Just test drove the SRT-4 and.....

[BadDSM]

Wow I couldnt fathom being a 16-19yr old walking into a dealership and going

"No daddy I dont want that car, it is only a limited production"

Though course I would more along the lines of

"Daddy I want SRT-4, its faster!"


Kids will buy more on what is in a set price range than the fact of it being "limited production". Why? Cause price is the factor that will most directly affect their checkbook, or parents checkbook. Not the deginstation of it being limitied.

Oh and did you hear Mazda talking about increasing the numbers....

I am suggesting that the SRt4's are limited enough that you wont see them everywhere like you do with a pedestrian Neon.
What do you think the insurance rates for a sub 20 year old would be on an SRT4? From the age polls on SRTforums.com it appears the bulk of buyers falls into the 22-27 range.
I am not sure who you are trying to convince of "limited production" vehicles being a non "bonus" factor to kids as I never said it was.

Evan

 

[BadDSM]

Yea lotta kids will be getting em i got mine and some 16 yr old girl was test drivng a speed. LMFAO stalled out too. the SRT 4 is a ugly car sorry 15.5 psi and its still got a happy face front fascia. its the domestic auto makers pathetic attempt to cash in on the import market cuz all the new teenagers gettin licenses saw fast and the furious a while back. Even when I was at the Mitsubishi dealer checkin out the EVO8 there was some nasty eclipse GTS with some aftermarket stuff added on and they marketed it as "the fast and the furious package" kinda lame. told them it was the ugliest pos they had. said theyre hoping some kid comes in and wants to buy it. lmfao. oh and on the board you can tell the mspeeds been bought by some kids cuz some messed up their car already. if theyre not kids they just cant handle the car. some drivers need to stick to non performance cars or take a class at a local racing school to learn to control their car.

Some people think the SRT4 is ugly, its you opinion to not buy it or like it and that is cool.
Now about the pathetic attempt of a US automaker to cash in on some trend. Sure they saw a trend in the market along with at least 6-8 other manufactures and Dodge produced a great performing, affordable car for the consumer.
Hardly pathetic.
I see you are very biased against the car because of its looks yet scoff at the Mitsubishi for trying to look good.
So what is it that you want out of your car, performance or "good looks"?

 

[turboge]

We want both

 

[BadDSM]

I knew someone would pipe up with that answer, and to that I will ask which is more important to you?
As the Mazdaspeed in my eyes will always look better than it will ever perform.
If the engine were built with turbocharging in mind and came with a beefier tranny I would look no further.
I love the exterior and interior of the P5/MP3/MSP.
I have been tossing around the idea of turbocharging my P5, but have decided that even 200HP would severely compromise the reliability of the car and void any warrenties.
This is what leads me to the SRT4. I can't see the car while inside enjoying my a$$ off anyway, ugly or not.
ALL IMHO.

 

[turboge]

Well I belive the MSP with 200whp will be plenty enough to play. It will never be as fast as a SRT-4 with the stock turbo, but will not be too slow either. I think it's very capable of that number without any damage occuring.

 

[BadDSM]

Well I belive the MSP with 200whp will be plenty enough to play. It will never be as fast as a SRT-4 with the stock turbo, but will not be too slow either. I think it's very capable of that number without any damage occuring.

When I wrote 200hp being alot for the engine and transmission I meant at the crank.
200WHP?
I dont think the Mazdaspeed is capable of that on the stock long block.
Has anyone dynoed there car here with some mods or taken the car to a track?
It seems that the limit of modifications being done so far is a K&N, cat back and boost controller.
I wouldnt think you would get more than 190 hp at the crank with those mods. I will do some more research in the Performance section of this site to see what people are up to.
Just tossing out some random factoids:
A performance company called ATP turbo bought an SRT4 and
added their upper intercooler pipe and BPV, a 3" downpipe, slicks, and upped the boost to 15-16 psi and ran a 12.9 @102 on 91 octane California crap gas. Now that is impressive.

Evan

 

[turboge]

Sounds about normal for a 2.4L with a 16G on it. I wouldn't doubt the P/T cruiser doing the same thing with those mods. Weren't these things running 13.3-13.5's stock?

I would never trust the stock computer on the MSP to produce 200whp, only programmable management. From what I've heard the speculation from around the boards is that these cars have problems around 225whp, not certain of the setup those cars were runing, but 200 is not a very hard number to reach with some mods.

 

[BadDSM]

Sounds about normal for a 2.4L with a 16G on it. I wouldn't doubt the P/T cruiser doing the same thing with those mods. Weren't these things running 13.3-13.5's stock?

I would never trust the stock computer on the MSP to produce 200whp, only programmable management. From what I've heard the speculation from around the boards is that these cars have problems around 225whp, not certain of the setup those cars were runing, but 200 is not a very hard number to reach with some mods.

It has a 16g compressor wheel but a small Td04 exhaust wheel and small compressor and turbine housings.
The Pt turbo will not make similar numbers as it is some 400+ lbs heavier and has a more restrictive intake manifold and smaller intercooler. Different transmission and gearing as well.
Stock SRT4's run low 14's at around 100 mph.
And as far as the MSP, standalone engine managment to run 200whp. Who in the hell would do that?
You can get a 1.8T Golf w/ chip and exhaust and get 200whp.
By the MSp's own nature of being a limited production vehicle, it has damned itself into no aftermarket backing.
Companies will not produce an expensive part that they cannot get a decent return on investment for.
So we are left with Intakes and cat backs, and trying to wire up boost controllers with no one to lead the way in tuning.
Its a hard knock life for the MSP Owner/Tuner.

 

[APEXistud]

These SRT4's are going to be rather rare.
The 03' Models are only being sold out here in Cali and Florida as of now. As far as I know they will make it to the NE and other places by the middle of the year. Then the 04' models are the last of them as the current platform will be extinct as of 05' in the same way that the Protege will be gone.
Not as limited as say 3000 MazdaSpeeds but I would guess that there will be less than 10K made for both years. Maybe a lot less.
(2thumbs)
Additionally the dealer markups are a joke at those dealers.
I have talked to two separate places and they would drop it to sell the SRT4. I thnk this has a lot to do with peoples negative opinion of a "Neon". Especially since the SRT is so focused as a performance car, not many people are willing to or able to deal with it as a daily driver.
All the better for me as I can snatch one up on the cheap.

Where did you find this information. And seeing as how you can get the SRT-4 without the markup and you can't get an MSP without the markup in the bay area, you will more than likely see an SRT-4 before you see an MSP. I'm living truth for that statement. I've already seen 2 SRT-4's and they've been out for a little over a month now. I still haven't seen an MSP on the roads up here in NorCal. Nor can I get a ****** test drive due to the fact that all the dealerships are dicks.

 

[turboge]

And as far as the MSP, standalone engine managment to run 200whp. Who in the hell would do that?

I would.

You can get a 1.8T Golf w/ chip and exhaust and get 200whp.

But then I have a VW, I don't want a VW.

By the MSp's own nature of being a limited production vehicle, it has damned itself into no aftermarket backing.

With over 5000 MSP's being produced, I hardly think that aftermarket companies will stay off the bandwagon. We have already lead the way to bring our community an Injen CAI. Magnaflow is doing an exhaust right now. And I am looking into engine control.

I believe we read just a few posts ago that the SRT4 will be somewhat limited, but look at ATP, they have already produced aftermarket parts... I don't think it damned itself to anything.

Companies will not produce an expensive part that they cannot get a decent return on investment for.

Like I said, 5000 MSP's that leaves a good percentage of willing aftermarket participants. This isn't a civic, but it does have a lot of people wanting more power.

So we are left with Intakes and cat backs, and trying to wire up boost controllers with no one to lead the way in tuning.
Its a hard knock life for the MSP Owner/Tuner.

I've led the way for the 1st Gen Protege's, I will continue to back my support to them, and push towards new developments with the MSP.

 

[BadDSM]

Where did you find this information. And seeing as how you can get the SRT-4 without the markup and you can't get an MSP without the markup in the bay area, you will more than likely see an SRT-4 before you see an MSP. I'm living truth for that statement. I've already seen 2 SRT-4's and they've been out for a little over a month now. I still haven't seen an MSP on the roads up here in NorCal. Nor can I get a ****** test drive due to the fact that all the dealerships are dicks.

Which information?
I have test driven the SRT4 2 times and it is a rush.
I have seen 3 MSP's on the street but have yet to see an SRT4 on the street yet.
I am sure it is more difficult to get an MSP at MSRP as they are very rare. It doesnt matter what the price is for the MSP's, they will all sell and will still be rare to see on the street.
Yes you will see SRT4's more often but nowhere near as common as a RSX Type S for example.

 

[BadDSM]

Im sorry I was not trying to piss in your pot.
5000 is still not a lot of cars(although this is more than I thought were produced.)
Injen intakes and exhausts are one thing.
New turbos, FMIC's, strengthened internal engine components, heads, higher flow intake maniolds, ECU upgrades, etc are another.
That is where your power will come from and I just dont see companies investing money into these products for this limited production run as probably much less than half of the 5000 MSP's will be heavily modified.
If companies do produce some well tested and tuned setups than more power to you.
I would like to see a MSP running in the 13's,12's, etc.
Just MHO of course.

 

[turboge]

Not a problem, was just stating what was out there.

We will probably start to see T28 hybrids on the cars in the near future. But don't forget that this motor is the same as the entire protege 2.0 line. There are no internal changes. There is an aftermarket already lined up for it with piston and rod upgrades. Lightweight flywheels, clutches, cams, etc..

I am hoping to provide ECU upgrades with a simplistic method that requires little tuning. Not sure how plug'n'play it will be yet but we will know when I'm finished.

I don't drag race much, but I have no doubt I'll put a MSP into the 13's with stock internals and turbo.

 

[BadDSM]

I don't drag race much, but I have no doubt I'll put a MSP into the 13's with stock internals and turbo.

On the stock turbo and engine?
That would be VERY impressive. I will keep tabs to see what up in the coming months.
Cheers,
Evan

 

[turboge]

Mid 13's require about 240crank hp. Don't think it'll be low 13's but I'll see one get in the 13.5-13.9 range. Perhaps even pilot it

 

[JDM Sam]

5000 mspeeds? you mean the total with the production of this years black and orange (2000 us and canada) with next years titanium and yellow ones? and neon srt4 already run 15.5 psi boost stock. there are rumors in a magazine some mspeed is pushin 500 on stock blocks...but that magazine is super street...where it says in their review of the mspeed in the October 2002 issue page 246 and actually I quote from it, "We know of a certain MP3 race effort that has squeezed more than 500 horsepower from one of these stock blocks." and it also says the mspeed is set at 5.2 psi! which I can really feel the low boost when I mash the pedal or down shift. I personally timed the 1/4 and my best time so far is a 15.8 with my HKS timer 1/4 mile reading. So that falls close to what all the magazines I read say of 15.3 to 15.5. As far as aftermarket support. Its a turbo most the performance stuff is universal. You can fab a front mount I/C, 3 inch turbo back exhaust including downpipe, boost controller to at least 10 psi ( rumor has it calloway detuned the mazdaspeed so it would wax the svt focus outta the market ) tein coilovers, JE pistons, ferrea valves, and many more. If you got a M SPEED and got the need for more speed. Email me or Instant message me on AIM. I can get a lot of parts for the mspeed...the FS engine is my specialty...

 

[BadDSM]

5000 mspeeds? you mean the total with the production of this years black and orange (2000 us and canada) with next years titanium and yellow ones?

I was only guestimating. It sounds about right for the two years.

...and neon srt4 already run 15.5 psi boost stock.

Well no, the car can run from 12psi to around 14.5 psi depending on the conditions. However in good conditions(ie- low altitude and average temperatures the car will only run 12psi. It only utilizes the extra few psi if there is a power deficit like at higher altitude and hot ambient temperatures. So normally where vehicles are tested (near sea level and 75-80 degrees), the car will only run around 12psi-13psi. Although people have utilized MBC's to get it up to a constant 16 psi which puts out amazing numbers like 280 WTQ!

there are rumors in a magazine some mspeed is pushin 500 on stock blocks...but that magazine is super street...where it says in their review of the mspeed in the October 2002 issue page 246 and actually I quote from it, "We know of a certain MP3 race effort that has squeezed more than 500 horsepower from one of these stock blocks."

I am not sure what this has to do with anything as 99.9% of MSP owners will never get close to this number but there is an SRT4 engine that is belting out 825hp so there...

...and it also says the mspeed is set at 5.2 psi! which I can really feel the low boost when I mash the pedal or down shift. I personally timed the 1/4 and my best time so far is a 15.8 with my HKS timer 1/4 mile reading. So that falls close to what all the magazines I read say of 15.3 to 15.5.

So your car is powered via an HKS turbo timer?
How many whp did that net you?

As far as aftermarket support. Its a turbo most the performance stuff is universal. You can fab a front mount I/C, 3 inch turbo back exhaust including downpipe, boost controller to at least 10 psi ( rumor has it calloway detuned the mazdaspeed so it would wax the svt focus outta the market ) tein coilovers, JE pistons, ferrea valves, and many more.

How many of these parts are you going to "fab up"?

If you got a M SPEED and got the need for more speed. Email me or Instant message me on AIM. I can get a lot of parts for the mspeed...the FS engine is my specialty...

No offence but you would be the last person I would go to if I were looking for an MSP specialist.

 

[redrims]

Sounds about normal for a 2.4L with a 16G on it. I wouldn't doubt the P/T cruiser doing the same thing with those mods. Weren't these things running 13.3-13.5's stock?

I read in some car mag that the PT Turbo ran mid 15s.

0-60 in 7.7secs

 

[BadDSM]

I read in some car mag that the PT Turbo ran low 15s.

0-60 in 7.5secs

The extra 400lbs over the srt4 doesnt help it..

 

[redrims]

http://www.conceptcarz.com rates it 0-60 in 8secs.

And Motor Trend has it at 0-60 in 7.5

With the turbo, its still slow. Nothing compared to the SRT-4.