gear oil to the reverse gears. it is very easy to break and very hard to replace so be very gentle when pulling the cover off. Slap some ultra black sealant and re assemble. You should probably change your gear oil while your at it. Or at least top it off since you had a leak to prevent complete trans failure. Its easy, just take your time and have fun!!!