hey i was just seeing what you guys thought. im not really ready to do to many mods yet but i was wondering if all i had aftermarket under the hood was a injen cai if it would be worth the possible gains to get hard pipes. if you think it is worth it post what brands you would recommend. (im really new to this whole turbo thing, and im not real knowledgable about engines yet). thanks/
Hardpipes worth it?
- Thread starter baconbitz
- Start date
hardpipes aren't gonna provide much of a performance gain.
for about 200-350, you could upgrade your factory midpipe.
for about 500-ish, you could upgrade your factory intercooler.
the midpipe upgrade will yield significant gains, and so will the intercooler.
for a bit more money, you could purchase the corksport downpipe-back exhaust which is a very good upgrade for the money.
for about 200-350, you could upgrade your factory midpipe.
for about 500-ish, you could upgrade your factory intercooler.
the midpipe upgrade will yield significant gains, and so will the intercooler.
for a bit more money, you could purchase the corksport downpipe-back exhaust which is a very good upgrade for the money.
Hard pipes do alot.
most of the time, if your going to upgrade your piping, that means your going to move to an aftermarket fmic or smic, both of which will help with the big heatsoak issue the stock smic has.colder air will be fed to the TB, giving you more power, and helping to avoid detonation.
the stock msp piping is twisty, and gets narrow at points, restricting airflow to the TB. hard piping helps feed the motor more easy than the stock pipes would.
another reason why people get hardpipes is for the BOV. Eliminating your "turkey"..
It's one of the first and more important mods for a msp if you are looking for more performance with or without using a boost controller. next would be downpipe, at least. and just as impoortant would be an engine managment of some sort, ranging from the DSM afc, or the newest Microtech..
hope im not too off the ball. i've been reading alot about the msp.
most of the time, if your going to upgrade your piping, that means your going to move to an aftermarket fmic or smic, both of which will help with the big heatsoak issue the stock smic has.colder air will be fed to the TB, giving you more power, and helping to avoid detonation.
the stock msp piping is twisty, and gets narrow at points, restricting airflow to the TB. hard piping helps feed the motor more easy than the stock pipes would.
another reason why people get hardpipes is for the BOV. Eliminating your "turkey"..
It's one of the first and more important mods for a msp if you are looking for more performance with or without using a boost controller. next would be downpipe, at least. and just as impoortant would be an engine managment of some sort, ranging from the DSM afc, or the newest Microtech..
hope im not too off the ball. i've been reading alot about the msp.
Keep reading bud!PseudoSpeed said:
I can tell from your post that all you have ever done is read...And no...Hardpipes do NOT do a lot.Sorry.
All the you referred to was about what an IC upgrade helps with...Definately keep studying or your gonna fail the test.
Laterz
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- 2003 Subaru WRX Wagon, 2000 Miata
just hardpipes, not much gains....
hardpipes and upgraded smic or a fmic kit that includes hardpepes ...
now you're talkin.
hardpipes and upgraded smic or a fmic kit that includes hardpepes ...
now you're talkin.Demonic-Speed
Member
- :
- 2003.5 MSP
I say save for a FMIC....It makes a world of difference....Hardpipes run about 300 or so, The cheap FMIC (and by cheap I mean price not quality) will run about 900.
Velocifero
Wham Bam thank you Ma'am
- :
- VRM MS6, Sunlight Silver MSP
Switching to hard pipes will alleviate the boost you lose from the plastic OEM pipes expanding under pressure, if you've ever watched a MSP Dyno you can see the pipes expand so much they look like they are going to explode. You won't notice any extra pull from the upgrade, but your car will be smoother and that is proven. IMO they are worth it for a gradually modding car, now if you plan on jacking your HP way up then be prepared to lay down some bills and do it right and safe, management, fmic, injectors, tbe. But for subtle changes, the hard pipes are a good investment and they will smooth out your car. Again this is just my opinion, so everybody that wants to tell me that I don't know what I am talking about can save it. 
the car will run better.
the car will run better.if blkzoomzoom hit 13s with them, i think they can manage. If you are upping the boost via a manual boost controller, they do help hold the boost pressure to redline rather than drop off from the pipes expanding. Ive had 2 sets and liked them, but there is not much of a gain unless combined with more boost or more mods or boost and mods
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- Hemi Ram, 71 Plymth Scamp, 71 Plymth Duster 340, 69 Dart 340/4sp
I'm just gonna say one thing. Since when does metal conduct less heat than plastic?
I think the idea that plastic pipes expand and drop your boost is BS (no offense to people that think that, just the truth). Sure, maybe the pipes expand slightly, but there is still air being forced into them that will fill that space instantly and keep the pressure the same. In order to actually see a loss in pressure, the pipes would have to expand quite a bit, and you'd have plastic balloons under your hood evertime you hit the gas. If there is any loss in boost due to the stock pipes (I believe there is), it's due to air leaking past the connections and/or the stock BPV.
Is there something that can be safely used to seal the stock plastic pipes at the connections? That, in combination with a better BPV, should hold boost much better.
Is there something that can be safely used to seal the stock plastic pipes at the connections? That, in combination with a better BPV, should hold boost much better.
Velocifero
Wham Bam thank you Ma'am
- :
- VRM MS6, Sunlight Silver MSP
Seriously watch a dyno of a msp, the pipes look like they are going to explode. you realize how hard that plastic is to bend, imagine it expanding and the pressure involved to cause it. but your opinion is respected, I have just seen them expand, its a lot for how hard the plastic is. I don't have hard pipes yet, but I will by the end of September, its my birthday.Spooled said:
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- Hemi Ram, 71 Plymth Scamp, 71 Plymth Duster 340, 69 Dart 340/4sp
I will get you guys some comparison pics of my expanded pipes to a stock non abused set. The expanded (original set for car, been on every motor for every pass) ones are at least a 1/2 wider and 2-3" longer.
Sure they expand, but think about how much and how quickly they would have to expand in order to cause a significant drop in boost. Even if they expanded 1/2" around (normally 2" dia.) and 8" in total length (estimating 72" normally, and expanding to 80") , that's a 166.50 cubic inch increase in volume (5.5" cube for reference). How long do you think it would take a T-25 wo fill that? That's how long you would have your boost drop due to expanding pipes.
jeffmsp: the fact that the turbo has to work harder to build the same amount of pressure won't affect the boost. The wastegate will still open at the same pressure no matter how hard the turbo is working. It just means that the air will be hotter.
jeffmsp: the fact that the turbo has to work harder to build the same amount of pressure won't affect the boost. The wastegate will still open at the same pressure no matter how hard the turbo is working. It just means that the air will be hotter.
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