Timing Curve
- Thread starter TurfBurn
- Start date
Dave, anytime you need any help with anything with the microtech or whatever let me know and I'm definitely there to answer any questions to the best of my knowledge! I'm certainly looking forward to seeing what will come of the car with the new engine next year. Should be fun! Yours will probably still own mine, but at least I might have a shot 
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.Turf:
Check if the whitest plugs have any kind of greenlike or yellowlike colors, a very faint shade of those colors on them. I may try taking pictures of mine. That means detonation.
About the tunning:
I would love to help you guys with the microtech, but the tunner here has the tunning protected! So...
I dont know...I may do the same, forge a new motor, sell the MPI and tune it with him with the microtech. The problem is, I will not be able to tune it myself...its like a secret of him. He has a lot of cars running 11s, he has a lot of experience, and Ive seen it myslef.
Check if the whitest plugs have any kind of greenlike or yellowlike colors, a very faint shade of those colors on them. I may try taking pictures of mine. That means detonation.
About the tunning:
I would love to help you guys with the microtech, but the tunner here has the tunning protected! So...
I dont know...I may do the same, forge a new motor, sell the MPI and tune it with him with the microtech. The problem is, I will not be able to tune it myself...its like a secret of him. He has a lot of cars running 11s, he has a lot of experience, and Ive seen it myslef.
Bumping this back to life... 
I'm again working on the timing curves. I'm using the data log features of the Microtech to see where I am at and so forth... right now I'm running roughly 22-25 degrees BTDC at 8 psi... I'm not getting any activity out of the JandS at this point even though a hard bump is enough to get it to light up. So I'm wondering if I can push it further forward or not... the big question is what the stock timing is... I know that roughly speaking with an MPI equipped car which uses the stock timing curve, you end up pulling roughly one degree per psi... so at 10 psi you pull 10 degrees... so the question is are you pulling ten degrees of of 39 degrees advance? or are you pulling it off of 29?
If anyone has any of that info I'd greatly appreciate it! I know that Beau said in one of the dyno threads he was only running about 16 degrees BTDC at 10 psi... So the fact that I'm running 22-25 is already pretty advanced relative to him... so just trying to find the happy medium... I'm just not sure I'm willing to keep pushing it until the JandS goes nuts.
Once I know where I'm working to then the rest is easy as far as tuning... and I have the car mostly holding low 11's for AFR right now.. I'll get that closer to 12 soon.. and work from there.
Later!
Steve
I'm again working on the timing curves. I'm using the data log features of the Microtech to see where I am at and so forth... right now I'm running roughly 22-25 degrees BTDC at 8 psi... I'm not getting any activity out of the JandS at this point even though a hard bump is enough to get it to light up. So I'm wondering if I can push it further forward or not... the big question is what the stock timing is... I know that roughly speaking with an MPI equipped car which uses the stock timing curve, you end up pulling roughly one degree per psi... so at 10 psi you pull 10 degrees... so the question is are you pulling ten degrees of of 39 degrees advance? or are you pulling it off of 29?
If anyone has any of that info I'd greatly appreciate it! I know that Beau said in one of the dyno threads he was only running about 16 degrees BTDC at 10 psi... So the fact that I'm running 22-25 is already pretty advanced relative to him... so just trying to find the happy medium... I'm just not sure I'm willing to keep pushing it until the JandS goes nuts.
Once I know where I'm working to then the rest is easy as far as tuning... and I have the car mostly holding low 11's for AFR right now.. I'll get that closer to 12 soon.. and work from there.
Later!
Steve
More info... from a turbo DOCH modern 4 cyl.. the SRT-4
http://www.srtforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=139406&page=1&pp=15
Looks like they get up into the 40's without issue for timing... wow.
http://www.srtforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=139406&page=1&pp=15
Looks like they get up into the 40's without issue for timing... wow.
?
or do you mean the loss of torque that occurs if you add too much timing?
I found that pontiac and old muscle cars like 34-38 degrees of advance through most of their RPM range... I know I'm nowhere near that during NA operation... and our motors should be quicker/more responsive if anything... our compression is a bit higher.. so we lose there... but the rev's are higher as well.. so I'm sorting that out now too...
Linux.. do you remember when the JandS becomes active? I know there are certain areas that it doesn't "listen" at all...
or do you mean the loss of torque that occurs if you add too much timing?
I found that pontiac and old muscle cars like 34-38 degrees of advance through most of their RPM range... I know I'm nowhere near that during NA operation... and our motors should be quicker/more responsive if anything... our compression is a bit higher.. so we lose there... but the rev's are higher as well.. so I'm sorting that out now too...
Linux.. do you remember when the JandS becomes active? I know there are certain areas that it doesn't "listen" at all...
TurfBurn said:Bumping this back to life...
I'm again working on the timing curves. I'm using the data log features of the Microtech to see where I am at and so forth... right now I'm running roughly 22-25 degrees BTDC at 8 psi... I'm not getting any activity out of the JandS at this point even though a hard bump is enough to get it to light up. So I'm wondering if I can push it further forward or not... the big question is what the stock timing is... I know that roughly speaking with an MPI equipped car which uses the stock timing curve, you end up pulling roughly one degree per psi... so at 10 psi you pull 10 degrees... so the question is are you pulling ten degrees of of 39 degrees advance? or are you pulling it off of 29?
If anyone has any of that info I'd greatly appreciate it! I know that Beau said in one of the dyno threads he was only running about 16 degrees BTDC at 10 psi... So the fact that I'm running 22-25 is already pretty advanced relative to him... so just trying to find the happy medium... I'm just not sure I'm willing to keep pushing it until the JandS goes nuts.
Once I know where I'm working to then the rest is easy as far as tuning... and I have the car mostly holding low 11's for AFR right now.. I'll get that closer to 12 soon.. and work from there.
Later!
Steve
If the timing was 39 degree's at that point and you had -10 on the MPI, you would then have 29 degree's, I'm sure you knew that. It is getting warmer here and the J&S is starting to light up with about -13 off the stock MP3 timing at half throttle, 8psi at about 3500 and up. I have the sensitivety about half way up on the J&S. So the 10 degree's at 10psi is not all that acurate, it depends a lot on gas, climate and elevation. I assume that was just an example. Didn't Beau say he had like 20 something degree's total at 15psi?
Bigg Tim said:
Right I understand that... and I also have a bigger than normal for spool kits intercooler and am at 8.9:1 and running 93 octane... so how and where those changes all matter changes it as well... I'm just trying to make sure i'm not insane basically.... but anyway...
Beau said he was running like 16 degrees at 10 psi being conservative... I'm seeing SRT-4 and other timings well into the 30's when boosted...
The big thing here is that when I did timing last night and had pushed the car forward enough that the timing was at roughly 25 degrees under 10 psi of load, the car lit up and was fast as hell.. I couldn't believe how fast it was... but it didn't do that until it got above 5000 rpm's... which is where i was adding timing in... I pulled some out in midrange.. so now i'm trying to figure out what to do as far as addition of timing from 2k up... and what is reasonable under boost.. I have timing locked so that no matter what I do it can't ever go above 38... but I can change that.. I'm just not interested in risking the motor and I'm trying to figure out where these motors "normally" are...
http://forums.probetalk.com/showthread.php?t=1701059152&highlight=timing
28 deg advanced max for 15psi, i think thats the edge or being aggressive, more conservative would be around 25-26deg
28 deg advanced max for 15psi, i think thats the edge or being aggressive, more conservative would be around 25-26deg
