Cryogenic intake system: general question

[biochembruin]

Hey,

So Ive read some people mention the cryogenic intake system by DEI, which sprays liquid CO2 onto the intercooler to cool it, and has a heat sink in the air intake to drop air intake temperature. You can also cool the fuel rail with it. I was wondering if anyone has installed this on a stock 03 MSP, and what are the benefits and/or problems they had with the system.

 

[PaulMP3]

i have seen this too. Sounds like a real cool idea. I wasnt aware it sprayed your intercooler too. I though it was for NA applications too.

 

[Dismagik]

This is the same type of system that Ford put on it's "concept SVT F150" this simple addition made the power output go from 385 to 500. I am not a fan of Ford but they originated this idea for a concept many years ago but never showed it.
My thought is that it makes since all around, mainly because you are making power by cooling an engine, rather than making it burn hotter.
There is my 2 cents, I am not a techno wizard, I just love cars. So take it as you want

 

[Midnight22]

wow, sounds like one hell of an idea, especially for those people who want to stay NA, since they wont have to invest in a turbo, tho for people with turbo the gains are outta here

 

[biochembruin]

here's DEI's website, if you guys are interested: http://www.designengineering.com/products.html

the only potential problem with a stock MSP i could see would be spraying CO2 on the intercooler, which is right in front of the stock intake. any thoughts?

 

[twilightprotege]

when i first saw the co2 thing, the first thing i thought would be instead of buying the bottle and all that set up, why not tap into the air cond piping and try the same sort of thing??? i thought it would be cheaper

later

 

[irr5302]

Im purchase a N tercooler from NX im install this weekend

this spray co2 to the intercooler

att IRR

350usd in summit Racing

 

[bazooka joe]

i'm not positive, but i think the co2 will be a lot colder??

 

[biochembruin]

iIf you tapped into the A/C, then youd have to run the A/C, which would decrease your gas mileage and rob your car of power. I think the CO2 would be much colder than the A/C could get.

 

[kopp0041]

I wrote these guys a few months ago asking about the system and never got a responce. I was interested in knowing what kind of hp gains we could see on an NA using the Air Intake cooler and fuel cooler. Anybody got any ideas?

 

[infrared5]

Dont waste your money on the CO2 kit, just get nitrous. At least then you are guaranteed hp and can adjust it. Even if it does cool the air, so what? Thats not gonna give you large hp gains!

 

[ddogg777]

Dont waste your money on the CO2 kit, just get nitrous. At least then you are guaranteed hp and can adjust it. Even if it does cool the air, so what? Thats not gonna give you large hp gains!

Holy cow! You need to take a thermodynamics class!! The amount of energy produced is determined by the difference in INTAKE and EXHAUST temperatures and by volume. Since F/I takes care of the volume, the only thing left is temperature! NOS burns the fuel hotter (increasing EGT) Lower you intake temp and you will have large HP gains!! REmember, whatever can make the expansion of air in the cylinder greater will increase power...class dismissed.

 

[ddogg777]

I guess I should add that a lower temperature air has a higher density than a hotter air. This is essentially what increases the expansion volume as it gets hotter. If you take a 2-liter bottle of 20 degree air and a 2-liter bottle of 100 degree air and heat them both up, I bet one of them will explode due to expansion a lot sooner than the other!

 

[ddogg777]

Now that I think about it a little more, NOS does more than just burn the fuel hotter, it also decreases the intake temperature. When you spray in NOS, it gets pretty dang cold!! It can drop your fuel mixture by like 65 degrees, this would make the fuel charge denser and increase its volumetric ouput as it burns. So there again, cooling the intake temperature is VERY IMPORTANT!

 

[ddogg777]

I think the CO2 would be much colder than the A/C could get.

I think you are wrong here. The stuff we put in A/C pumps can get draw out more heat than CO2, otherwise we would be using CO2 in our A/C units!

 

[mp3moose]

So does this have any merit in NA applications? For example the MP3 that has advanced timing and isn't No2 friendly.
Moose

 

[kopp0041]

Yes it does have implications for a NA system. Can anyone calculate the expected performance gains be dropping the intake air temp by 60%?

 

[changedman]

a bit, moose, i have mp3 with mp3 ecu and running a 50 wet shot fine at the moment, im bringing the car in friday to see what the deal was with the p5 ecu running me rich

 

[mp3moose]

cool, let me know how that goes.
Moose

 

[changedman]

will do. being cautious for now