gas prices
- Thread starter oaklandopen
- Start date
+1
haha, yeah, it's just bait to get people in the door. I can hear them now, 'free gas bro, free gas!'
Exxons rate of return is lower than that of Google, GE, Microsoft and many, many other companies. They may be making billions but the are spending billions to get that return. I believe their profit rate was 9.4%. I have gotten 12-14% return on my 401k in the last few years. The nations that allow drilling for oil are the ones making the profit. There is an indoor sky resort in the dessert in one of those middle eastern countries.
With the volume of product they (the oil companies) supply and the fact that people need the commodity (gas) to live, that direct comparison is hard to make imo. With Microsoft, Google, GE and many other companies people generally have a choice. I don't need to run windows, use google or buy GE. On the other hand, I don't have a choice but to fill up my tank when I want to go anywhere. I HAVE to use Exxon's/ Chevron's product. Their products are GUARANTEED to sell, so they can afford to make a lower return as they'll make up the difference in volume.
Socialist politicians meddling in free market economics makes things worst. They stopped new drilling in country, their allies stop new refinery construction, they subsidize turning food crops into fuel which does nothing to bring down gas prices and only succeeds in raising prices for our food.
Now they are going to make BIG oil pay higher taxes. Guess what that is going to do to the price of gas.
Now they are going to make BIG oil pay higher taxes. Guess what that is going to do to the price of gas.
oaklandopen
Member
i remember when that price spike happened in the summer of 06...i was in iraq at the time and my wife was telling me how it was going to go past $3. i can remember being amazed and disgusted, then glad i wasn't there to help burn up mileage.
i guess now it would be economically better for us if i was back in iraq again, not spending money on gas. even though i was using up gas on the tax payer's expense.
john blutarski
Member
- :
- 2004 Subaru WRX STI
When I first starting driving, I'd get a few dollars from my buddies to drive us around for a week... 5 bucks = half tank. That was only 15 years ago.
dallasms3gt
Member
- :
- Mazda Speed3 GT - 2008
s***, when I started driving, I can remember having to stick my feet out of the bottom of the car, and pedal like Fred Flinstone to work every day...
Frequent Flyer, you hit it right on the head with both posts. The first one is just cold hard reality, and the second post is the "EXACT" reason why gas keeps climbing... Well said...(pissed)
pointysticks
Member
yup. on the grand scheme of things, my MS3 is the economy car in my stable. i was in the market for a truck (hunting and fishing) but the cost of diesel and regular fuel made me rethink that. i kept my beater truck, and bought the mazda. if it gets to $8 per gallon, i am going jetta TDI or (****) a prius. i would give it up. my wife and i have too many cars already.
Chicago gas taxes are 20% of the price of a gallon of gas.
http://cbs2chicago.com/politics/gas.prices.taxes.2.729939.html
http://cbs2chicago.com/politics/gas.prices.taxes.2.729939.html
While on the surface your comment makes sense. It only really makes sense if you into communism/socialism.
I for one prefer to live in a country where I can drive whatever the heck I want whenever the heck I want (within the law of course).
By your logic, the govt should just assign us cars in accordance to our needs/family size (What do you drive BTW?)
I prefer not to use mass transit and enjoy the freedom that comes with owning a vehicle.
I agree that it makes no sense to drive a massive gas guzzling vehicle filled to 1/10 capacity every day for no good reason. But until sky high gas prices deter people from doing so, they will continue to do this. The market will work itself out if allowed to.
When more efficient tech comes along, we'll transition to that. Not saying I don't agree with your points, that point of view is just too hard line for me. Let the markets work.
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FrequentFlyer
Member
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- 2008 CWP Mazdaspeed3
Our government should be TAXING the car manufacturers for making inefficient vehicles and then tax the people who choose to buy them. This tax should be used to research/develop alternate fuel sources or improve our mass transit systems. They tax us on everything else, why not this? SUV's should not be in an untaxed "light truck" category because the majority of them are not used for commercial/utility purposes. If you've got the money to buy a $50,000 Escalade, you can pay a few grand worth of gas guzzler tax. Like I said, I agree that we should have the right to buy whatever we need/want, but this country really needs to change its mentality when it comes to wasting resources and not just write it off with, "It's my right to buy what I want so I'm going to buy an Excursion to drive to work". I've heard some real idiotic reasons why people buy these monstrosities. We've gone backwards in efficiency. Take a look at these stats and tell me what you see:
http://www.bts.gov/publications/national_transportation_statistics/html/table_01_17.html
(look at the trend of light truck sales over the past 17 years)
I drive an '05 Acura RSX Type-S right now, but will probably buy a MS3 within the next week or so to replace it (need a 4 door). I average 30mpg with it and since I commute about 90 miles a day round trip, fuel efficiency is a significant factor in my shopping for a vehicle. Honestly, I'm a bit worried about the MS3 as I read it can go from a respectable 30mpg or so to crappy <20mpg, but with most of my commuting being on the highway, I think I can squeeze 29-30mpg out of it. I should buy a diesel Jetta or a Prius or something, but unfortunately I'm a car buff and can't bring myself to buying such a pansy car.
My wife drives an Acura MDX which I refused to buy, but lost on that arguement because my job had moved us to an area that got a lot of snowfall and she wanted a "safe" vehicle. Meanwhile, I drove an '04 S2000 around with snow tires. 
At least it's a smaller V6 SUV and we've actually managed to get a respectable 26mpg with it during a long highway trip, but for the most part we average about 19-20mpg. Filled the damn thing up today with 89 and it cost me $65. Talk about "ouch". I've thought about getting rid of it, but it's got low miles, it's payed off next year and we just had a baby, so it'll serve its purpose.Getting new technology requires money and where is this money going to come from? Taxation. This is how Europe has developed such a great transportation network. If there was a highspeed train or subway that I could take to work, I sure as heck would take it. I enjoy driving, but my drive to work is a monotenous 40 miles at 75mph on the highway, so sitting in a train would not bother me. I wouldn't have to deal with those pompous SUV drivers either who insist on going 90mph attached to the bumper of the car in front of them. :mad:
It's a little different. Water doesn't need to be underground for thousands of years to form...
mrjoshyman
Member
Our government should be TAXING the car manufacturers for making inefficient vehicles and then tax the people who choose to buy them. This tax should be used to research/develop alternate fuel sources or improve our mass transit systems. They tax us on everything else, why not this? SUV's should not be in an untaxed "light truck" category because the majority of them are not used for commercial/utility purposes. If you've got the money to buy a $50,000 Escalade, you can pay a few grand worth of gas guzzler tax. Like I said, I agree that we should have the right to buy whatever we need/want, but this country really needs to change its mentality when it comes to wasting resources and not just write it off with, "It's my right to buy what I want so I'm going to buy an Excursion to drive to work". I've heard some real idiotic reasons why people buy these monstrosities. We've gone backwards in efficiency. Take a look at these stats and tell me what you see:
http://www.bts.gov/publications/national_transportation_statistics/html/table_01_17.html
(look at the trend of light truck sales over the past 17 years)
I drive an '05 Acura RSX Type-S right now, but will probably buy a MS3 within the next week or so to replace it (need a 4 door). I average 30mpg with it and since I commute about 90 miles a day round trip, fuel efficiency is a significant factor in my shopping for a vehicle. Honestly, I'm a bit worried about the MS3 as I read it can go from a respectable 30mpg or so to crappy <20mpg, but with most of my commuting being on the highway, I think I can squeeze 29-30mpg out of it. I should buy a diesel Jetta or a Prius or something, but unfortunately I'm a car buff and can't bring myself to buying such a pansy car.
Getting new technology requires money and where is this money going to come from? Taxation. This is how Europe has developed such a great transportation network. If there was a highspeed train or subway that I could take to work, I sure as heck would take it. I enjoy driving, but my drive to work is a monotenous 40 miles at 75mph on the highway, so sitting in a train would not bother me. I wouldn't have to deal with those pompous SUV drivers either who insist on going 90mph attached to the bumper of the car in front of them. :mad:
I'd like to start off by saying that I agree that there needs to be change, although I don't believe that government taxation will be the most efficient way of dealing with the issue. So once you use this additional tax revenue to work on new technologies that the government will simply provide to private industries doesn't seem very plausible. The gas guzzler tax won't really deter to many people from buying their 50k Escalades.
Ultimately this is an issue that private industry can handle. Many people underestimate the power of free markets -- this is something that we can see working in front of our eyes. Currently due to the rapid increase in crude --> rapid increase in gasoline, the demand for large vehicles has decreased significantly to the point where some of the big domestic auto makers have decided to hault the production of some of these large gas guzzlers. There has certainly been a movement towards more fuel efficient cars. And many auto makers have been pushing their smaller more fuel efficient cars : toyota yaris, honda fit, nissan versa, smart cars, etc.
Now obviously this is not something we can expect to happen over night, but keep in minds the primary goal of firms is to maximize profits and if the demand for one of their products drops it is to their advantage to fit the needs of the consumers. As speculators push the price of oil higher and higher, more fuel efficient cars will become available, they will be more affordable and more people will purchase them.....
Finally, regarding public transportation -- in Europe, it is not as though you can get to every location by public transportation. Just as in the US, the transportation system is significantly better in urban areas -- in most urban areas in the US, there is no need to own a vehicle. Although in more rural areas it is often quite difficult to get around using public transportation. While some may argue that the European transportation system is superior to the US, we must also compare the taxation rates of the two countries and ask if in the end it is really worth it?
I can't say exactly for you're area -- but even if there were public transportation...do you think in Europe you could easily take public transportation for 40 miles to your place of work (assuming ur place of work is not in a major city)?
You should have to pay a "Far from work tax" and also a "Polution Tax" for your long commute.
Free markets will drive new technology as the price of gas goes up. The government taking more money out of the economy in taxes will only suppress those free minds.
I saw recently where Europeans were riding bicycles everywhere. I don't believe bicycles are "New Technology" but I may be wrong.
There is NOTHING keeping you from paying higher taxes, just make out a check and send it to the IRS, they will cash it. Note on the check "For new bicycles"
You have way to much faith in private companies. Maximizing profits at the expense of the economy isn't prudent imo. Developing new technologies will encourage a more competitive energy market rather than the monopoly the oil companies have now. Competition is another big factor that keep prices in check. Free is great but there is such a thing as too much freedom and another thing called greed. Being free to buy politians to further ones agenda/profits is bad. No good can come from greed. Also, there is proof in the form of internal memos that showed some companies were holding back refining to control prices. Do you really think the oil companies care about the average joe? No, they'll do whatever they can to keep prices high even if it means shutting down or delaying production. The market will only balance itself out when the companies controlling it feels that it should.
As for the guy that said he should be free to drive whatever the heck he wants. Well if you think taking a bigger share of the pie to get from point A to B is ok than you should be willing to pay for that priveledge as well to even things out. Why should I have to pay for it?
Another thing. People complain about taxes but Uncle Sam and the other top dogs are going to get their money no matter what. It's basically give a little here and take a little there, there's no free lunch.
This is all just my opinion/observations.
