MS6s with aftermarket shocks/struts

[tunersteve]

Anyone out there running a non-OEM shock/strut combo? I've been trying to research this, since a local MS3 guy has been doing the same on his end, and found that the OEM shocks are inadequate when it comes to damping when combined with lowering springs.

So far, I've found that we've got some options, including Koni, Bilstein, and possibly Tokico. I was wondering if anyone is actually running any of these setups, and what they're running them with in terms of other suspension mods. RPM and SU carry a few options, but replacement sets run from $500-800 depending on model.

With that said, let's try to make this a good resource thread for this. I'm not concerned with coilovers, and, while they have their benefits, don't seem like the option that the majority of owners on here would choose.

 

[tunersteve]

[reserved]

 

[tunersteve]

Anyone out there gonna speak up? I know there's a few of you running something other than OEM.

 

[FORZDA 1]

Anyone out there gonna speak up? I know there's a few of you running something other than OEM.

Well, Im running Koni Yellow Sport adj shocks with OEM springs and the setup works very good for me.... I have the car lowered ~1.5" all around using an old stock-class autocrosser method. The car is a bit lower and stiffer as well.

 

[tunersteve]

Well, Im running Koni Yellow Sport adj shocks with OEM springs and the setup works very good for me.... I have the car lowered ~1.5" all around using an old stock-class autocrosser method. The car is a bit lower and stiffer as well.

You did the old 'hold the suspension down and tighten it' routine, huh? What do you think of the dampin abilities of the Koni Sports? Much of an improvement over stock?

 

[FORZDA 1]

You did the old 'hold the suspension down and tighten it' routine, huh? What do you think of the dampin abilities of the Koni Sports? Much of an improvement over stock?

Well, IMO the Konis are as good as it gets in an off-the-shelf damper. I run them on my `03 Miata as well. The Speed6 application is adjustable via the top shaft on the fronts, but the rears require removing at least the bottom bolt to compress and rotate the shock body to adjust. My baseline setup is the rears set to ~1/4 turn from full hard and the fronts ~1/4 turn from full soft and with my overall setup (springs, shocks, WL rear bar) the car handles about as neutral as possible for a car that has 60% of the total weight on the front tires, depending on surface grip obviously. The really great deal with the Konis is they have a lifetime warranty against failure/defects and are rebuildable. If you want to run REAL stiff springs in a track-only setup you can send them to your nearest Koni facility with a statement of your goals and they will change the damping level/curves to fit your needs while still retaining the adjustment capability to fine tune to a given surface.

Yeah, when I was working on the shocks I was undecided whether to trim a coil off or just compress and tighten. So, when I installed the shocks, I FULLY compressed the suspension at each corner with a jack, then loosened and tightened ALL the pivot bolts on front and rear. The setup stiffens the car quite a bit and works surprisingly well. The only real downside is the possibility of a bushing tearing as they age out. I'll change out the rubber for poly if I have a problem later.

 

[tunersteve]

Good information. I was looking at the Bilsteins from RPM as a possible replacement to go with my H&Rs and WL RSB, but hadn't heard any feedback on them quite yet. Maybe I'll have to look at the Koni's instead.

 

[FORZDA 1]

.........Maybe I'll have to look at the Koni's instead.

Yeah, the Konis have a decades long track record to back them up. You can't go wrong with Konis.....

The fronts require drilling a hole in the bottom of the OEM strut body to release the pressure/oil, cutting the OEM strut body ~45mm from the top, dumping the OEM guts and dropping the Koni cartridge into the OEM housing and securing with a bolt through the bottom. It is quite easy to do, but a vice is a real help...

 

[tunersteve]

Yeah, the Konis have a decades long track record to back them up. You can't go wrong with Konis.....

The fronts require drilling a hole in the bottom of the OEM strut body to release the pressure/oil, cutting the OEM strut body ~45mm from the top, dumping the OEM guts and dropping the Koni cartridge into the OEM housing and securing with a bolt through the bottom. It is quite easy to do, but a vice is a real help...

Oh, so the fronts aren't just a 100% replacement? Interesting. I don't think I'd ever use the adjustment on it, so do you think the FSDs would be a worthwhile replacement for a non adjustable shock/strut?

 

[FORZDA 1]

Oh, so the fronts aren't just a 100% replacement? Interesting. I don't think I'd ever use the adjustment on it, so do you think the FSDs would be a worthwhile replacement for a non adjustable shock/strut?

Yeah, if you're looking for a more simple plug-n-play setup then the FSDs would be my choice for sure.

 

[batou079]

oh damn, was hoping kon iyellows would be 100% plug & play.
Well, i guess if i can get someone to help me that knows what they doing i could try. mebe

 

[FORZDA 1]

oh damn, was hoping kon iyellows would be 100% plug & play.
Well, i guess if i can get someone to help me that knows what they doing i could try. mebe

Dude, it is a simple procedure to cut the OEM housings, etc. I do think the Koni Sport Yellows are the best choice. The instructions have a couple of drawings that explain where to cut, etc., but if you need some phone help, PM me and I'll give you my # and you can call me and I'll talk you through it if you want. The only part that could be considered difficult is holding the OEM shock body to drill the hole in center of the bottom and make a fairly straight cut at the top. The bottom section is very thick and will take a bit of time to drill through. Use a new bit and lots of oil. When you cut it open you dump the oil and internals into the trash, clean it out real good and bolt the insert into the housing. I took my time and had NO problems, but i do have a bench vice. Oh and I NEVER have any help (don't want any either!) so it's a solo job every time!

Heck, if you search the other forums, you may find a full how-to.

 

[tunersteve]

I want the ability to go back to the stock setup if I decide to sell them, so cutting them is out of the question. I'll have to read over on 6club and see what guys are running and feedback on each item.

As always Forzda, thanks for the insight and help.

 

[leo766]

When installing the sway I had to remove the rear springs, and I'm sorry but what r u talking about, with bolting down pivot points to lower ur car... overtightening anything in a suspension is unwise, and even if u could lower a car that way, it would only bind ur suspension, till it literally breaks, id like to know what bolts ud tighten, cuz besides cutting springs, I have never heard of someone bolting a suspension into a compressed state, on a car not designed for an adjustable ride height

Maybe I'm wrong but id like to see a step by step for this mysterious sounding process... sounds like locking ur house door by welding the hinges shut

 

[FORZDA 1]

........I have never heard of someone bolting a suspension into a compressed state, on a car not designed for an adjustable ride height

Maybe I'm wrong but id like to see a step by step for this mysterious sounding process... sounds like locking ur house door by welding the hinges shut

Crap! I typed out a long, much better detailed explanation and the freakin' net, VOIP phones, etc all crashed on the east coast and dumped my response.... Anyway, a tiny recap is that from your post I think you're a relative noob. What I did was to set the suspension action to my desires, NOT simply lower the car by some amount to be "cool", "hawt", "phat", or whatever the latest word is for "nice", "rice", or "lowz".

As for a how-to, I already told what to do in previous post, but I do NOT recommend it for ANYONE who is nooby with a relatively low experience level. I recommend they stick to parts swapping with whatever compromises are determined by the marketer of the parts. I usually choose my own compromises unless the market has what I want.

My point is that while you are asking perfectly valid questions for a noob, I'm too lazy/time-challenged now to post the type of response that you really need. There are many books on suspension design/setup in your local library and book store so please indulge and then ask any specific question you want (PM or post). If I know, I will provide the correct answers, or opinions if asked. If I don't know I will refer you to another source.

FYI, I'm NOT a noob by any stretch. Been a full hands-on hotrod/gearhead for >50 years. I NEVER pay for anyone to perform ANY work on ANY of my vehicles. I get REALLY pissed every year when I must pay a moron $16 to put a state "safety" sticker on my windshield when he knows essentially NOTHING. I'm one of the go-to guys for everyone in my neighborhood, local car clubs, work, etc. My dad was a full-on racer when I was a kid back in the 50s-60s as well, so I've been everything from parts goffer to head mechanic, driver, etc ., so been there, done that.....