Warner-Hitachi K04 turbo Info for MS3&6

holy cow are you kidding???!!! if you can bypass the ecu fuel cut off our cars are capable of sustaining around 900 HP with the stock fuel system. chew on that one for a while. thats pretty sick eh?

the injectors are good for about 700hp

they run at 25% duty cycle under WOT on our cars. the pump does suck, and I've done all the research about the upgrades that may or could be available. I plan to find a mazda dealership and vw dealership that both have a camdriven pump instock, and take some pictures.
 
CPE and Cobb are both coming out with software that will tune the throttle plate along with other mazdaspeed parameters. Both are about $300 cheaper then XEDE and do more.

when cobb even gets something on the market other than swaybars and coil springs after a year of promises, i'll be happy. they've promised and cancelled mazda reflash tools before, so i am not holding my breath. the april and june release targets have long since passed. cp-e wanted to have throttle plate control from day one and its not that easy. saying "more mazdaspeed parameters" is pretty ambiguous

i do agree the XEDE price is way too high. i have no control over that sadly. we've got something else in the works which is more capable than all three systems mentioned. its a long long ways off though and only the serious enthusiast is going bite on it.

The fuel issue with the ms3 is not the injectors, but the cam driven fuel pump. Alone (without meth/water) it maxes out at about 315 whp. So, a redesign of the stock pump is in the works.

i really don't agree with that stated limitation. we're pushing more horsepower and much more torque than that to the wheels with some room to play with on the stock fuel system and thats with a larger turbo and more parasitic drivetrain loss.
 
as i said, we're seeing higher numbers stock fuel system and still have the ability to add fuel/richen the mix

http://www.mazdas247.com/forum/showthread.php?t=123680546

keep in mind this was on a mazdaspeed6. had this been a mazdaspeed3, the numbers would have been higher still.


once again ken... supposedly if you apply the e-brake at all it puts the ms6 to front wheel drive only. i'd like to see a FWD dyno on the setup that you've got going on, just to see the projected numbers taht possibly a ms3 would have on that same setup....

and ATP's boost cut killer would help out with the wavyness on the dyno. and maybe a bag of ice on the intercooler :)
 
once again ken... supposedly if you apply the e-brake at all it puts the ms6 to front wheel drive only. i'd like to see a FWD dyno on the setup that you've got going on, just to see the projected numbers taht possibly a ms3 would have on that same setup....

and ATP's boost cut killer would help out with the wavyness on the dyno. and maybe a bag of ice on the intercooler :)

the boost cut killer is in the car actually, part of the wavyness on the dyno is thanks to the driver jumping off the throttle too sooon during a few runs as well. a bag of ice on the intercooler is nice but does not truly reflect real world conditions.
 
Even better is when you have 2 of them.. I used to have a msp but now my new car is a 2.7 biturbo Audi s4. Currently it has 2 Ko3s but soon enough it will have 2 K04s put in it. Looking to run at 25 psi with the 2 put together.. haha, but sorry to break it to you, the gt series from garret is better. the one found on the msp is really a great turbo and the 28 series is ever better... ball bearings are better in the end..
 
the boost cut killer is in the car actually, part of the wavyness on the dyno is thanks to the driver jumping off the throttle too sooon during a few runs as well. a bag of ice on the intercooler is nice but does not truly reflect real world conditions.

its hard to get a car to run the same standing still compared to driving on the streets.

did ya'll have a box fan or something on the IC?
 
when cobb even gets something on the market other than swaybars and coil springs after a year of promises, i'll be happy. they've promised and cancelled mazda reflash tools before, so i am not holding my breath. the april and june release targets have long since passed. cp-e wanted to have throttle plate control from day one and its not that easy. saying "more mazdaspeed parameters" is pretty ambiguous

i do agree the XEDE price is way too high. i have no control over that sadly. we've got something else in the works which is more capable than all three systems mentioned. its a long long ways off though and only the serious enthusiast is going bite on it.



i really don't agree with that stated limitation. we're pushing more horsepower and much more torque than that to the wheels with some room to play with on the stock fuel system and thats with a larger turbo and more parasitic drivetrain loss.

still be great thing to see for enthusiasts captain!!! the more options the better.

secondly, they dyno doesn't seem to be too far off from others i have seen. Your says 329, and yet other say 315 and even other 320.

It obviously depends on the dyno used, the weather, and the tune given.

I saw where it was street tuned, meaning, i'm not quite sure what the a/f is at. You can squinch out several hp up and down depending on that. Obviously one is safer then the other, but i saw no graph on that.

With that being said, I still feel 315-320 (average, dyno adjusted) is about where our fuel system tops out!

... water/meth don't count ... and neither does nitrous ....
 
still be great thing to see for enthusiasts captain!!! the more options the better.

secondly, they dyno doesn't seem to be too far off from others i have seen. Your says 329, and yet other say 315 and even other 320.

It obviously depends on the dyno used, the weather, and the tune given.

I saw where it was street tuned, meaning, i'm not quite sure what the a/f is at. You can squinch out several hp up and down depending on that. Obviously one is safer then the other, but i saw no graph on that.

With that being said, I still feel 315-320 (average, dyno adjusted) is about where our fuel system tops out!

... water/meth don't count ... and neither does nitrous ....

we were not using meth on those runs. the AFR was at 12 or 11 to 1 depending on the run. it was at 18psi for those runs. we were able to run 23 psi and still have 10 or 11 to 1 ratios forcing us to lean it out, so there was still fuel to be had under conditions more exacting than what is pictured there.
 
well, apparently im on crack then......

believe what you want homies. a few adjustments and youll be on easy street to a 900 hp fuel system.
 
As far as i know the high pressure fuel pump is more than adequate,the other smaller low pressure fuel pump might be an issue.Its all down to decoding the ECU and reprogramming it.Why don`t you hire the AEM expert or engineer like HPF did for the E46 M3 ECU.They managed to come up with a full pnp system also utilising stock drive by wire.

Here is some reading.

We developed our own plug-n-play M3 engine management system that works in conjunction with the stock DME in a seamless environment. Unlike some other E46 M3 boosted applications where the throttle cable is removed or dash functionality has been compromised, our system allows every original component to still work and function as designed. Our kit completely eliminates the need for the power robbing MAF sensor and allows significantly more air flow into the engine. Our electronics also provide precise advance/retard control of both cams (dual vanos) based on both rpm and boost allowing greater power gains during forced induction. Precise timing and fuel control is calibrated based on any number of factors including the environment, altitude, gear selection, boost, road conditions, etc. Our engine management also provides optimal control of our 750cc high impedance injectors and is able to utilize the stock coil packs and spark plugs without requiring an auxilary ignition system.
Our kit is completely plug n play from the electronics to the entire turbo kit itself. Every kit comes with all of the electronics pre-assembled. The main black bracket simply bolts in with 4 supplied bolts to pre-existing holes in the engine bay on the passenger side near the front windshield. The rest of the connectors and components simply plug right in. Every wire is labelled, every connector has heat shrink wrap, every wire is wire-loomed, in several places shielded wire is used, ring terminals are already attached and labeled, fuses are affixed to the bracket and pre-wired, the fuel pump and oil pump relays are attached to the bracket and pre-wired, the high end AEM 3.5 bar map sensors for the boost gauge and EMS are affixed to the bracket and pre-wired, the exact BMW connector is attached, loomed and pre-wired, the race fuel switch is pre-wired with a connector, the intake air temp sensor is pre-wired and labeled and simply screws into our intake manifold which is also labeled, the boost control solenoid is also pre-wired and labeled, and the fuel pump trigger is pre-wired that turns the extra fuel pump on at 3psi. The EMS comes programmed for the car, and is already calibrated for every sensor used and the rest of the turbo system
 
HAHAHAHAHA!!! LMFAO!!! 900 HP!!! Sure, for about one second until you crack the head (excuse me, blow the friggin head right off the block) or bend a rod (excuse me, throw a rod right through the block)!!! That's got to be the funniest s*** I've heard to date on this board!!! (lol2) (2thumbs)

i said the fuel system can handle. try reading the post before you go all apeshit about it. (braindead
 
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well, apparently im on crack then......

believe what you want homies. a few adjustments and youll be on easy street to a 900 hp fuel system.

mr webb. the injectors can handle about 700 hp maybe more like lilguy said.. ur going to need a cam driven pump as well as me to even be possible to see 400+hp and on top of that, im not sure of the motors internal limitations are but i wouldnt see them going over 400 without breaking s***.. so ur going to need better internals as well.. a few adjustments... sure but they cost well over 1000 dollars and thats just for fuel.. not to mention the other mods u have to have on the car to reach even 400-500hp.. that could run u up to 5000 dollars... before u know it ur in a 7000 dollar pit of hell... and while ur right the injectors can handle the hp the cam driven one cant, and who knows about the one intank(i switched mine but i may have to switch back).. this thread started off about the turbo, howd it get to fuel... the stock turbo can handle 17psi. with the correct mods to back that up of course.
 
the injectors can handle about 700 hp maybe more like lilguy said.. ur going to need a cam driven pump as well as me to even be possible to see 400+hp and on top of that, im not sure of the motors internal limitations are but i wouldnt see them going over 400 without breaking s***.. so ur going to need better internals as well.. a few adjustments... sure but they cost well over 1000 dollars and thats just for fuel.. not to mention the other mods u have to have on the car to reach even 400-500hp.. that could run u up to 5000 dollars... before u know it ur in a 7000 dollar pit of hell... and while ur right the injectors can handle the hp the cam driven one cant, and who knows about the one intank(i switched mine but i may have to switch back).. this thread started off about the turbo, howd it get to fuel... the stock turbo can handle 17psi. with the correct mods to back that up of course.

let me clear my side up so i can unsubscribe to this thread and go smoke my crack. im not saying the rest of the motor can handle over 400 before it breaks. no kidding, i didnt say anything about that at all anyways. the other kid misunderstood where i was coming from when he started that in the first place.
with fuel pumps aside you not very far off for your FUEL to be able to handle....ok....700 hp with a few fuel mods. still pretty f-in amazing. im not saying a few dollars and adjust your fuel and BAM...you have 700 hp. thats rediculous. but, that doesnt mean its not rated to handle 700 hp. to get there you only need to spend a limited amount of money for a few mods. mechanically its able to sustain the fuel needed is all im saying. (minus a few inexpensive mods) hokay capeshe?
 
let me clear my side up so i can unsubscribe to this thread and go smoke my crack. im not saying the rest of the motor can handle over 400 before it breaks. no kidding, i didnt say anything about that at all anyways. the other kid misunderstood where i was coming from when he started that in the first place.
with fuel pumps aside you not very far off for your FUEL to be able to handle....ok....700 hp with a few fuel mods. still pretty f-in amazing. im not saying a few dollars and adjust your fuel and BAM...you have 700 hp. thats rediculous. but, that doesnt mean its not rated to handle 700 hp. to get there you only need to spend a limited amount of money for a few mods. mechanically its able to sustain the fuel needed is all im saying. (minus a few inexpensive mods) hokay capeshe?

Thats a little more realistic. The injectors may hold up to 600 at 80% duty cycle. The internals should be able to support 450 with ease. Its all in the tune guys. Tune it like s*** on the ragged edge and youre asking for it. This can easily happen stock too.
 
Thats a little more realistic. The injectors may hold up to 600 at 80% duty cycle. The internals should be able to support 450 with ease. Its all in the tune guys. Tune it like s*** on the ragged edge and youre asking for it. This can easily happen stock too.

The only problem is the assumption the high pressure injectors can operate at 80% duty cycle like regular pressure injectors. Perhaps they can only operate reliably up to 50%??? Whithout knowing that, it is impossible to say how much they can support.
 
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