Vortech supercharger?
- Thread starter Guido
- Start date
0
02.5 P5
did some research and found the third party site from the vortech website that put on the supercharger to the MP3...
www.area51fab.com
i emailed them to see if i get a response and to see if they are actually going to produce this system.
i am curious, will post again when and if i hear something
www.area51fab.com
i emailed them to see if i get a response and to see if they are actually going to produce this system.
i am curious, will post again when and if i hear something
This was extensivley discussed before. Try searching for it. I remember them (area 51) saying that they would not mass produce the kit but they would make one off's for you. And they would only be the ones to install it and tune it. So you would have to truck your car there and the price of it installed was about 5-7 grand
Not worth it in my opinion since Turbos produce more power.
But if thats your cup of tea...................goodluck!
Not worth it in my opinion since Turbos produce more power.
But if thats your cup of tea...................goodluck!
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I tried to get a hold of Area 51 a few times about this and I was not able to either confirm or deny that they were going to mass produce the kit, as I was unable to speak to the owner of Area 51. The kit on the MP3 you saw is a one off test model.
The compact version of the Vortech is listed for $1650.00 at
www.alternativeauto.com
If you made a mounting bracket, got the pulley size and longer serpentine belt then you could have your own. I wonder if you could use a blow off like on a turbo car to regulate the pressure?
I think if Vortech mass produced a kit it would be really cheap and give you instant torque and horse power. I like turbos but the lag, all the underhood heat and plumbing makes them more complicated.
G.
www.alternativeauto.com
If you made a mounting bracket, got the pulley size and longer serpentine belt then you could have your own. I wonder if you could use a blow off like on a turbo car to regulate the pressure?
I think if Vortech mass produced a kit it would be really cheap and give you instant torque and horse power. I like turbos but the lag, all the underhood heat and plumbing makes them more complicated.
G.
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Guido said:
Actually the centrifugal super charger, which is what the Vortech kit uses, is basically a pulley driven turbo. So, it'll make all the power at the top end (the S2000 kit is a classic example). You will be severely limited with boost as it will be pulley driven. If you want more boost, you need a different pulley ratio. So, if the kit is blowing 6 psi stock, you can probably get 8 or 9 psi at most changing the pulleys, after that you'll be putting to much strain on belts and such.
Basically, you'll see more power gains from a turbo set-up with a similarly sized turbo, as boost can be controlled more easily. And with the right sized turbo there won't be enough lag to make a noticeable difference from the centrifugal blower.
And turbos are more efficient!!!!!!!!!
To further add to StuttersC excellent explanation, the opinion and trend of most modern day tuners is that superchargers are the old school way of power. The new oem trend (i.e subaru, mazdaspped, evo 8) and all the domestic guys are switching out to turbo's. I recently went to a mustang drag meet and was amazed by how many turbos where there.
Furthermore in Japan turbo has been king for many years. You cannot beat the efficiency of a modern day turbo.
Plus heat, that is commonly associated with turbos is not an issue with intercoolers.
And if you decide that you still want to supercharge, I would not go with the voretch design, as Stutters mentioned these are very inefficient and basically combine all the negative aspects of a turbo(lag) and all the negative aspects of a supercharger. Resulting in a lose-lose situation. Try doing some research on eaton superchargers(the ones jackson racing uses) they are much better.
To further add to StuttersC excellent explanation, the opinion and trend of most modern day tuners is that superchargers are the old school way of power. The new oem trend (i.e subaru, mazdaspped, evo 8) and all the domestic guys are switching out to turbo's. I recently went to a mustang drag meet and was amazed by how many turbos where there.
Furthermore in Japan turbo has been king for many years. You cannot beat the efficiency of a modern day turbo.
Plus heat, that is commonly associated with turbos is not an issue with intercoolers.
And if you decide that you still want to supercharge, I would not go with the voretch design, as Stutters mentioned these are very inefficient and basically combine all the negative aspects of a turbo(lag) and all the negative aspects of a supercharger. Resulting in a lose-lose situation. Try doing some research on eaton superchargers(the ones jackson racing uses) they are much better.
ohh so you were the one that did the research on area 51
...........then where the hell did I come up with all that stuff? Man I must be getting old
A turbo can make more all out power, but for your typical street driven vehicle, that won't be cranked out to limits makes a supercharger a viable option. The airflow rate and pressure would be relative to engine speed. A vortech has the benifit of requiring very little horsepower to turn over compared to the eaton types.
The eaton types are popular because manufacturers can purchase them cheaply and they are simple. Thats why GM uses them on all their high end 3800 series v6 engines like in the GTP grand prix. Also Nissan has had great success selling them in their X-terra line.
Personally I wouldn't want to run any higher boost than 5 or 6psi because of the expense and maintenance to go higher than that. I know guys that run civics with more boost and they blow headgaskets, hoses and have to run elaborate fuel management systems to retard timing and remap fuel curves. Size up injectors and pumps etc.
This is why an inexpensive supercharger would make sense. If you want to push it to the max then the turbo is the way to go.
G.
The eaton types are popular because manufacturers can purchase them cheaply and they are simple. Thats why GM uses them on all their high end 3800 series v6 engines like in the GTP grand prix. Also Nissan has had great success selling them in their X-terra line.
Personally I wouldn't want to run any higher boost than 5 or 6psi because of the expense and maintenance to go higher than that. I know guys that run civics with more boost and they blow headgaskets, hoses and have to run elaborate fuel management systems to retard timing and remap fuel curves. Size up injectors and pumps etc.
This is why an inexpensive supercharger would make sense. If you want to push it to the max then the turbo is the way to go.
G.
........So are you gonna try to get an eaton?
No...
I already checked with Jackson racing about it. They had already looked into putting one on the P5 and said there wasn't enough room on the manifold side between the firewall.
There seems to be enough room on the exhaust manifold side for the Vortech though from the pics I saw on tv. I've seen Paxton superchargers on Mustangs and Camaros. The Paxton is way too big to fit most imports.
What supercharger did toyota use on their MR2 a few years ago?
G.
I already checked with Jackson racing about it. They had already looked into putting one on the P5 and said there wasn't enough room on the manifold side between the firewall.
There seems to be enough room on the exhaust manifold side for the Vortech though from the pics I saw on tv. I've seen Paxton superchargers on Mustangs and Camaros. The Paxton is way too big to fit most imports.
What supercharger did toyota use on their MR2 a few years ago?
G.
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spoolinmp3 said:
ohh so you were the one that did the research on area 51
...........then where the hell did I come up with all that stuff? Man I must be getting old
I don't know. I've been working twelve hour days staying up past by bed time three days in a row now. So, I wasn't even sure if I actually typed that stuff about the Vortech blowers v turbos.
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The first generation MR2 had a supercharger on it. The supercharger had a magneto pulley that would engage and disengage the blower when needed.
I forgot what kind of blower it was though. I think it was an eaton or roots type blower.
I forgot what kind of blower it was though. I think it was an eaton or roots type blower.
That would be interesting to have the supercharger controlled by a clamping clutch like A/C compressors on our cars use. Normal driving, no boost great fuel economy, twisty road on the weekend switch the compressor on and have fun.
Eaton style and whipple require overhauls around the 60 000 mile mark due to the teflon rotor seals wearing. Centrifugal do not, the procharger has sealed bearings and uses an internal belt that needs to be replaced at a cost of about $100. Paxton uses two plates with balls inbetween that counter rotate and provide the gearing multiplication. These balls tend to wear into the plates and slip causing boost loss.
The Vortech is oil fed from the engine and requires a drain back like a turbo. Internally it will have straight cut gears or helical gears. The helical are quiet and make no noticeable noise, for stealthy power. The straight cut gears blower is $100 cheaper and whines like a gear drive.
The noise would be cool if your car is lowered with custom wheels etc. this would add to the performance look having that blower gear whine when your cruising.
G.
Eaton style and whipple require overhauls around the 60 000 mile mark due to the teflon rotor seals wearing. Centrifugal do not, the procharger has sealed bearings and uses an internal belt that needs to be replaced at a cost of about $100. Paxton uses two plates with balls inbetween that counter rotate and provide the gearing multiplication. These balls tend to wear into the plates and slip causing boost loss.
The Vortech is oil fed from the engine and requires a drain back like a turbo. Internally it will have straight cut gears or helical gears. The helical are quiet and make no noticeable noise, for stealthy power. The straight cut gears blower is $100 cheaper and whines like a gear drive.
The noise would be cool if your car is lowered with custom wheels etc. this would add to the performance look having that blower gear whine when your cruising.
G.
0
02.5 P5
just got this response from area 51 via email:
"We are developing a supercharger kit that will work on both the MP3 and MP5. We should have a kit available late 2002 or early 2003. Check back soon, thanks."
So... they are planning on producing a kit to sell.
this was all the info that i was given though, so there is no telling what price will be or what will be included in the kit itself.
Personally, i am planning on waiting just to see what they come up with, it should be interesting.
"We are developing a supercharger kit that will work on both the MP3 and MP5. We should have a kit available late 2002 or early 2003. Check back soon, thanks."
So... they are planning on producing a kit to sell.
this was all the info that i was given though, so there is no telling what price will be or what will be included in the kit itself.
Personally, i am planning on waiting just to see what they come up with, it should be interesting.
Excellent!!
I'm going to wait and see what Area 51 comes out with also. I have lots of time and my 2002 P5 is only two months old. For me removing the primary cat like some turbo kits require is not an option where I live.
I have to remain smog legal and a supercharger will be the perfect way to do it.
G.
I'm going to wait and see what Area 51 comes out with also. I have lots of time and my 2002 P5 is only two months old. For me removing the primary cat like some turbo kits require is not an option where I live.
I have to remain smog legal and a supercharger will be the perfect way to do it.
G.
Guido said:
Yes but the BEGI kit retains both kits and is smog legal. so i don't know. for me i dont' have the money yet to by the BEGI kit. so i guess by the time i have the $$$$$ both kits should be out. ALSO Mazda proformance is coming out with a turbo kit. should be out by new years!
