"Mazda5 to be phased out for U.S. in 2015." - Automotive News

I once too judge products based on " name " and " country " status, but then wised up. I now judge products based on their merits, I don't care what country of origin they are from. I witnessed this first hand with guitar manufacturing. As some one has mentioned, in the 90's all Korean stuff was considered cheap. That is where many of the guitars that weren't gibsons and fenders were made at the time. Now Korean made guitars are considered nice guitars. Now everyone has moved production over to China, and the perception is that Chinese made guitars are inferior. Yet, for the last couple of years now, the Epiphone factory in China which is owned and ran by Gibson is putting out guitars that are excellent in fit, finish, and craftmanship. Those in the music industry have taken notice of Epiphones China factories rise in Quality Control, all the while, the Gibson plant in Tennessee has taken a beating in the music industry for the lack of Quality Control and decline in quality in the last few years. In the 70's Japanese guitars were considered inferior, by the 80's they were considered as good as their american equivalents, now they are collector items and go for as much or sometimes more than American made vintage guitars. Same evolution of peoples preceptions happened with cars in the last forty years. I don't care who builds it, as long as it is of good quality. It isn't like we are talking about who engineered it, we are talking about who turned the bolts and put the already engineered parts together. As long as the factory has top notch quality control the product will be fine. I remember seeing a video Ford put out in the 80's, about how they had designed and were manufacturing a transmission that had a high percentage fail rate, but that their " competitor in Japan " ( which was Mazda ) who was licensed to use their design and manufactured the same transmissions in Japan, had a very low fail rate. Upon them inspecting the Ford transmission and the Mazda transmission, they found that the quality control was so tight and precise on the transmissions from Mazda compared to the trannys from Ford. They concluded that the since the design was the same, the parts were the same, the only thing that caused the high failure rate in the Ford transmissions were the poor quality control compared to the Mazda transmissions. Point is, it is always about quality control, and anyone can practice good quality control, it isn't exclusive to only certain groups of people.

I don't disagree with anything you've said really. China build a lot of cheap garbage, but they also build all of Apple's products there, and Apple has impossibly high standards for quality and tolerances and has a lot of devices in their line up which take a great deal of precision to assemble.

My bias against vehicles built in Mexico comes from many things I've read about production problems down there from multiple manufacturers and my own experience with a Mexican built Volkswagen i bough 15 years ago. Add to that a new factory or a model which is new to an existing factory and I think you have a formula for sub par QC. So I just avoid it all together. But yes, there is also a cultural element, which I can't really ignore until car assembly is truly 100% automated. It's not so much that there is anything wrong with people from other countries, as much as it is I think the Japanese are particularly fastidious. It's not a fluke that Japan builds the most reliable cars in the world, a big part of that has to do with the Japanese culture and work ethic, so yeah, that's the guy i want building my car. Good is good, but why settle for good when you can have the best?
 
Has this story about the phase out of the 5 in 2015 been reported anywhere else?

Yes, like he said, try Google. I have seen it reported multiple places. Enough that I'm pretty convinced it is true...and believe me I don't want it to be true so I'd be looking for any reason to discredit this.

Here are two I found, but I've heard it at least 5 or 6 different places:

http://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/tag/mazda5-discontinued

http://www.leftlanenews.com/report-mazda5-to-be-discontinued.html

Another thing I noticed, I saw a new Mazda commercial the other day and they were talking about their great line up etc, it wasn't about one specific car... but the Mazda 5 was conspicuously absent. They showed EVERY car up there, including the Miata and the Cx-7, both of which are about to be updated, so it's not about that. The fact they didn't even acknowledge the 5 is pretty damning IMO. :(
 
Yes, like he said, try Google. I have seen it reported multiple places. Enough that I'm pretty convinced it is true...and believe me I don't want it to be true so I'd be looking for any reason to discredit this.


It's true, I've known for about a year but couldn't say anything.


.
 
Yup, I have. I had a Volkswagen Jetta....

Well there was the problem....

..... that was built in Mexico. The driver side door kept LOOSENING itself because the bolts holding it on where somehow not attached properly. I had to keep tightening it back on with a socket wrench.

That was my first and last Mexican car.

If it loosened up more than once, it was likely a design issue, not manufacturing. If the bolts were not attached properly by an "errant Mexican", it wouldn't have loosened up again after YOU fixed it


My bias against vehicles built in Mexico comes from many things I've read about production problems down there from multiple manufacturers and my own experience with a Mexican built Volkswagen i bough 15 years ago.


So 15 YEARS AGO you had ONE car (and a Volkswagen no less) with issues and read a few things [on the internet?] so you jumped to a conclusion about all cars made in Mexico and the people who work in the plants?...... (screwy)


It's not so much that there is anything wrong with people from other countries, as much as it is I think the Japanese are particularly fastidious. It's not a fluke that Japan builds the most reliable cars in the world, a big part of that has to do with the Japanese culture and work ethic, so yeah, that's the guy i want building my car.

Again, that has more to do with design and management than the people actually bolting the bits together. If you've been to a factory you would know that each person is basically assigned 1-3 or so tasks, most of which are simplified so they can't screw it up. For example, if they are bolting something on, they are using an air wrench that is set exactly to the torque settings that are needed, and there is only a few bolts that they are dealing with, there is really no thinking involved. Each person really only has about a 30 second task before the car moves on to the next station.
While it may be true about the Japanese culture and work ethic, the people working on the line aren't really doing anything that complicated that it would make a difference. The real difference would be made higher up the "food chain" and that kind of stuff gets shared with other plants owned by the manufacturer.
Most issues with cars have more to do with the design and/or the parts suppliers than the actual people putting them together. As a matter of fact, the plant I was at had engineers on site to redesign stuff as problems with the original design get discovered along they way.
 
Well there was the problem....



If it loosened up more than once, it was likely a design issue, not manufacturing. If the bolts were not attached properly by an "errant Mexican", it wouldn't have loosened up again after YOU fixed it





So 15 YEARS AGO you had ONE car (and a Volkswagen no less) with issues and read a few things [on the internet?] so you jumped to a conclusion about all cars made in Mexico and the people who work in the plants?...... (screwy)




Again, that has more to do with design and management than the people actually bolting the bits together. If you've been to a factory you would know that each person is basically assigned 1-3 or so tasks, most of which are simplified so they can't screw it up. For example, if they are bolting something on, they are using an air wrench that is set exactly to the torque settings that are needed, and there is only a few bolts that they are dealing with, there is really no thinking involved. Each person really only has about a 30 second task before the car moves on to the next station.
While it may be true about the Japanese culture and work ethic, the people working on the line aren't really doing anything that complicated that it would make a difference. The real difference would be made higher up the "food chain" and that kind of stuff gets shared with other plants owned by the manufacturer.
Most issues with cars have more to do with the design and/or the parts suppliers than the actual people putting them together. As a matter of fact, the plant I was at had engineers on site to redesign stuff as problems with the original design get discovered along they way.
Amen Mopho! Unfortunately ignorance most times is unfixable. Yes socialcarpet, kudos to you that you finally bought an MZ5 after 9 years of them being in production, kudos to you that it is made in Japan and kudos to you that you get to sleep at night knowing these things... (headshake
 
I love mopho. Everytime I read his posts (for years on another forum), I always yell at the monitor and go "thats right MUTHA FUKA" even though I know that is not what mopho means :D

My mothers rapists cousins illegimate son in Alabama had a Chrylser Leberon. I read about it in a letter in 1987 that it was unreliable. Doesn't that make all American cars unreliable?

The irony to AliBab and his socialmagiccarpet, is that he bought a MZ5 as his "reliable" Japanese car.

Mazda 5 is a reliable car, yes, but it isn't the example one would use for the ULTIMATE in Japanese reliability given the issues it has, in its 9 years in existence.

You want to tout japanese reliablity, buy a Lexus LS, and then talk $hit about messicans.

Of course Magic carpets retort will be "oh wait Lexus LS doesn't come in a manual trans"

I will have to say, Messican women are great in bed. (Since everybody is talking bad about Messicans)
 
Not everyone just The Social Magic Carpet Ride" maybe we should create a new thread just for him. "The Social Magic Carpet Ride all things Japanese thread" LMFAO!

Like most people in FL, guy couldn't find Japan, if I handed him a map of the world with Japan being the only country.

He probably thinks Hello Kitty is a real animal, and all the workers at the MZ5 factory are as fastidious as the GT-R and the LFA factory.

Since we are stereotyping, what about all the dumbasses that live in FL?
 
Well there was the problem....



If it loosened up more than once, it was likely a design issue, not manufacturing. If the bolts were not attached properly by an "errant Mexican", it wouldn't have loosened up again after YOU fixed it





So 15 YEARS AGO you had ONE car (and a Volkswagen no less) with issues and read a few things [on the internet?] so you jumped to a conclusion about all cars made in Mexico and the people who work in the plants?...... (screwy)




Again, that has more to do with design and management than the people actually bolting the bits together. If you've been to a factory you would know that each person is basically assigned 1-3 or so tasks, most of which are simplified so they can't screw it up. For example, if they are bolting something on, they are using an air wrench that is set exactly to the torque settings that are needed, and there is only a few bolts that they are dealing with, there is really no thinking involved. Each person really only has about a 30 second task before the car moves on to the next station.
While it may be true about the Japanese culture and work ethic, the people working on the line aren't really doing anything that complicated that it would make a difference. The real difference would be made higher up the "food chain" and that kind of stuff gets shared with other plants owned by the manufacturer.
Most issues with cars have more to do with the design and/or the parts suppliers than the actual people putting them together. As a matter of fact, the plant I was at had engineers on site to redesign stuff as problems with the original design get discovered along they way.

I'll actually admit that my opinion may be irrational here. I did before actually. I'm not sure if you guys have noticed, but I'm not trying to convince anyone. I believe that Mexico turns out tens of thousands of cars every year that are as good as or close enough to as good as anything else. If they didn't, we would have heard about it by now.

I just like my Japanese car to be made in Japan. Call it a novelty. If I buy a German car, I want it made in Germany too. Most of this stuff is automated now anyway and I'm sure the machines don't know what country they are in. I know none of it matters all that much and Mexico is not turning out atrociously unreliable cars. If I didn't make that clear, then that's my fault.

All I'm really saying is, I don't care. I want my car built in Japan because I like the idea of it and because I still believe there is that 1% of difference there that does come from having an neurotic, perfectionist Japanese guy install the seat tracks in my car. I like that idea. I like that my car is Japanese and was made in Japan. If I buy feta cheese, I'd like feta from Greece, not Kenya. Kenya may make some fantastic feta cheese, but feta cheese is Greek and I want Greek feta cheese.

I'm sorry I opened my mouth about all of this though. Clearly an error in judgement and I got myself off on a bad foot here and hurt some feelings and for that I apologize. I still don't want a car made in Mexico, I think I deserve to expect my Japanese car be authentically Japanese and I get to vote with my wallet, so I do. I wouldn't rule out buying a car built in Mexico again though if it's a car I want. I would just really prefer it be built in it's country of origin. By the way, this applies to American cars too. If I were ever to buy one (I never have) I would insist on buying one built in the U.S. by a union worker. Right or wrong, part of the enjoyment of owning the car, for me, would come from knowing it helped provide an American with a job that pays a decent middle class wage.

There is a moral argument against buying Mexican cars too that we haven't really broached. Cars are built there so companies can exploit cheap labor, weak labor laws and unions and lax environmental regulations. Period. They aren't building them there because Mexico has the perfect climate for car building or because all the natural resources they need to built the car are 10 miles from the plant. They are built there plain and simple because they can pay people $3 an hour there, fire them if they strike for a 40 hour work week or healthcare or safety helmets and they can dump solvents and untreated waste in the streams behind their plants to save money.

But I digress... I'm opening the can of worms wider again. Forget I said anything. Mexico is a paradise where the worlds finest craftsmen build cars by hand and all workers are well paid and happy and enjoy generous pensions.
 
Like most people in FL, guy couldn't find Japan, if I handed him a map of the world with Japan being the only country.

He probably thinks Hello Kitty is a real animal, and all the workers at the MZ5 factory are as fastidious as the GT-R and the LFA factory.

Since we are stereotyping, what about all the dumbasses that live in FL?

I've probably been to more countries in my life than you have. But I do agree Florida is full of dumbasses, you'll get no argument from me on that. I'm not a native though. Haha.
 
I love mopho. Everytime I read his posts (for years on another forum), I always yell at the monitor and go "thats right MUTHA FUKA" even though I know that is not what mopho means :D

My mothers rapists cousins illegimate son in Alabama had a Chrylser Leberon. I read about it in a letter in 1987 that it was unreliable. Doesn't that make all American cars unreliable?

The irony to AliBab and his socialmagiccarpet, is that he bought a MZ5 as his "reliable" Japanese car.

Mazda 5 is a reliable car, yes, but it isn't the example one would use for the ULTIMATE in Japanese reliability given the issues it has, in its 9 years in existence.

You want to tout japanese reliablity, buy a Lexus LS, and then talk $hit about messicans.

Of course Magic carpets retort will be "oh wait Lexus LS doesn't come in a manual trans"

I will have to say, Messican women are great in bed. (Since everybody is talking bad about Messicans)



You've got me pretty well figured out, yes. Haha

A manual Lexus LS would be great though wouldn't it? Come on!

By the way, I wouldn't touch a chile relleno from Japan, for what it's worth. I'm sure it would be terrible.
 
I've probably been to more countries in my life than you have. But I do agree Florida is full of dumbasses, you'll get no argument from me on that. I'm not a native though. Haha.
You may have been to more countries than me but your level of ignorance clearly states otherwise.

I have only been to 59 countries. 3 passports full.


But I have had more Messican pu$$y than you, and compared to the japanese Pu$$y I had in Tokyo, the quality of hte Messican mamasitas were better.

The Japanese pu$$y felt automated.
 
Is U.S. MY2014 the last year or U.S. MY2015?

I'm 95% sure the 2014 is the end of the line. :(

Oh what could have been though...

Here's a heartbreaking pic of what could have been. Imagine this with the 185 hp 2.5 liter Skyactiv engine... Damn it Mazda.

xmaJU4f.jpg
 
You may have been to more countries than me but your level of ignorance clearly states otherwise.

I have only been to 59 countries. 3 passports full.


But I have had more Messican pu$$y than you, and compared to the japanese Pu$$y I had in Tokyo, the quality of hte Messican mamasitas were better.

The Japanese pu$$y felt automated.

That's fantastic. Go get yourself some penicillin and lets move on, m'kay?
 
I'm 95% sure the 2014 is the end of the line. :(

Oh what could have been though...

Here's a heartbreaking pic of what could have been. Imagine this with the 185 hp 2.5 liter Skyactiv engine... Damn it Mazda.


That is lovely, but with no sliding door it's just another wagon


.
 

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