clutch slipping?!!!

[krausean]

Ok, here's a short story first of all.
I had a rod bearing go on my p5 so i decided i should tear the whole engine out of the car and replace the main bearings as well. I had to remove the transmission in order to get the main bearing support plate off. Anyway, long story short everything went back together fine and the engine runs great but i'm having an issue with my clutch slipping SEVERELY! When the car is running the clutch pedal is very easy to push most of the way and then it gets firm as it should for the last inch or so. When it is not running it feels good almost all the way through the movement of the pedal. There's a bit of sloppiness at the beginning of the stroke. The hydraulic piston in the engine bay moves fine and does not need bleeding as it was never taken apart only removed.
Here's a basic list of what I did when i put the clutch back together:
Installed flywheel on crankshaft and torqued down.
used clutch alignment tool and installed clutch plate and pressure plate and torqued down. Installed transmission onto block.
I hope I didn't miss anything. Please ask if I did!

Thanks a pile in advance!!!

 

[Maxx Mazda]

How was the rear main seal? Did you grease the sealing surface around the crank? I've seen it a hundred times, people dont grease it, and leave it dry. First startup the crank burns out the seal, and engine oil leaks into the bellhousing all over the clutch causing it to slip.

 

[nate0123]

Ok, here's a short story first of all.
I had a rod bearing go on my p5 so i decided i should tear the whole engine out of the car and replace the main bearings as well. I had to remove the transmission in order to get the main bearing support plate off. Anyway, long story short everything went back together fine and the engine runs great but i'm having an issue with my clutch slipping SEVERELY! When the car is running the clutch pedal is very easy to push most of the way and then it gets firm as it should for the last inch or so. When it is not running it feels good almost all the way through the movement of the pedal. There's a bit of sloppiness at the beginning of the stroke. The hydraulic piston in the engine bay moves fine and does not need bleeding as it was never taken apart only removed.
Here's a basic list of what I did when i put the clutch back together:
Installed flywheel on crankshaft and torqued down.
used clutch alignment tool and installed clutch plate and pressure plate and torqued down. Installed transmission onto block.
I hope I didn't miss anything. Please ask if I did!

Thanks a pile in advance!!!

Does it get better if you pump the clutch a few times?

Sounds like you have air in the hydraulics and probably just need to bleed the system.

 

[krausean]

How was the rear main seal? Did you grease the sealing surface around the crank? I've seen it a hundred times, people dont grease it, and leave it dry. First startup the crank burns out the seal, and engine oil leaks into the bellhousing all over the clutch causing it to slip.

Oh crap! I did replace the seal but didn't grease it! I guess you've just solved my problem. So back to tearing apart i go.

Really appreciate the help.

 

[Maxx Mazda]

Oh crap! I did replace the seal but didn't grease it! I guess you've just solved my problem. So back to tearing apart i go.

Really appreciate the help.

I'm not saying that's the problem for sure but it does happen alot.

 

[krausean]

I'm not saying that's the problem for sure but it does happen alot.

That does sound like it could be it. The only thing i wonder about is why my clutch feels so mushy when the car is running and it feels mostly fine when it's not running. There shouldn't be any need to bleed the clutch lines as i never disassembled them. I guess i'll find out what's up when i take the whole thing apart again.

I would imagine it would be easiest to remove the entire engine/tranny again.

 

[nate0123]

Wouldn't it be easier to try bleeding the system before taking everything apart?

 

[dacquesta1]

That. s u c k s

 

[nate0123]

Can I ask a dumb question? You say your clutch is slipping severely, and then go on to talk about how the pedal feels. Just want to make sure I understand the symptoms. Is your clutch slipping to where you engage the clutch in gear and rev the engine, but the car does not move forward? It's like the car not being in gear when it actually is.

Sorry for asking what might seem like an obvious question. It just occured to me that you hadn't actually described the symptoms of a slipping clutch. Just a loose feeling clutch pedal.

The symptoms you described = air in the system. Slipping clutch = different problem.

 

[Maxx Mazda]

You would have had to remove the clutch line to get the tranny off, so i dont know why you'd say that you wouldnt need to bleed it...

 

[dacquesta1]

I never had to remove it....just unbolt the slave cylinder

 

[krausean]

You would have had to remove the clutch line to get the tranny off, so i dont know why you'd say that you wouldnt need to bleed it...

As stated i just had to unbolt the slave cylinder so no bleeding should be necessary i'd think. But nevertheless i tried to bleed the system and still the results are the same.

I apologize for the confusion i'm causing. There are two problems.
1. When the engine is running the clutch is soft almost all the way to the floor but when it's stopped it feels good most of the way with a little (1/2 inch) sloppiness at the beginning of the stroke which is normal i think.
Another observation i made was that when the clutch pedal is pushed the slave cylinder moves in sync with the pedal so i'm assuming that the system is bled correctly. Does this make sense?

2. The clutch is slipping when released completely. It has some very minor grip, just enough to move the car but not to drive with any kind of power applied. I'm going to assume this is because i burnt the main seal out and there's half a gallon of oil in my bell housing...:mad:

I don't know how these 2 problems could have anything to do with each other because oil on the clutch should not mean a squishy clutch.

Thank you for your patience everyone!

 

[krausean]

If the system was not bled properly it would not cause the clutch to slip but it would not completely disengage the clutch which means i wouldn't be able to put the car in gear right?

 

[nate0123]

If the system was not bled properly it would not cause the clutch to slip but it would not completely disengage the clutch which means i wouldn't be able to put the car in gear right?

Depending how much air was in the system, you'd probably still be able to drive the car, shift, etc. but the engagement/disengagement point would be a lot lower to the floor and there'd be a lot of slop at the top end.

But you're right, it wouldn't cause the clutch to slip.

 

[Maxx Mazda]

Yup. Main seal is my bet.

 

[krausean]

Depending how much air was in the system, you'd probably still be able to drive the car, shift, etc. but the engagement/disengagement point would be a lot lower to the floor and there'd be a lot of slop at the top end.

But you're right, it wouldn't cause the clutch to slip.

My guess is that the two problems have nothing to do with each other. I simply have 2 different problems to fix.

Actually if I remember correctly the engagement point was higher up in the stroke of the clutch pedal. But that could be a misconception since it may have Simply not been grabbing from the oil on the clutch.

I will find out once the whole thing is apart. I'll be starting the teardown this afternoon.

 

[nate0123]

Good luck (nailbyt)

 

[dacquesta1]

Hope it was a cheap clutch...no good now if it was the rear main seal

 

[krausean]

Hope it was a cheap clutch...no good now if it was the rear main seal

hehe, yeah it was cheap...i never changed it, thought about it but couldn't afford it...probly a good thing now...lol...i guess now i'll HAVE to be able to afford it.(sadbanana).

I don't really have a lot of time to get something shipped (i live in Canada..eh) so i'm just gonna go for a stock one i think. Napa has a kit for like $270 i think. Sounds reasonable i guess.

Thanks again for everyone's help on this. I'll try to remember to let you guys know how things go/went.

 

[dacquesta1]

whoa whoa whoa, sorry dude but oem for 270? no way. if your going oem go with rockauto. you can get it for like 150. if your gonna spend 270 put out the extra 50 and get a spec stage 2