My point was exactly what you've got wrong in your post. More air and more 'flow' does NOT mean more horsepower.
505 Intake Manifold COMPLETED!
- Thread starter 505zoom
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My point was exactly what you've got wrong in your post. More air and more 'flow' does NOT mean more horsepower.
505, I know you know your stuff, so I wasn't railing on the approach. I am just a bit shocked to see all those parts and flanges made up with no dyno given. And NA and turbo are VERY different in their manifold sensitivities. I'm assuming CF Flow Modeling was done on the manifold design, but that still doesn't get you that far. I'm simply just interested to know how it performs. It's a huge undertaking that you deserve a lot of credit for even doing. Lots and lots of hours of work.
You can also make a dyno say whatever you want it to, so it's not a great reference/bible anyway, but the shape of the curves is what I was interested in, you can always show whatever numbers you want, so that part of the dyno is always useless.
Sorry you feel insulted, but you shouldn't be that sensitive about someone asking a VERY legitimate set of questions. These are the kind of questions that people should be asking about a product. Early in the thread people were being asked to pay half up front... not sure if that stayed in place or whatever. But that's the kind of stuff that led to the problems with MAM and so forth. I don't expect you to spill your guts on calculations etc, but it isn't out of line for me to ask if things like port velocity, balancing, resonance, etc were taken in to account and what aspects you were aiming for. If the design is done right you should be able to tell me at what rpm you anticipate peak torque to be made relative to the stock manifold. If you can't, well then the design work wasn't done thoroughly.
I'm not trying to get anything riled up, I'm simply interested because it is an impressive bit of work to get in to and nothing I would personally want to take on because it is just way too much work. But statements like "it'll make power on just about any setup out there" make me questioning because that is an awfully wide generalization. Just like you don't put a turbo cam on an NA car you don't put a turbo manifold on an NA car... different needs and different breeds. I'll assume that the base of your statement lies in the fact that the stock manifold is likely restrictive enough that the manifold will work for both NA cars and turbo cars to see gains in some areas.
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- -- 03 P5 / 23 CX-5 --
Wow, 10 months & still going. People were freaking out after 6 waiting on other vendors' products to materialize. Nothing more than an observation there. Been hoping for the best here & def interested in results & possible proven benefits for "just about any setup". Just not jumping in without some.
2.0t03speed
Member
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- 08.5 CWP Speed 3
yea but theres a difference here no ones paid for anything...
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- 03.5 YLW MSP
and progress pics
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- -- 03 P5 / 23 CX-5 --
Oh, OK, thought some down payment deposit action had taken place. Guess that's what checkin in on it just every once in awhile gets me. Shoulda known better since no ruckus going on with it. Still chillin 4 results..............
3 quick points because I don't have much time right now to go delving into a large post.
1. The part is 100% absolutely NOT made for N/A applications. This is a TURBO intake manifold. When I say "will work for just about any setup out there", I was not in any way referring to N/A setups.
2. Nobody has paid. I know this project has taken longer than I planned, but I have managed to get where we are at this point without taking any deposits. Whether or not I will be able to get us completely to the finish line without taking payments has yet to be seen, but I am trying my best here to do so. If I do end up taking pre-payments before they are completely done, the manifolds will definitely almost be done and people won't wait for long after they have paid to get their manifold.
3. I am making all of the parts that are givens now. TB and head flanges. Vac fittings. Plenum floors. The actual runner pipes and plenum tops (the components that actually MAKE A DIFFERENCE in how the part performs) will NOT be made for the 20 production manifolds until the part is dyno tested. Period.
I hope this clears up any confusion.
Oh and steve, it wasn't so much you asking questions or what they were that got me upset, it was the manner in which they were asked. It was as if you hadn't been interested in this project until now, and came in here blasting my method, my intentions, and my part. I am curious as to whether there is something going on here behind the scenes with a certain buddy of yours, but I will leave all speculation where it belongs, which is not in this thread.
If anyone has any questions about the part that I have not addressed, please let me know.
1. The part is 100% absolutely NOT made for N/A applications. This is a TURBO intake manifold. When I say "will work for just about any setup out there", I was not in any way referring to N/A setups.
2. Nobody has paid. I know this project has taken longer than I planned, but I have managed to get where we are at this point without taking any deposits. Whether or not I will be able to get us completely to the finish line without taking payments has yet to be seen, but I am trying my best here to do so. If I do end up taking pre-payments before they are completely done, the manifolds will definitely almost be done and people won't wait for long after they have paid to get their manifold.
3. I am making all of the parts that are givens now. TB and head flanges. Vac fittings. Plenum floors. The actual runner pipes and plenum tops (the components that actually MAKE A DIFFERENCE in how the part performs) will NOT be made for the 20 production manifolds until the part is dyno tested. Period.
I hope this clears up any confusion.
Oh and steve, it wasn't so much you asking questions or what they were that got me upset, it was the manner in which they were asked. It was as if you hadn't been interested in this project until now, and came in here blasting my method, my intentions, and my part. I am curious as to whether there is something going on here behind the scenes with a certain buddy of yours, but I will leave all speculation where it belongs, which is not in this thread.
If anyone has any questions about the part that I have not addressed, please let me know.
All I am going to add is that there is now 2 people lined up for dyno testing, and both will happen ASAP. After the tests are in, the manifolds get welded up. I don't want to leave anyone that isn't confident in my word alone hanging.
I am also not going into the specific design details on a public forum. Sorry, but nobody out there making a part would do such a thing.
I am also not going into the specific design details on a public forum. Sorry, but nobody out there making a part would do such a thing.
2.0t03speed
Member
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- 08.5 CWP Speed 3
Nice 2 ppl is better then one lol get to see how much it makes on 2 different setups
Another thing certain people are overlooking is the fact the your not comparing apples to apples...Look at how much manifolds of this stature cost for an EVO or look how much a magnus intake mani would run for an STi.....they cost anywhere between 900 to upwards of about 1400........we are getting this manifold for about 700.....a part specifically made for the MSP.....not a cast mani meant for another vehicle that you put on the MSP...thats like saying hey lets put a 4-cyl galant mani on an evo.....and get XXhp out of it...you will get some people saying hey look we felt a big difference and you will get some that go they havent noticed a bit of difference.
For 505 to put that much dedication in to make sure everything was properly worked out says alot...i mean take for example the multiple revisions with the plenum itself..doesn't seem that he wouldn't have changed it if he didn't see something wrong with it ..BUMP for 505.....can't wait to have this mani in my hands......and I hope the dyno, both of them, prove something to your haters.
For 505 to put that much dedication in to make sure everything was properly worked out says alot...i mean take for example the multiple revisions with the plenum itself..doesn't seem that he wouldn't have changed it if he didn't see something wrong with it ..BUMP for 505.....can't wait to have this mani in my hands......and I hope the dyno, both of them, prove something to your haters.
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TheDirtyGoatee
Member
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- 2008 Mazda MX-5 5MT PRHT
My apologies once more also for daring to speak of another product in your thread. I also hope your dynos provide huge numbers. Good luck with the dyno 505.
Also, your "505" in your sig was baffling me and my wife. We couldn't figure out what it was. Then I realized the last 5 was backwards.
Also, your "505" in your sig was baffling me and my wife. We couldn't figure out what it was. Then I realized the last 5 was backwards.
TheDirtyGoatee
Member
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- 2008 Mazda MX-5 5MT PRHT
Actually, it does look like a piston... touche.
Fins bro!
Fins bro!
I really didn't mean to come across as blasting the project. I subscribed and was interested purely because I was impressed at how much you were doing and wanted to watch. I assure you that I'm not aware of anything going on in the background with who I'm guessing you are referring to. I don't know of ANY manifold work at all by anybody but you, you have my word on that.
The fact that this is a turbo mani only makes a world of difference. I thought you were trying to bridge NA and turbo and was pretty surprised/confused by that and was part of what I was questioning. That is a non issue obviously so it was wrong for me to question on that!
Good luck as you go, and I look forward to your final product being out there for people!
Cool, my bad.
Sorry for the misunderstanding, but yes it has been a turbo-only design from the beginning. The N/A boys will be getting a sick toy from me too, but that is still in the paper and ink phase of it's design.
Thank you Steve. Sorry for getting kinda uppity there, been a stressful week. (drinks)
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glad you two could sort it out, you are both very reputable members here and I'd hate to see you bickering over nothing lol
btw, 505 I thought your sig picture was supposed to be I.T.B.s at first lol....threw me off that it was only 3 runners though haha.....guess I'm a little slow for not realizing it was '505' lol
glad you two could sort it out, you are both very reputable members here and I'd hate to see you bickering over nothing lol
btw, 505 I thought your sig picture was supposed to be I.T.B.s at first lol....threw me off that it was only 3 runners though haha.....guess I'm a little slow for not realizing it was '505' lol
SpeedAdiction20
Member
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- 2003 MAZDASPEED Protege
random question, and sorry if i missed this earlier in the thread, didn't really have time to read through the entire 80 pages, but once this is made and sold to the original buyers that will be putting down the deposits and what-not, will there still be chances for other GBs or anything like that further down the road, i ask because i plan on replacing both my mani's next summer when i start working and the money starting coming in again, and wanted to know if there will be an opportunity to get this then if all goes well so i can keep an eye on it?
2.0t03speed
Member
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- 08.5 CWP Speed 3
theres going to be one more gb after this but after that i think that thats it. Youd have to ask rich to be sure tho.
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