Help decide! bov or intake ?

[Sinister_MS6]

Iamlegend: i know guys will have mixed feelings about this, but unless you suspect you are having an issue with your stock bpv, don't even bother replacing it. myself and alot of others on here have used aftermarket bypass valves only to go back to the stock one. sure the clanging swords sound of the forge bpv is sexy, but in daily driving the stock piece is alot smoother. i was ready to trade in my car before i reverted back to the stock one, and fell in love with the car all over again.

(rofl)
Lol..are you serious? "Most likely" please tell me ur kidding! No one buys a bov for performance or for sound. If they do, then they're buying it for the wrong reasons. Everyone knows the stock "plastic bpv" doesn't hold boost that well. I have the PG Type S BOV and the boost seems to hold a lot better than the stock P.O.S! I'd never rock back to the stock bpv for any reasoning at all!(encourage)

 

[Jon MS3]

^ intelligent argument there "MS6" , i know for a fact i'm not alone on this as i had alot of conversations with guys on here that had switched back and ultimately convinced me to. Maybe you were one of the few people that actually had a leaking BPV (on your MS6), or maybe you just have no idea what your talking about

 

[Tyrdstorm]

I went back to the stock BPV myself. My TurboXS valve had a lot of flutter after I let off the gas during some shifts. I have no problems at all with the stock BPV holding boost. And not everyone likes the sound of the clanging swords; I had to sell my Forge because the sound got on my nerves so bad. Anyway, the only reasons you should get a new BPV are:
- if you want it to sound different
- you want your engine bay to look cool
- you like to waste money
- you've been told the stock BPV sucks and you believe everyone on the internet
- you're having issues holding boost
- you need to hold more boost than the stock BPV can handle.

 

[MSMS3]

(rofl)
Lol..are you serious? "Most likely" please tell me ur kidding! No one buys a bov for performance or for sound. If they do, then they're buying it for the wrong reasons. Everyone knows the stock "plastic bpv" doesn't hold boost that well. I have the PG Type S BOV and the boost seems to hold a lot better than the stock P.O.S! I'd never rock back to the stock bpv for any reasoning at all!(encourage)

So, which valve would you rather have?

That "POS" supposedly leaking stock valve actually held boost higher than the leading aftermarket valve, the Forge, in 3rd gear and higher where there is load on the engine.

The chart is in the published comparison by Grass Roots Motorsports Magazine on a gen 1 MS3.

Me, I'll take the one that holds higher boost under load when I need more power rather than the one what "recovers" quicker when granny shifting around town. The Forge "felt" more snappy. The stock valve allowed the engine to make more power. I'll take power, thank you.

I'm at 61,000 miles on that "POS plastic" bpv, running a target 18 psi boost and cannot, cannot, cannot, make it leak.

I agree with Tyrdstorm. OP should spend his money on an intake and not on an expensive noisemaker unless he has absolute proof that his stock valve is leaking. I'm betting it does not.

 

[meicalnissyen]

So, which valve would you rather have?

That "POS" supposedly leaking stock valve actually held boost higher than the leading aftermarket valve, the Forge, in 3rd gear and higher where there is load on the engine.

The chart is in the published comparison by Grass Roots Motorsports Magazine on a gen 1 MS3.

Me, I'll take the one that holds higher boost under load when I need more power rather than the one what "recovers" quicker when granny shifting around town. The Forge "felt" more snappy. The stock valve allowed the engine to make more power. I'll take power, thank you.

I'm at 61,000 miles on that "POS plastic" bpv, running a target 18 psi boost and cannot, cannot, cannot, make it leak.

I agree with Tyrdstorm. OP should spend his money on an intake and not on an expensive noisemaker unless he has absolute proof that his stock valve is leaking. I'm betting it does not.

Heh Heh Heh
Seems Like alot of MSF'ers in here lately



OP
after you get your SRI/CAI
consider a RMM as the next "must have"

and the silver one is correct. doing a google search on the topic of interest, including mazdas247 in the string will unearth troves of previously discussed info

 

[Sinister_MS6]

^ intelligent argument there "MS6" , i know for a fact i'm not alone on this as i had alot of conversations with guys on here that had switched back and ultimately convinced me to. Maybe you were one of the few people that actually had a leaking BPV (on your MS6), or maybe you just have no idea what your talking about

1.) Make a Poll on this forum, find out. I can almost guarantee you everyone will differ and majority of the poll will say stock Bpv blows if they have encountered the problem, but in the end "We agree to Disagree"!

2.) Please do some research as this has been brought up and been dyno'd before. Stock plastic bpv doesn't hold boost that well as to an aftermarket bov. You can keep ranting and judging off your "butt dyno"

3.) ^^ As speaking of different types of bov. VTA sucks, recirculation FTMFW

 

[Jon MS3]

^do the research yourself, i did mine and am happy with my decision

 

[Sinister_MS6]

So, which valve would you rather have?

That "POS" supposedly leaking stock valve actually held boost higher than the leading aftermarket valve, the Forge, in 3rd gear and higher where there is load on the engine.

The chart is in the published comparison by Grass Roots Motorsports Magazine on a gen 1 MS3.

Me, I'll take the one that holds higher boost under load when I need more power rather than the one what "recovers" quicker when granny shifting around town. The Forge "felt" more snappy. The stock valve allowed the engine to make more power. I'll take power, thank you.

I'm at 61,000 miles on that "POS plastic" bpv, running a target 18 psi boost and cannot, cannot, cannot, make it leak.

I agree with Tyrdstorm. OP should spend his money on an intake and not on an expensive noisemaker unless he has absolute proof that his stock valve is leaking. I'm betting it does not.

Yeah take the worst Bov out there and compare it to the stock bpv. Their are different variety brand of bov's out there. I will agree and say some suck and some are better than the Stock Plastic P.O.S. I',m currently recirculating on the PG Type S BOV and love it.

I used too encounter the hesitation up in the mid-high range of rpms and the car would hesitate too hold boost. Switched to the PG Type S and haven't encountered that problem at all. Car feels more smoother and has a linear powerband through the lower rpms. I'm speaking from the fact being lightly modded to mildly modded.

 

[Sinister_MS6]

^do the research yourself, i did mine and am happy with my decision

That's like saying :

1.) Just because 1 or 2 MS3's run 13flat in the 1/4mile, all MS3's are now low 13sec 1/4mile car's stock. No
2.) Or just because 1 stock MS3 beat a modded MS3. All MS3's are stock are faster than modded MS3's
3.) Or just because 1 stock MS3 dyno's higher than a modded MS3. All MS3's now dyno higher than modded MS3's

You can be stubborn all you want. Doesn't change the fact the Stock BPV sucks, leaks and does not hold boost well as to aftermarket one! I'm done arguing with you. It's like it's going in one ear and out the other.

Have a good day kthanxbye

 

[Jasnall]

Get an Intake first. BOV and TIP and be hit or miss on power gains, the intake will for sure give power gains.

As to the rest; I bet 90% of the people that claim the stock BPV leaks don't have proof, just rumors. I fell victim to it and got a Synapse, they showed it made more HP on their dyno than stock. It's all subjective I guess, but I'd rather have "snappy around town" over peak HP if that's even the case. Do you guys drive through race tracks on your commute to work? I just get the occasional on-ramp. I also happen to love the clean chhhhhhh sound on the BOV.

 

[Jon MS3]

That's like saying :

1.) Just because 1 or 2 MS3's run 13flat in the 1/4mile, all MS3's are now low 13sec 1/4mile car's stock. No
2.) Or just because 1 stock MS3 beat a modded MS3. All MS3's are stock are faster than modded MS3's
3.) Or just because 1 stock MS3 dyno's higher than a modded MS3. All MS3's now dyno higher than modded MS3's

You can be stubborn all you want. Doesn't change the fact the Stock BPV sucks, leaks and does not hold boost well as to aftermarket one! I'm done arguing with you. It's like it's going in one ear and out the other.

Have a good day kthanxbye

That just makes absolutely no sense. Go back to your MS6 forum.

 

[Sinister_MS6]

That just makes absolutely no sense. Go back to your MS6 forum.

Ok..you're telling me it makes no sense!! Neither does ur theory! Just because you or two people haven't encountered the boost leak or hesitation problem. Doesn't justify the fact you have valid points. And too top it off, u try to flee me off back into the MS6 section. Yeah real clever and very wise to try an keep ur argument sound legitimate. What are you contributing in this thread, besides ur weaksauce knowledge wanna be claim facts?

I've encountered this problem before. The stock bpv sucks! I've upgraded too the type s bov from pg and am currently recirculating. Best mod yet so far

 

[Jon MS3]

Here's a contribution for you, from other MS6 guys like yourself.... Read up! (Google "plastic stock bypass valve? truth?")

"Mines still holding up nicely after 55k+ mi w/ moderate bolt-ons. I think this may be the single most trendy, over used, over hyped mod for this car. After first buying the car and seeking out advice on what parts to change out first, people (noobs) are told by others (former noobs) to "get rid of that leaky stock POS BPV", and then go out and do so w/ out critically thinking about/testing it, and so the cycle of buying a shiny new aftermarket fix to a perfectly fine and adequate stock BPV perpetuates itself... "

As for the Original Poster, (if you haven't already been turned by this thread) my recommendations for initial modifications are, in no particular order, Intake, turbo inlet pipe, rear motor mount, aluminum shift bushings, and later down the road when you get tired of everyone on here telling you to lower your car... suspension upgrades. have fun and enjoy your car! and sorry for the ridiculous thread jack/argument.

i'm out.

 

[Sinister_MS6]

Here's a contribution for you, from other MS6 guys like yourself.... Read up! (Google "plastic stock bypass valve? truth?")

"Mines still holding up nicely after 55k+ mi w/ moderate bolt-ons. I think this may be the single most trendy, over used, over hyped mod for this car. After first buying the car and seeking out advice on what parts to change out first, people (noobs) are told by others (former noobs) to "get rid of that leaky stock POS BPV", and then go out and do so w/ out critically thinking about/testing it, and so the cycle of buying a shiny new aftermarket fix to a perfectly fine and adequate stock BPV perpetuates itself... "

As for the Original Poster, (if you haven't already been turned by this thread) my recommendations for initial modifications are, in no particular order, Intake, turbo inlet pipe, rear motor mount, aluminum shift bushings, and later down the road when you get tired of everyone on here telling you to lower your car... suspension upgrades. have fun and enjoy your car! and sorry for the ridiculous thread jack/argument.

i'm out.

Wow....ridiculous post by an 08er. Don't be fooled by my username. I was originally a different user on here back in 2001. Im no (noob)


Good Google search. Shows how much IQ you really lack. What's next? Your going to find magazine numbers, showing the MS3/MS6 running mid-high 14sec 1/4mile times?? Im done with RICERS like you.

Go do some research on this car forum. Real R&D research and development! People that have encountered the problem.

I bet you're going to say next, that everyone who had smoking turbo issues are delusional just because you haven't encountered the problem. Lmfao (jerkit)

 

[MSMS3]

I posted the chart on the comparison between the stock valve and the Forge ver 1 from Grassroots Motorsport Magazine. That is hard objective evidence that the stock valve held higher boost once the car got into third gear, where there is no power hold back.

And the claim that the Forge valve is inherently inferior to its aftermarket competetors is simply . . . unsupportable. Again, go over to the MSF board and spend a little time to see what the power users are actually running . . . usually either the stock bpv or the Forge, unless the are custom tuned to run full VTA, usually with big turbos, and then preferences change based on need to hold much higher boost than the K04 could ever produce safely.

The stock valve holds solidly well above the safe limits of the K04 turbo.

I agree that any bpv or bov can fail. I do not question that some people, on a rare basis, have had the stock valve leak. But that is no more frequent, and probably less frequently than any other valve.

I'm (or was before I got A/S tires - big mistake) 13.4 quarters at 107 mph. I run 60-100 rpm in 6.1 seconds or less. I also have a posted YouTube run under this user name showing a 40-120 mph WOT run in 12.5 seconds. All on the stock bpv. And I'm not some rare occurrence. Again, the hard core gear heads are on MSF. Spend a little time there and you'll see that there is little basis for power users to find fault in the stock valve.

If any valve leaks, stock, or other wise, it needs to be replaced. But that is absolutely no basis to include a bpv or a bov on a list of "must have" mods on this platform. You don't have to believe me. Tell me how that YouTube run is working for me. I've several data logs on this forum and over there, as well as a number of virtual dyno charts and G-Tech acceleration charts as well. My experience is not unusual. Failed stock bpv's are unusual.

If I could get my stock valve to leak, I'd replace it in a heartbeat. I'd look to buy another stock valve from someone who thought it was a "plastic POS." It really is a very elegant and advanced dual diaphragm design.

I'm glad OP seems to have gotten the message and will fucus on intake. That's were he'll make some power rather than blowing money needless on a mere noisemaker.

 

[Sinister_MS6]

I posted the chart on the comparison between the stock valve and the Forge ver 1 from Grassroots Motorsport Magazine. That is hard objective evidence that the stock valve held higher boost once the car got into third gear, where there is no power hold back.

In order to really compare a stock bpv vs bov's. Compare them all, not just the forge! Ever see dyno charts for the RSX forums or for the Si forums for the K20A2/Z1/Z3 motors? They test each header to compare which header puts down the most hp and do several dyno pulls....This is a real comparison.

Just because there is one magazine indication the stock bpv held boost longer/better than the ver 1 forge, does not indicate the fact the bpv is better!

Provide hard facts or dyno sheets that show the stock bpv is better than any aftermarket bov out there. And it also depends if the car enthusiasts is running VTA or Recirculating. I for one "am recirculating"

And the claim that the Forge valve is inherently inferior to its aftermarket competetors is simply . . . unsupportable. Again, go over to the MSF board and spend a little time to see what the power users are actually running . . . usually either the stock bpv or the Forge, unless the are custom tuned to run full VTA, usually with big turbos, and then preferences change based on need to hold much higher boost than the K04 could ever produce safely.

Honestly that's all preference. The forge isn't the best aftermarket bov on the market! Their are other variety brands out there

The stock valve holds solidly well above the safe limits of the K04 turbo.

To a certain extent, yes! But in the future....i would upgrade. My stock bpv was fine till about 20-30K! I noticed the hesitation and the boost did not hold very well. I will admit , the stock bpv worked fine until the hesitations started occurring...

I agree that any bpv or bov can fail. I do not question that some people, on a rare basis, have had the stock valve leak. But that is no more frequent, and probably less frequently than any other valve.

It can go both ways..

If any valve leaks, stock, or other wise, it needs to be replaced. But that is absolutely no basis to include a bpv or a bov on a list of "must have" mods on this platform. You don't have to believe me. Tell me how that YouTube run is working for me. I've several data logs on this forum and over there, as well as a number of virtual dyno charts and G-Tech acceleration charts as well. My experience is not unusual. Failed stock bpv's are unusual.

Too each their own..I'm not doubting the bpv held fine for you! Every car is different. Mine went out and I've also seen the posts back then, about the stock plastic bpv..just does not hold boost that well. Works wonders for some people and goes sour for the others.

I'm glad OP seems to have gotten the message and will fucus on intake. That's were he'll make some power rather than blowing money needless on a mere noisemaker.

This i couldn't agree more. The argument was never about the bov. I clearly stated he should start with an TIP first, then an intake!! Some how the bov got thrown in there and twisted the topic around. And by all means, i don't go for sounds. I go for best power/money ratio can buy.

Turbo Inlet Pipe cost what?? $99
Cold air intake cost $150+ depending on brand

These are the first two power adders i would honestly suggest.

 

[MSMS3]

TIP first? Give us a break. Sorry for having to strongly disagree. At best, you only get a marginally better spool up when driving lazy. No power gain. The intake, ANY intake from a reputable manufacturer, either CAI or SRI will produce a solid 15-20 whp gain.

What do I need an aftermarket TIP for? Did you even check my posted YouTube video (MSMS3). Did you see on stock bpv and stock TIP that I flashed the traction control light on the speedometer side of the dash when flooring it. The f'ing tires broke loose just going WOT in second gear at 40 mph. What would "quicker" spooling do for me?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pRY2wCDcfWA

And there is just too much, too much data out there regarding how good and reliable the stock bpv is on this platform. If it is proven to fail, then yes, replace it. But you are not going to do better aftermarket, unless you are planning to run a big turbo and want to hold boost out to redline at 25+ psi. Sorry. Tough love here.

 

[Sinister_MS6]

TIP first? Give us a break. Sorry for having to strongly disagree. At best, you only get a marginally better spool up when driving lazy. No power gain. The intake, ANY intake from a reputable manufacturer, either CAI or SRI will produce a solid 15-20 whp gain.

What do I need an aftermarket TIP for? Did you even check my posted YouTube video (MSMS3). Did you see on stock bpv and stock TIP that I flashed the traction control light on the speedometer side of the dash when flooring it. The f'ing tires broke loose just going WOT in second gear at 40 mph. What would "quicker" spooling do for me?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pRY2wCDcfWA

And there is just too much, too much data out there regarding how good and reliable the stock bpv is on this platform. If it is proven to fail, then yes, replace it. But you are not going to do better aftermarket, unless you are planning to run a big turbo and want to hold boost out to redline at 25+ psi. Sorry. Tough love here.

I'm not going to even answer the rest of the stupidity responses as too see you cant F*&^ing read! I never NEVER HERE LET ME PUT IT AGAIN NEVER QUOTED, STATED OR MENTIONED the power gains the TIP produces over the intake, bov, tbe, internals, drag radials, K04 turbocharger, tmic/fmic..etc

I simply stated to get the TIP first out of the way, as this will be the OP's first modification done! Seriously their are some RETARTED ASS PEOPLE ON THIS FORUM, WHO CANT READ........

 

[Sinister_MS6]

Sorry OP, Do research or trust your own instincts too modify ur car! Cause in the end it's you're car, so.......GL

 

[MSMS3]

^ Upon this we can agree! (drinks)

However, personal instincts without prior experience with DISI turbo engined cars can be very disappointing to someone starting the mod game. These platforms do not respond the same way to mods as might be the case with other turbo cars an owner may have previously driven. That's why the "search" function is your friend. Read a lot, take much if it with a grain of salt, seek consensus, and when in doubt, try to find hard objective evidence from real data rather than subjective opinion. And enjoy your car.