Install Question

[AlaskaP5]

OK, I have purchased All of the goodies to be installed and plan on starting the install he end of this month, however, i have a quick question.

The setup will have an:
eclipse 2x50 rms @ 4 ohm pushing the fronts &
eclipse 1x400 rms bridged @ 4 ohms pushing the sub.

Will the P5 be able to handle this without any light dimming, and if not, what can i do in order to prevent any light dimming?

I would like to do the whole install and only need to do fine tuning when done and not need to do any more major wiring.

Any input would be great, thanks.

 

[chuyler1]

uh oh 1st_MP3....i beat you to it again...

You should invest in a 1 farad capacitor. This will help your electrical system cope with the new equipment. As people have explained in other threads, the lights dimming is not your biggest problem...its the regulator on your alternator that causes this because it can't keep the voltage constant.

So get a capacitor, wire it in line to your amps, and run a ground wire from it and your amps right to the negative terminal on your battery. This will by pass chassis grounding and prevent the lights from dimming.

 

[1sty]

I would advise against wiring the ground back to the battery, industry no-no other to get rid of noise. The chassis of the car is basicly infanitly large guage of cable as opposed to a 4 guage wire.

It will be impossible to stop light dimm totaly. the closest you will get is with the alumipro 5 farad capacitor.
Even rolling down the windows will cuase the lights to dim for reasons chuyler1 already mentionded.

 

[AlaskaP5]

Are there any makes/models of Caps that you guys would recomend for this application??

 

[chuyler1]

Well, grounding is a 50/50 kinda thing. There is less resistance as 1st_MP3 said, but you can induce noise from other electrical devices that use the same ground. I've tried it both ways and not really noticed any difference, except in my Cougar where I was getting alternator whine. I know PPI recommends doing both at the same time, but I always thought that would create a nasty ground loop.

 

[chuyler1]

All caps are basically the same, except for the Aluma Pro one mentioned...which is kinda pricey and not necessary for your setup.

I usually buy all my wiring from the same brand. So if I purchase all Stinger wires and interconnects, then I'll get a stinger cap also. Its usually a matter of convenience cause I'll buy it all online and a store usually carries only one brand anyway.

 

[1sty]

Most caps are all made by the same people any ways just get a reputable brand and a 20VDC not a 16VDC cap and you should be cool. But like I said it will not stop all head light dimming.

 

[AlaskaP5]

Great, thanks for all of your help guys,,, I will try to post some pics when done, but that will be about a month out. Been piecing my system together for about 4 months now and can finally start the long awaited install.

 

[1sty]

Sounddomain.com has some really good prices on stinger stuff. I have bought mostly Stinger wires from them for my system.

 

[chuyler1]

ditto on that. Their price per foot on wire is great for whatever wire you're looking for.

 

[hihoslva]

500 watts RMS and a cap? Sorry guys - this is a waste of money, IMHO.

I currently run over 700 watts with only the SLIGHTEST hint of dimming at the HIGHEST of volumes. It's not a problem - at all. The P5 electrical system is surprisingly capable.

I know there is always debate about the usefulness of capacitors, and I'm not trying to stir that up. But I have to state my experiences here. I have more wattage than this guy, and NO dimming issues at all.

Alaska - I would start without the cap. You can always add it later if you need it. If you hook your system up and have dimming problems, I would first upgrade the alternator ground to at least 4 gauge cable - see if that helps at all. Buying a cap should be a last resort. The alt ground upgrade is legit, BTW - not just a cheapo fix.

BTW - I have NOT upgraded my alternator ground, and I still have no dimming. I'm soon to be running about 1100 watts, so we'll see what happens then. But for the 500 watts you have, I believe buying a cap will be overkill. And certainly not necessary until you SEE if you have any dimming issues.

Just my $.02.

~HH

 

[chuyler1]

How long have you been running this setup hihoslva?

 

[hihoslva]

How long have you been running this setup hihoslva?

Well over a year - probably about 15 months or so.

 

[chuyler1]

I guess the Mazda does have a pretty hardy alternator then. But for a $100, I'd rather be safe than sorry.

...but it has been said before, the lights diming is only a side effect to the actual problem. If you want tighter bass hits, a cap is going to help with that. Its basic physics and it doesn't matter what kind of car you drive. A cap can dish out power faster than a battery. When your amps get the power they want, when they want it, you get tighter bass response. And you can hear the difference.

 

[1sty]

If you are over the alternaotrs rating a cap is actualy worse then good. Its just one more thing the car has to charge. If you are under the draw of the alternator and want to stabalize the cars voltage for the system which can net some gains but not audibly to many people.
When your in my situation and have some big ass amps that you had to upgrade the alternator for and the voltage can drop from 15-12.6 then you will really know the difference.

 

[chuyler1]

I agree and disagree.

If you are drawing that much current, you're right, a cap doesn't do you any good, but most people aren't. However, whether you are over-drawing or not, the cap is never an extra load on your system, because no current is lost or used by the cap, it is merely transfered from one place to another. It is solely a holding place for current until it is needed.

Capacitors charge within fractions of a second (for example if it is fully discharged and you try to hook it up, you get a spark...and after that it is charged). If your system drains so much power that your alternator cannot charge the cap at any point during a musical passage (rock or rap), then you should be at an SPL competion...

...even if the voltage on your car is below 14.4 volts or whatever...the capacitor will still be charging and discharging with the music.

Don't believe me? get an osiliscope and see for yourself.

 

[1sty]

THe cap will cuase a draw on a system by always wanting to charge to capacity, allthough you are correct that it can not place a large enough drain to make a huge difference. But it is one more thing the alternator must give power too until it is full and remeber if it has enough capicty to power the amp for a brief time when the alternator can't then it has that same capacity to draw power for alternator and if the cap can't charge becuase the amp is drawing more power then the system can provide then your F-D, just a little more so with a cap that will be dead wait at that point.

 

[hihoslva]

THe cap will cuase a draw on a system by always wanting to charge to capacity, allthough you are correct that it can not place a large enough drain to make a huge difference. But it is one more thing the alternator must give power too until it is full and remeber if it has enough capicty to power the amp for a brief time when the alternator can't then it has that same capacity to draw power for alternator and if the cap can't charge becuase the amp is drawing more power then the system can provide then your F-D, just a little more so with a cap that will be dead wait at that point.

Damn - that's a helluva sentence, there, 1st MP3!

~HH

 

[1sty]

you can imagine my english teacher used to cry herself to sleep at night over my grammer .

 

[chuyler1]

the object of a capacitor is not to reduce the load on the alternator, but to reduce the fluxuation of current draw from your electrical system, which keeps the alternator charging at a constant rate, which will be the average load of your system.

If you have an 80 amp alternator and you are consistantly drawing more than that, your car would shut off after a few minutes....thats when you need a new alternator.

For every other case, a capacitor eliminates the spikes in current draw that is common with rock and rap music at loud volumes.

I don't know...I give up...I took enough classes in physics to understand it, but I can't teach it.