How To: EGR Removal and Cleaning for Rough Idle Fix

[falsedawn]

Don't for one minute think this is a "30 minute" job though.
Just getting to the bolts involves removing the intake duct and various plugs and pipes and stuff.
Then you'll find the bolts are all but inaccessible to anybody with normal sized hands, and the throttle cable baulks access even more, precisely at the angle you need to get the spanner on.

Once you manage to wriggle a spanner over the bolt heads, you'll find they are bolted in tighter than a camel's arse in a sandstorm.
If you manage to pull the damn EGR valve off without losing any of the bolts/metal gasket, you'll probably need to soak it in penetrating fluid for an hour before attempting to undo the screws that hold it togehter, since these apparently are made of cheese and disintegrate at the first sign of torque.

Once cleaned and oiled, getting it back on is just as bad - I suggest one of those "grabbers" for when bolts and bits go flying into the nether regions of the engine compartment.

They give torque settings for the bolts, but there's barely the room to swing a mini-ratchet, let alone a torque wrench. I say just do them up as tight as you can with a spanner.

Total time to complete: 4 hours.
Total skinned knuckles: all of them
Total time wasted trying to fish out dropped bits from the engine: 1 hour
Total profanities uttered: Lots

Maybe I should just stick to my day job and let the grease monkeys handle this sort of stuff...

 

[122 Vega]

Don't for one minute think this is a "30 minute" job though.
Just getting to the bolts involves removing the intake duct and various plugs and pipes and stuff.
Then you'll find the bolts are all but inaccessible to anybody with normal sized hands, and the throttle cable baulks access even more, precisely at the angle you need to get the spanner on.

Once you manage to wriggle a spanner over the bolt heads, you'll find they are bolted in tighter than a camel's arse in a sandstorm.
If you manage to pull the damn EGR valve off without losing any of the bolts/metal gasket, you'll probably need to soak it in penetrating fluid for an hour before attempting to undo the screws that hold it togehter, since these apparently are made of cheese and disintegrate at the first sign of torque.

Once cleaned and oiled, getting it back on is just as bad - I suggest one of those "grabbers" for when bolts and bits go flying into the nether regions of the engine compartment.

They give torque settings for the bolts, but there's barely the room to swing a mini-ratchet, let alone a torque wrench. I say just do them up as tight as you can with a spanner.

Total time to complete: 4 hours.
Total skinned knuckles: all of them
Total time wasted trying to fish out dropped bits from the engine: 1 hour
Total profanities uttered: Lots

Maybe I should just stick to my day job and let the grease monkeys handle this sort of stuff...

This is a 30 minute job for the average person that understands the whole "righty-tighty, lefty-loosey" thing should be able to tackle it without problem.

Sorry about the whole gravity issue as well.

Britt

 

[RaiderMS3]

I had a similiar experience, but it took about 1.5 hours for me. The screws being made of cheese is funny as hell! I did not have camel ass tight bolts holding on the EGR valve. Mine were torqued at the factory to "payback for Hiroshima".I used a Craftsman swivel head wrench, which is thinner than a regular ratchet. It still took a bit to loosen them. I put my magnetic parts tray under the EGR to catch the bolts and metal gasket the many times they fell during reinstall. This is the wrench I used. It has a long handle, but being able to angle the ratchet head helped. http://www.sears.com/sr/javasr/product.do?BV_UseBVCookie=Yes&vertical=TOOL&pid=00944815000

 

[wannabe]

This is a 30 minute job for the average person that understands the whole "righty-tighty, lefty-loosey" thing should be able to tackle it without problem.

Sorry about the whole gravity issue as well.

Britt

no. i agree. i work on my car all the time and this was actually a pretty difficult task. after going back out and buying a little lowprofile breaker bar i was able to get the bolts off, but then even AFTER soaking the screws in liquid wrench i still stripped 2 of the 4 screws and couldnt get them out AT ALL. i ended up just spraying the cleaner into the valve with the electronics still on there. i let it dry thoroghly before putting it back on, but i still didnt get all the crap out that it should have because i could only do half. it took me a little over an hour.

i did not have the gravity problem.

 

[122 Vega]

Hmm, I guess I stand corrected then. Maybe I got lucky.

Britt

 

[122 Vega]

I'll take some photos tomorrow morning, if still needed. You going to need a special torx wrench to take the valve out. Clean the plunger and the housing.

check out the pics. In my case, when i removed the solenoid valve, the plunger got stock to the throttle body. There was carbon build up.

BTW, thanks for adding this, this was to be the next addition to this How-To but you did it for me.

Britt

 

[tinfoil]

Half hour, if your lucky perhaps. If I didn't have the watchful eye or a mechanic looking over things, then I probably would have had to tow the car in. That being said, if I had been more careful, I probably wouldn't have busted off one of the screws and had to tap the entire thing out.

NOw, the guy who was helping me out is a diesel mechanic. He pointed out that EGR valves in the typical really-big-trucks that he works on actually have the plunger inside rotating a little bit each time it activates, helping it to rid itself of some carbon buildup. Not a bad idea at all.

 

[Voltaic]

Damn, I wish I had seen this thread before I got it fixed.

My CEL turned on while going to Mazda for my 72,000KM maintenance!

Reading ODB-II codes: 60$
Replacing EGR Valve: 195$
Laybor: 75$ / hour

So, close to 380$ CAD

I'm going to build myself an ODB-II reader so that I can avoid spending a crazy amount of money on something I could have done myself. :'(

 

[PaulMP3]

I'll give this a go myself when I put my new intake mani on.

Wonder what happens if you totally remove it and make a block off plate? You can leave the EGR connected still and let it suck in ambient air to hopefully not get a CEL.

i did this this past weekend. After about 60miles the CEL came back on.

 

[Kooldino]

Damn...so it was sucking in ambient air and it still tripped a CEL?

 

[bigj884]

will cleaning the egr valve do anything for an auto P5??

do auto P5's even have egr valves???

 

[Lord_Zath]

yes and yes

 

[AVP]

Thanks for the write-up 122 vega! I just removed the egr on my gf's protege.

I have a question though, should the spring be able to compress really easy?

When I push on the spring, it opens the valve inside the housing, but the valve gets stuck there in the open position (it was opened when i took it apart). Then I have to pull on the spring to get it to close the valve (or wedge a screw driver on the top of the valve).

I have already sprayed carbon cleaner inside there, and sprayed silicone lubricant in there aswell while trying to work the spring back and fourth. But it only wants to stay either open or closed.

Could the valve be trashed? This can't be how it should be right?

Any replies would be appreciated!!
-Ash

 

[122 Vega]

It should not "stick" in either position. It should stay closed without the solenoid activated. The spring is pretty weak, but is strong enough to close the valve if it is clean. I would suggest soaking the shaft of the valve with some PB Blaster or 3'n'1 penatrating oil for awhile. then see what happens.

Britt

 

[AVP]

Thanks britt,

Yeah I brought it to work and showed someone who is familiar with cars, he said the valve is probably fubar'd.

But since I have PB blaster, I am soaking it right now (like you suggested), see if it does anything.

If that doesn't work and the thing is hosed, anyone know of any good Mazda parts sites?
I found one on this site for $124. I was thinking of calling autozone for giggles aswell.
http://www.mazda-parts-dealer.com/parts.htm

 

[peepsalot]

Thanks britt,

Yeah I brought it to work and showed someone who is familiar with cars, he said the valve is probably fubar'd.

But since I have PB blaster, I am soaking it right now (like you suggested), see if it does anything.

If that doesn't work and the thing is hosed, anyone know of any good Mazda parts sites?
I found one on this site for $124. I was thinking of calling autozone for giggles aswell.
http://www.mazda-parts-dealer.com/parts.htm

I have found www.car-part.com to be very good in helping me find parts, although it seems EGR is not one of the things you can search for. (yupnope)

 

[AVP]

peep-
Yeah, sucks that site doesn't list egr valve, and it has nothing in the emissions section either. Thanks though.

Anyhow, I let it sit in pb blast 3 times and carbon cleaner twice. Now I am able to push on the spring with out it getting stuck. I had to work it a lot for this to happen though. I think it will eventually get stuck again, but hopefully I can squeeze 10k miles out of it before it gunks up again (monkey2)
Good thing it wasn't that hard for me to remove since my ratchet set includes a small handle.

-Ash

 

[122 Vega]

EGR is covered under an extended emissions warranty. If it is bad then put it back together and go get a new one. They apparently were on backorder for awhile because they were being replaced so often.

Britt

 

[peepsalot]

NOw, the guy who was helping me out is a diesel mechanic. He pointed out that EGR valves in the typical really-big-trucks that he works on actually have the plunger inside rotating a little bit each time it activates, helping it to rid itself of some carbon buildup. Not a bad idea at all.

That would be sweet if some kind of replacement like that could be fitted to our cars.

 

[shugalou]

Great how too! I did this on my wifes car and she says that it has totally smoothed out! I called the stealer ship and they wanted 194.55 for the valve adn 7.11 for the gasket and .5 hour labour. So I saved about 250 bucks.

A couple of tips to pass on.

1. on the 1.8 motor the EGR Valve was behind the throttle body not underneath.

2. A small rachet and 12mm socket gets in there fine.

3. If the "swiss cheese" screws strip a pair of Vice Grips easily gets them off, I had one strip on me, probably easier to use vice grips anyways cause you reduce the chance of stabing yourself philips style.

4. Use throttle body cleaner. I used half a can of my Honda brake cleaner and I could still see a ton of carbon but it wasn't breaking up. I went to CT and bought the motomaster TB cleaner for 8 bucks and then it started to take off the carbon, more than ever seen with the brake cleaner, this is a must if there is a ton of build up. I used almost the full can of this before the liquid coming out of the EGR was clear!

5. While you have the intake hose off, use the TB cleaner to actually clean the TB, you'll need someone to open the throttle though as it kept dying on me when I tried it myself.

Thanks for this tip, and the great picts!