Mazda tranny fluid

[markuszoom5]

So it has been about 1,500 miles since my tranny flush and there is no change in fluid color or smell, so I am assuming that my tranny is in good shape at 37,500 miles. However, my only conclusion is that the fluid they put in the car in the factory must be really cheap garbage. I wonder if the mazda fluid at the dealer has become slightly better since 2009 (that is when my 2010 was made) and whether it will hold up longer, but we shall see. The old fluid was technically 4 years old, because the car sat on he lot for a year and then I had it for 3'years.

 

[phunky.buddha]

Sitting still for most of a year probably didn't help. Maybe ask the dealer what fluid they use? Talk to the service guys in the back- they know way more than the people running the operation up front. I assume you're automatic?

 

[markuszoom5]

Sitting still for most of a year probably didn't help. Maybe ask the dealer what fluid they use? Talk to the service guys in the back- they know way more than the people running the operation up front. I assume you're automatic?

Oh yea definitely auto, dirtiest fluid ever seen, and I owned GM products before. I wish I got a 5 speed, would have not had to touch until 60 k miles. I had a Jetta manual and the brake fluid was shared with the clutch. Did not touch it until 40 k...and it was cheap...

 

[brandini]

It's not cheap garbage it's called 'break-in'. All the wear parts will break in causing small metal particles to circulate and get caught in the filter. Then as they sit (and sit for a year) your fluid is fighting corrosion by sacrificing additives over that time.

It's normal.

 

[markuszoom5]

It's not cheap garbage it's called 'break-in'. All the wear parts will break in causing small metal particles to circulate and get caught in the filter. Then as they sit (and sit for a year) your fluid is fighting corrosion by sacrificing additives over that time.

It's normal.

Well that's good to know, now with the new fluid I can rest assured that my tranny has protection for another 30k or more...$189 for a flush is way cheaper than a $3500 transmission rebuild, which can never be the same again

 

[Silentnoise713]

It's not cheap garbage it's called 'break-in'. All the wear parts will break in causing small metal particles to circulate and get caught in the filter. Then as they sit (and sit for a year) your fluid is fighting corrosion by sacrificing additives over that time.

It's normal.

This would be true IF the same conditions apply to other manufacturers. It doesn’t so I’m inclined to disagree. I'm also willing to bet the car didn't actually sit idle for a year. Unless the car was locked up and hidden in a shed, someone must have test driven it within that time.

Fluids are suppose to have anti corrosion agents (it is used in a metallic environment) as well as other active agents (detergents, heat resistance, etc). The level of these ingredients is what separates the good/bad/ugly. If you are saying sitting a year means the additives are already inactive, then isn’t that a condition for “cheap” fluid?

 

[brandini]

This would be true IF the same conditions apply to other manufacturers. It doesn’t so I’m inclined to disagree. I'm also willing to bet the car didn't actually sit idle for a year. Unless the car was locked up and hidden in a shed, someone must have test driven it within that time.

Fluids are suppose to have anti corrosion agents (it is used in a metallic environment) as well as other active agents (detergents, heat resistance, etc). The level of these ingredients is what separates the good/bad/ugly. If you are saying sitting a year means the additives are already inactive, then isn’t that a condition for “cheap” fluid?

It's a 2010 with 37k miles and the factory interval is 30k and you think the fluid is crap? It's designed to go the distance until you drain it, and doesn't need to go longer- because you're throwing it away.

 

[kw_da]

It's a 2010 with 37k miles and the factory interval is 30k and you think the fluid is crap? It's designed to go the distance until you drain it, and doesn't need to go longer- because you're throwing it away.

Does Mazda now recommend ATF changes? On my 2006, ATF it was suppose to be "lifetime", which actually turned about to be only about 20k miles :-(.

 

[Silentnoise713]

It's a 2010 with 37k miles and the factory interval is 30k and you think the fluid is crap? It's designed to go the distance until you drain it, and doesn't need to go longer- because you're throwing it away.

I'm not quite sure what you are trying to say there. My point is that your argument on why the OE fluid is 'not' cheap does not stand ground.

Can you point me to the source where it states 30k interval? When did Mazda move away from lifelong? That would be good to know and should be made clear for future reference. I do think 30k interval is short for OE fluid to be considerde quality but I would not have a problem with it -as long as Mazda gives us the warning.

 

[Davicho]

Seriously this tranny fluid threads and arguments get very old. Listen guys, before owning Mazdas I've owned Hondas and they recommended drain and refill on auto trans every 15k miles. So I've stuck to that all other vehicles I've owned and never had a problem. It's ~$20 and little of my time to this every 15k miles and it keeps the fluid fairly clean and new plus it's peace of mind for a longer lasting tranny. So it doesn't matter whether you use Mazdas fluid or you want to dish out $30 a quart for your "premium" fluid as long as you stick to a drain and refill regimen every 15k miles I am almost certain that you will prolong the life of your tranny. PEACE!

 

[markuszoom5]

However, lets beat it to death...

Seriously this tranny fluid threads and arguments get very old. Listen guys, before owning Mazdas I've owned Hondas and they recommended drain and refill on auto trans every 15k miles. So I've stuck to that all other vehicles I've owned and never had a problem. It's ~$20 and little of my time to this every 15k miles and it keeps the fluid fairly clean and new plus it's peace of mind for a longer lasting tranny. So it doesn't matter whether you use Mazdas fluid or you want to dish out $30 a quart for your "premium" fluid as long as you stick to a drain and refill regimen every 15k miles I am almost certain that you will prolong the life of your tranny. PEACE!

See the problem is that if you want to have a "blank slate" when it comes to tranny fluid, you have to do a $200 flush. My fluid was so black and nasty, I have never seen a smellier and blacker fluid after 36k. This was rediculous. So why can all other cars have normal smelling red fluid at 40 k and this is the first car that has crap fluid after this mileage. Is the tranny too weak and working hard, or is the fluid crap? We will see @ 65 k, I will definitely report to this forum if I still have the car.

 

[Silentnoise713]

I say we all plea ignorance and don't change the ATF. Once things start breaking, everyone complains to NHTSA and strong arm Mazda to issue a recall. Free tranny's for all!!

For the record, I don't think the M-V/FRN5 fluid is garbage though I would not conciously pay for it. I don't think it is formulated to last as long as Mazda advertises or maybe they accidentally left out the ATF maintenace interval. This is like the Dino vs synthetic debate. Frequent changes of the cheaper stuff works just as welll and both are perfectly capable of doing the job. This is compounded by Mazda not advising when this needs maintenance... I think this is the root of the problem, not so much on the oil itself. We are left with guessing.

 

[SonicBoy]

How about we change directions with this thread? (Let's not fight about changing the fluid. We all know that we should at some point)

Is there a "How to" write up on how to change the transmission fluid? (The one in the How to section here does not answer the question)

Is there a drain plug and or a screen, gasket to change in the process?

How about a magnet inside to collect the filings. Is there one from the factory like some other cars have?

Anyone done one of these themselves?

Thanks

 

[Silentnoise713]

We are having a healthy debate since no one here is a Mazda engineer or chemist to make any official claims. Best thing we have is apply what we know and see if we can build some sort of reasonable conclusion. We don't (and shouldn't) always agree just for the sake of agreeing.

Here's some background. It was not intended to be a step-by-step how-to.
http://www.mazdas247.com/forum/show...-on-the-Mz5!&p=6166067&viewfull=1#post6166067

 

[SonicBoy]

Thanks Silentnoise713.

I was surprised you were not using Mazda OE parts but one from a focus. ( I know most of the parts are identical)

 

[markuszoom5]

We are having a healthy debate since no one here is a Mazda engineer or chemist to make any official claims. Best thing we have is apply what we know and see if we can build some sort of reasonable conclusion. We don't (and shouldn't) always agree just for the sake of agreeing.

Here's some background. It was not intended to be a step-by-step how-to.
http://www.mazdas247.com/forum/show...-on-the-Mz5!&p=6166067&viewfull=1#post6166067

You basically expressed verbally, what I thought the whole time but could not formulate it the way you did.Others with fluid drains/flushes and I will be the historic data that will provide the truth regarding if the tranny is crap, if the fluid is crap, or lack of maintenance is at fault. I hate when people whine online: "I hate Mazda, worst car ever, bought it used @ 60k and after 10 k the tranny failed, and AT light came on," Well first of all, I hate used cars, and second of all the first thing I would do is tell the dealer I will buy a car, but first dump all the fluid out and flush it, so that I can see if the tranny is good, and if it fails then they might have to replace it for me. Well people that complain about a used Mazda, I can say that we don't know what it went through. I for example had a 2006 Jetta that I bought brand new but it was an electrical nightmare from the beginning. It never stopped driving, but it also never worked right.

 

[Robotazky]

I don't believe that Honda ever said to change tranny fluid every 15K miles. Not at all.

My Redline fluid that I drained and filled just twice looks great after 5-7K.

 

[brandini]

In my 07 Mazda6 owner's manual it said flush at 30k so I did. The 5 has the same trans so if they changed to 'lifetime fill' you need to ask why... probably cost of ownership numbers.

Now that I download the manual it looks like it's no longer there... hmmm.

Maybe they changed it and backdated it since they were lasting so long...

Maybe you're just really hard on your transmissions?

It's a heavy body on a powertrain made for less weight and you are in NY so cold temps mean you need to go REALLY EASY until your engine temp needle is at fully warm and you get fully hot heat blowing. I also don't drive the car until the RPMs start dropping from the cold-start mode and 2k-1500rpm idle.

I flushed mine with AMSOIL ATF (way overkill, now it's signature series and they have a less expensive OE) and the first shift in 20F weather was VASTLY less harsh and the transmission seemed to warm up much faster on the morning commute and shift better before being fully warm. Then at 60k the next flush the dealer added BG crap to the fluid and the old usual sluggishness was back. I was PO-ed but ended up selling the car for something more fun.

On cold days my process was:
turn temp to fully hot, fan off, outside air, all on feet or feet + defrost
Start car, wait for RPMs to start dropping to 1250rpm then drive
Stay under 2k rpm until temp needle started moving
Then turn fan on to '1'
When temp needle reaches fully warm move fan up to 3 (heated better than 4)
Then when heat got to point where it was crazy hot you can drive as you wish

That car was great: http://www.fuelly.com/driver/brandonrossl/6

 

[Silentnoise713]

I don't believe that Honda ever said to change tranny fluid every 15K miles. Not at all.

My Redline fluid that I drained and filled just twice looks great after 5-7K.

Ditto that. I’d like to know where the 15K maintenance came from b/c I’ve never heard of it. Had a ’97 Civic EX auto and brother had an ’00 V6 Accord LX auto till just about two months ago (the infamous V6 model line with the high rate of auto failures due to too…. transmission fluid! exactly the same as we are discussing now where it is poor or not enough maintenance advised. No issues with the manuals); both purchased new BTW. Co-workers TL’s also had the same problem and Honda ultimately issue a TSB (I don’t think it was a full recall but I might be wrong) and many got free replacement transmission or repairs/service. I know b/c I looked it up for my brother. I wasn’t kidding when I say let’s strong arm Mazda into a recall but do admit this is ASSuming worst case.

In my 07 Mazda6 owner's manual it said flush at 30k so I did. The 5 has the same trans so if they changed to 'lifetime fill' you need to ask why... probably cost of ownership numbers.

Now that I download the manual it looks like it's no longer there... hmmm.

Maybe they changed it and backdated it since they were lasting so long...

Maybe you're just really hard on your transmissions?

It's a heavy body on a powertrain made for less weight and you are in NY so cold temps mean you need to go REALLY EASY until your engine temp needle is at fully warm and you get fully hot heat blowing. I also don't drive the car until the RPMs start dropping from the cold-start mode and 2k-1500rpm idle.

I flushed mine with AMSOIL ATF (way overkill, now it's signature series and they have a less expensive OE) and the first shift in 20F weather was VASTLY less harsh and the transmission seemed to warm up much faster on the morning commute and shift better before being fully warm. Then at 60k the next flush the dealer added BG crap to the fluid and the old usual sluggishness was back. I was PO-ed but ended up selling the car for something more fun.

On cold days my process was:
turn temp to fully hot, fan off, outside air, all on feet or feet + defrost
Start car, wait for RPMs to start dropping to 1250rpm then drive
Stay under 2k rpm until temp needle started moving
Then turn fan on to '1'
When temp needle reaches fully warm move fan up to 3 (heated better than 4)
Then when heat got to point where it was crazy hot you can drive as you wish

That car was great: http://www.fuelly.com/driver/brandonrossl/6

Hopefully you can see where the frustration comes from. Keep in mind the average car own doesn’t know much about this stuff and goes by the book.

Some points for clarification.
-I believe the ’07 Mz6 is the 4sp auto (same as the ’06-’07 Mz5), not the revised 5 sp auto used in the ’08 and up Mz5.
-Agree Amsoil is the bees knees but we are a frugal bunch. Come’on, we drive Mz5 and not decked out Oddys/Siennas and are always looking for cheap alternatives. I did use Amsoil in my flush and it was almost $100 for 8 bottles…
-Not sure if you are aware but idling your car warms up the engine temp first and foremost, everything else is a byproduct and takes longer. Think about what goes on and how things get warm. The engine needs combustion to run, which in turn builds heat, which warms the motor oil AND coolant (in turn keeps the temp in check). The auto has an oil cooler where the ATF oil passes through the cooler. The ATF oil cooler’s primary purpose is to bring fluid temp up using the coolant, which the engine made warm, secondary purpose is to keep ATF temp stable. The transmission pump pushes the fluid through even though the car is in Parked (I went through all of the gears when I flushed mine). On really cold days, even if you have idled long enough for cabin temp to be warm, you still need to take the first few miles easily b/c the mechanical components of the transmissions (and differential if applicable) are sitting idle during warm-up. Read up on the topic of warm up and you’ll find that with the modern engine there’s really no need to warm up (other then to make the cabin comfy) b/c the car itself hasn’t really warmed up. I let it sit for ~1-3 min and drive the first few miles gingerly. Long warm-up end up wasting gas (high RPM b/c ECU and knock sensor telling it to dump a lot of gas to bring it up to temp) and polluting.


Back to Mz5 OE transmission fluid. I wish someone (must be the original owner) would send a sample of the OE fluid to Blackstone labs for an oil analysis. This would give us the scientific evidence we need...

 

[Vasy]

Back to Mz5 OE transmission fluid. I wish someone (must be the original owner) would send a sample of the OE fluid to Blackstone labs for an oil analysis. This would give us the scientific evidence we need...

Sorry, I flushed mine to https://www.amazon.com (commissions earned) a few month back.