Pics of Falken 452's
- Thread starter Circle9
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Mine are 235/40, but might give you a bit of comparison. They're mounted on 18x8+48mm Rota P1s. Stock suspension. FWIW, I didn't like this wheel/tire combo at all, it really exacerbated a lot of handling issues. Then again, others have had the same setup without issues.
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They're decent in the rain but not that great in they dry. When I had them on my WRX, they didn't give a lot of confidence at higher speeds and/or in bigger turns where they'd flex and give a lot. They just didn't have that "solid" feeling I had with the Azenis.
I've come to learn that a tire can have a huge effect on a car. When a car is being developed, the tires play a very important role in tuning the suspension. As a result, changing the tire can change the behavior of the car beyond affecting just grip. I don't know what it is, but some tires just don't agree with a car's set-up. They can create new failure modes or make others worse.
For instance, my car tends to get twitchy over rough pavement - I think that's pretty common with MS3s. If there's anything but smooth asphalt under the front tires when boost builds, the car gets unruly and difficult to control. This was made much worse by the 8" wheels and 452s. Boosting over a patch in the road could literally snap the wheel 30 degrees from center and throw the whole car off balance, which was very unnerving.
They also followed ruts in the road worse - a problem called tramlining. This made me fight the wheel on the freeway and was especially bad when braking at rutted intersections.
Impact harshness when through the roof, stuff like frost heaves would crash through the whole car and it felt like there was no suspension at all.
As for rubbing, no they didn't. Was about the only thing they did right!
For instance, my car tends to get twitchy over rough pavement - I think that's pretty common with MS3s. If there's anything but smooth asphalt under the front tires when boost builds, the car gets unruly and difficult to control. This was made much worse by the 8" wheels and 452s. Boosting over a patch in the road could literally snap the wheel 30 degrees from center and throw the whole car off balance, which was very unnerving.
They also followed ruts in the road worse - a problem called tramlining. This made me fight the wheel on the freeway and was especially bad when braking at rutted intersections.
Impact harshness when through the roof, stuff like frost heaves would crash through the whole car and it felt like there was no suspension at all.
As for rubbing, no they didn't. Was about the only thing they did right!
Sorry for the double post.
A co-worker (vehicle dynamics engineer) told me something interesting the other day. He said that a tire acts like a spring and absorbs bumps (we all know this). However, it doesn't act like a damper, so impacts are bouncy and harsh. A tall sidewall or low pressure makes a tire softer. A tire that reacts to impacts differently than stock really needs an appropriate change in damping to offset it.
At the time we were talking about my snow tires in particular, but I wonder if the 452 might have a relatively soft sidewall. I wouldn't think this is the case because it has a reinforced sidewall, but maybe it's softer than the Potenza's.
FWIW, the vehicle dynamics guys I work with think the RE050A is a fine tire. I plan to keep them.
A co-worker (vehicle dynamics engineer) told me something interesting the other day. He said that a tire acts like a spring and absorbs bumps (we all know this). However, it doesn't act like a damper, so impacts are bouncy and harsh. A tall sidewall or low pressure makes a tire softer. A tire that reacts to impacts differently than stock really needs an appropriate change in damping to offset it.
At the time we were talking about my snow tires in particular, but I wonder if the 452 might have a relatively soft sidewall. I wouldn't think this is the case because it has a reinforced sidewall, but maybe it's softer than the Potenza's.
FWIW, the vehicle dynamics guys I work with think the RE050A is a fine tire. I plan to keep them.
Cool man. I've talked to several guys on here that run 452's and it doesn't seem like they've had any issues like I have. I'm not saying it's a bad tire, just describing my experience.
Are you gonna mount them up as soon as you get them? Please let us know your impressions. Are you mounting on your stock wheel?
way to be constructive, guy. (scratch)
7mileshome
Member
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- Mazdaspeed3
Thank you for this post. These exact things are what I have been fighting with for 6 months now. This finally gives me a good explanation why I was feeling, "this set up is not right."
This is what I had....
Tenzo Type-M 18X8 with a 45et.
Now, alot of people are running this wheel (or were running it).
BF Goodrich G-force KDW 2
225-45-18 (same size the OP has purchased)
Many people said that this tire is too tall, and it would not work. In some ways they were right. The worst part about this set up was that it threw my Tachometer and Speedometer off (about 200 RPM and 3-4MPH respectively). I honestly felt that the handeling and over all charicteristics of the car were much better on the stock set up.
So, I took those off, put the stock wheels and tires back on, and I was content again.
Few months went by and I decided to try the same wheels with a different tire. This time it was RIken (a tire made by BF goodrich), 225-40-18.
Again, this set up does not work with my car.
I would just stick with the stock wheels and tires (which I will probably end up doing in the future), but I am challeged by this.
I am getting the Mazdaspeed Rays, (hopefully soon) bacarl (or anyone), can you give me a suggestion for tires? The wheels are 18x7.5 with a 50 offset.
7mileshome
Member
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- Mazdaspeed3
Another thing I should add is that I have the Mazdaspeed Coilovers.
Wastegate13
Member
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- 08.5 CWP MS3 GT
I've used the OEM Potenzas on the stock wheels, 18x8 48et Rotas, and 18x7.5 52et MS RAYS and soon on 18x8 35et BBS ??.
When I first put on the Rotas I did find the car tramlining more so than it did on the stock wheels. I also experienced the same thing when I rotated the tires for the first time onto the MS RAYS.
Its hard to make comparisons since I didn't have coilovers on the stock wheels and was only on stock suspension for 800 miles. I ran the Rotas for about 3 months before switching to the MS RAYS and also added a rear sway at the time. I would not describe my experience as harshly as described above however. I'll chime in later this week to let you know how they do on the BBS wheels.
When I first put on the Rotas I did find the car tramlining more so than it did on the stock wheels. I also experienced the same thing when I rotated the tires for the first time onto the MS RAYS.
Its hard to make comparisons since I didn't have coilovers on the stock wheels and was only on stock suspension for 800 miles. I ran the Rotas for about 3 months before switching to the MS RAYS and also added a rear sway at the time. I would not describe my experience as harshly as described above however. I'll chime in later this week to let you know how they do on the BBS wheels.
Yes, I will be putting the tires on the stock rims. So it seems that no one has tried the Falkens on the stock rim yet?
I'm more or less into drag racing, so handling is aloud to take a little hit as long as I see some improved traction. When racing, even though I slip in the clutch, I tend to squeal the tires all the way into third. Heating up the tires doesn't to do much to help. I can be going 30 - 40 mph and mash it in 2nd gear, only to have the wheels start spinning like crazy.
7mileshome - I want your front lip!
I'm more or less into drag racing, so handling is aloud to take a little hit as long as I see some improved traction. When racing, even though I slip in the clutch, I tend to squeal the tires all the way into third. Heating up the tires doesn't to do much to help. I can be going 30 - 40 mph and mash it in 2nd gear, only to have the wheels start spinning like crazy.
7mileshome - I want your front lip!
This is turning into a good thread. 
Thanks for your input 7miles and wastegate.
Thanks for your input 7miles and wastegate. What I can't figure out is how many people run wheels/tires similar to yours or mine and don't complain about any issues. As you say, lots of people have your Tenzos, and tons of guys run 18x8+48 Rotas. I've PMed one guy who had a 235/40 452 on a P1 exactly like me and said it was fine! He had lowering springs which might help (?) but you have the coilovers and still have prolems. IMO there's no way someone could ignore or not notice problems like I've had.
Unfortunately I don't have a good recommendation for tires yet. At work we buy all kinds of tires to try out on cars (we just picked up two sets each of Pirelli PZeros and Michelin PS2s for a total of $6800!!) but I don't have that kind of luxury with my personal car. If you still have your KDW2s and/or RIkens, mount those onto the Rays and try them out. That's the best way to know.
My handling problems were with daily driving. It made the car a huge pain in the ass to drive, even to work every day. I literally caused a huge accident one day as I was getting on the freeway. The car caught a little asphalt patch like I was describing and twitched so hard a guy in a Commander next to me thought I was merging into him. He over-reacted, swerved, and took out a Malibu in the next lane. Sent her into the median and totaled her car. I took the 452s off shortly thereafter...
If you just want traction for drag racing, keep the Potenzas for daily driving and throw on a pair of drag radials for nights at the track. Those will hook up better than anything and you won't have to live with them the rest of the time.
Wastegate13
Member
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- 08.5 CWP MS3 GT
I'm sure glad that the roads here are better than they apparently are in Michigan.
PS: To 7mileshome, the MS RAYS are 52et. They are listed as 50et at a few places but they are stamped 52et.
PS: To 7mileshome, the MS RAYS are 52et. They are listed as 50et at a few places but they are stamped 52et.
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7mileshome
Member
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- Mazdaspeed3
Thanks anyways, it sounds like we had the same exact situation! I wish I could do all the tire swapping at my house, because I don't trust people in this town to do anything right.
Lol, I just sold it a couple weeks ago! And sorry for the thread jack brother.
Post up your results when you get the tires on there, that should be interesting.
Like bacarl said, if you are into drag racing the car, and you want more traction, you are going to need to get a wider wheel, and some drag radials.
The stock wheel is only 7"!!
P.S. - how do you like your nano? Im putting mine in today, along with cpe's inlet!!
