Sushi-Monster
Sparco Freak!
- :
- Titanium Grey 2003.5 MazdaSpeed Protege
pressumably if your want the pipes powder coated, it'll cost extra correct??? God damn it... don't have the money to buy this thing....
Switch from pannaut fmic to perrin fmic. **56K warning**
- Thread starter strongbear0
- Start date
I think you need to get the pipes raw, not polished, and then you can powdercoat them. If you really want an inexpensive, but great FMIC kit, go with BEGi. If you want a monster kit, and can afford it, definately go with Perrin. The BEGi kit should work as your FMIC/SMIC solution, and you can get the pipes powdercoated as well.
I want a Perrin FMIC so bad!
I want a Perrin FMIC so bad!
Wow, I just noticed how easy it is to get the pipe from Turbo to IC off. I was wondering if you'd have to take the whole bumper off again to get at it, in case you wanted to install a real turboback exhaust/downpipe, or upgrade the turbo.
Score more points for Perrin and Cullen!
Score more points for Perrin and Cullen!
- :
- 2003.5 Titanium Gray MSP #1699
Is there any way to get it this way? I'd like to have mine powdercoated black or Stealth Coated (if it doesn't cost too much & I can find someone who does it).Bhamsan said:
Demonic-Speed
Member
- :
- 2003.5 MSP
Just wondering but has your front reinforcement been crash tested? Because that bar is there for a reason....
And to answer the person who asked which has more cutting ION or Perrin. It looks like both are about the same. Except in the case of ION you don't have anything behind the cut on one side, and only two lines on the other, which are easily pulled out of the way.
And to answer the person who asked which has more cutting ION or Perrin. It looks like both are about the same. Except in the case of ION you don't have anything behind the cut on one side, and only two lines on the other, which are easily pulled out of the way.
StreetUnit
Banned
- :
- 2003.5 MSP
Powdercoating is not my area of expertise. Maybe someone can chime in.Demonic-Speed said:
The Perrin kit does not interfer with the frame of the car, you have to cut sheet metal where the pipes route through in the front. The bumper support is exactly what it is called, bumper support. Some other kits require the cutting of the bumper support for the core to fit. Perrin just replaced it.
PERRIN_JOHN
Member
Bhamsan said:
Bhamsan,
You do not need the pipes to be raw. A powder coater will dip the pipes into (forgive my ignorance) a phosphate or acid bath. This will clean and etch the pipes for the powder coat to adhere. This dip would have to be done even if the pipes were raw.
Demonic-Speed said:
Demonic-speed,
Thank goodness No.
Our core support beam has never been crash tested. I am quite confident that the beam will add additional support in the event of a collision but I would prefer if no one would try to find out.
The PERRIN intercooler is so big that you would have to cut or remove your stock bumper beam. Instead, our solution is to provide you with a new support beam.
The new beam provides easy mounting of the intercooler and offers a high level of protection. We construct our beam from 1/2 steel, mounting plates attached to a box sectioned steel beam and powder coated for rust protection.
Anyone who has picked our support beam up can attest to the stability.
We do not claim that this is a replacement beam for the stock bumper. This intercooler kit is designed for off road use and should not be used on vehicles, which are driven on public streets and highways. Our beam is a highly reinforced intercooler mount that we hope will assist in the unfortunate circumstance of a front-end collision.
Demonic-Speed
Member
- :
- 2003.5 MSP
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Thats what I was expecting to see...Street, it is not called a bumper support it is the front end reinforcement bar that prevents the block from ending up in your lap on a front end collision. About 5 years ago a lot of the bodykit makers were having peopel remove the bars to fit the kits. Now I think they work around the bars as much as possible.
I am not saying it is a nice kit, but I am saying it replaces a front reinforcement for the car.
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Thats what I was expecting to see...Street, it is not called a bumper support it is the front end reinforcement bar that prevents the block from ending up in your lap on a front end collision. About 5 years ago a lot of the bodykit makers were having peopel remove the bars to fit the kits. Now I think they work around the bars as much as possible.
I am not saying it is a nice kit, but I am saying it replaces a front reinforcement for the car.
strongbear0
Member
PERRIN_JOHN said:
Perrin John,
For safety puproses maybe you should stress test the stock and supplied bumper beams. After all it is advertised as a "new bumper beam". Implying that it serves the same purpose as the "old bumper beam". I for one do not want to be the one who finds out how strong the "new bumper beam" is. And actually looking at your fmic page on your website I don't see where it says they are for off road use only. I do see that you advertise the Evo 8 fmic as the only dot approved fmic upgrade. But on the wrx and srt-4 fmic kits where the stock bumper beam is removed you say nowhere that it is for off road use only and that removal of the stock bumper beam could be deadly in the event of a front end collision. I for one think that is kind of deceiving. And seeing that I have your fmic in my msp and have installed another one for someone else I have a vested interest in knowing that the "new bumper beam" you guys supplied will save my ass in the event of a front end collision. This is a serious matter that needs to be addressed especially when you have dealers advertising it as a replacement bumper support. This is a quote from **********.com . "FMIC kit includes a new front bumper support which replaces the stock support. This allows room for direct piping from the turbo to intercooler to throttle body; no excess piping to cause pressure drop." I would like to see you guys spend a little money to send the stock beam and your beam to a place with a hydraulic press and see how much pressure both beams can stand up too.
Please let us know you are thinking about our safety, because the way it looks right now we are coming in second to profit. At least have them tested so you can say for sure wether or not it will help or not in the event of a front end collision.
Thanks,
Adam
I only have one thing to say... if I had the money, I would buy the Perrin FMIC regardless of the front bumper support. Hell, maybe it's because I am also a motorcycle rider and you have no protection at all, so the hell with it. It's all about going faster to some and being safer to others. But with confidence that your getting horsepower not safety. If you want safety then go with one that doesn't touch the bumper support.
Question for Perrin about FMIC: Does the Turbo/IC pipe run into the A/C lines at all, ie. does the installer have to bend anything out of the way like the ION kit requires.. moving the Power Steering lines and such???
Question for Perrin about FMIC: Does the Turbo/IC pipe run into the A/C lines at all, ie. does the installer have to bend anything out of the way like the ION kit requires.. moving the Power Steering lines and such???
strongbear0
Member
TheJohnny said:
Yes you have to bend lines. You have to relocate the ac condensor and some lines.
Back to your statement about safety. My issue is someone saying one thing than saying something totally different. I am all about the power, hell I hope to have 350 whp after my motor build in a couple weeks and my gt2871r and ems. But I don't like being decieved. It was advertised as a "replacement for your bumper support". It would be nice to know that the most expensive fmic on the market was also tested for safety. Hell it wouldn't cost that much to send both off and have them stress tested. That's my only point.
strongbear0
Member
TheJohnny said:
Maybe I'll take mine back apart and see if there is a way to reinforce the beam that perrin sends out. It would be nice to know how strong it really is though.
Demonic-Speed
Member
- :
- 2003.5 MSP
I am not an engineer so take this for what it is worth, but I think the stock beam is designed to send the pressure around the engine bay so the block does not end up in your lap. Putting extra reinforcement, might not be the way to go. I would ask some one who works at mazda, what the stock bar was designed to do.
Just my .02
Just my .02
PERRIN_JOHN
Member
We are not out to deceive any one.
Of course I can only comment on the information, which our company provides directly to the consumer.
The beam in question.. is a bumper beam used to support and mount our front mount intercooler to the vehicle.
It replaces and resides in the same location as the factory bumper support beam. We do not imply nor state that because the product is mounted in the same location as a factory part that it will perform in the same manor as the factory unit.
The example of a body kit is perfect. These products are for show vehicles only. These products are not intended to be used on street vehicles and are not intended to perform as the products that they are replacing. They are for show only.
Replacement brakes are another great example. Many brake pad compounds will not function properly until they reach a specific operating temperature. Using these pads on the street will increase stopping distances tremendously. They may be sold as performance brake pads and replace a factory installed component but do not insure that they will function as well as the stock unit when placed onto a street vehicle.
Strogbear0
I am not trying to give you a bad time. I just want to clarify the situation.
The fact that this is a new bumper beam does not and should not imply that it performs the same duty as the factory unit.
Again not trying to give you a bad time.maybe in the excitement of your new product you may have overlooked the paperwork that comes with your intercooler. Below is the text from one of the documents addressing this exact problem.
SPECIAL NOTICE REGARDING USE OF THE FOLLOWING PARTS:
PEP-ENG-400 FRONT MOUNT INTERCOOLER EVOLUTION 8
PSP-ENG-400 FRONT MOUNT INTERCOOLER WRX/STI 02-04
PNP-ENG-400 FRONT MOUNT INTERCOOLER SRT-4 NEON
PMP-ENG-400 FRONT MOUNT INTERCOOLER MAZDASPEED PROTG
THESE PARTS ARE DESIGNED, MANUFACTURED, AND SOLD SOLELY FOR USE ON OFF-ROAD AND RACING VEHICLES. IT IS NOT INTENDED FOR USE ON VEHICLES THAT OPERATE ON PUBLIC STREETS AND HIGHWAYS. USE OF THIS PART ON STREET VEHICLES MAY BE A VIOLATION OF FEDERAL OR LOCAL LAW!
INSTALLATION OF THIS PART MAY RENDER INOPERABLE OR REMOVE SAFETY EQUIPMENT ON YOUR VEHICLE. THIS MAY AFFECT HOW THE VEHICLE PERFORMS IN THE EVENT OF A COLLISION. AS A RESULT OF INSTALLATION, YOU AND/OR OTHERS MAY BE INJURED OR KILLED!
PERRIN PERFORMANCE IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR ANY DAMAGES AS A RESULT OF USE OR INSTALLATION OF THIS PART. CHECK YOUR LOCAL LAWS PRIOR TO ORDERING AND/OR INSTALLATION.
IF YOU DO NOT AGREE TO ASSUME THIS RESPONSIBILITY,
PLEASE RETURN THIS ITEM TO YOUR DEALER FOR A REFUND.
QUESTIONS: CONTACT US DIRECTLY
TECH@PERRINPERFORMANCE.COM
503-643-4677 VOICE, 503-644-9857 FAX.
We are very frank in discussing the legality of our products and the proper usage of these products. We pride our selves on being the only aftermarket component manufacturers who has a written dealer agreement, which states that all PERRIN Performance dealers must accept returns of uninstalled PERRIN products, which will alter safety or emissions equipment.
We will not force a customer to take a part if, at the time of purchase, they did not realize it was going to make their vehicle illegal or unsafe to drive on public streets and highways. Additional warnings are included in paperwork which accompanies intake and exhaust components which alter vehicle emissions.
I hope that none of you feel deceived. We certainly are not here to make profit over customer safety.
I cannot stress enough that our high horsepower products are designed and intended for the consumers looking to maximize the performance of their vehicles. In order to achieve the goals of our consumers some emissions equipment and safety equipment must be altered. We do our best to educate the consumer before and after the purchase of our products as to proper usage and regulations for which it was designed.
Final usage of any of our products should be determined by the consumer as to the situation in which they intend for its use.
Please.if any one has a question about any PERRIN Performance products please give us a call or shoot us and E-mail (tech, sales, or info@Perrinperformance.com.). Our sales, technical and marketing staff are here to help.
I will be leaving town for the holidays so I may not be able to comment again until next week.
Happy turkey day to all.
Of course I can only comment on the information, which our company provides directly to the consumer.
The beam in question.. is a bumper beam used to support and mount our front mount intercooler to the vehicle.
It replaces and resides in the same location as the factory bumper support beam. We do not imply nor state that because the product is mounted in the same location as a factory part that it will perform in the same manor as the factory unit.
The example of a body kit is perfect. These products are for show vehicles only. These products are not intended to be used on street vehicles and are not intended to perform as the products that they are replacing. They are for show only.
Replacement brakes are another great example. Many brake pad compounds will not function properly until they reach a specific operating temperature. Using these pads on the street will increase stopping distances tremendously. They may be sold as performance brake pads and replace a factory installed component but do not insure that they will function as well as the stock unit when placed onto a street vehicle.
Strogbear0
I am not trying to give you a bad time. I just want to clarify the situation.
The fact that this is a new bumper beam does not and should not imply that it performs the same duty as the factory unit.
Again not trying to give you a bad time.maybe in the excitement of your new product you may have overlooked the paperwork that comes with your intercooler. Below is the text from one of the documents addressing this exact problem.
SPECIAL NOTICE REGARDING USE OF THE FOLLOWING PARTS:
PEP-ENG-400 FRONT MOUNT INTERCOOLER EVOLUTION 8
PSP-ENG-400 FRONT MOUNT INTERCOOLER WRX/STI 02-04
PNP-ENG-400 FRONT MOUNT INTERCOOLER SRT-4 NEON
PMP-ENG-400 FRONT MOUNT INTERCOOLER MAZDASPEED PROTG
THESE PARTS ARE DESIGNED, MANUFACTURED, AND SOLD SOLELY FOR USE ON OFF-ROAD AND RACING VEHICLES. IT IS NOT INTENDED FOR USE ON VEHICLES THAT OPERATE ON PUBLIC STREETS AND HIGHWAYS. USE OF THIS PART ON STREET VEHICLES MAY BE A VIOLATION OF FEDERAL OR LOCAL LAW!
INSTALLATION OF THIS PART MAY RENDER INOPERABLE OR REMOVE SAFETY EQUIPMENT ON YOUR VEHICLE. THIS MAY AFFECT HOW THE VEHICLE PERFORMS IN THE EVENT OF A COLLISION. AS A RESULT OF INSTALLATION, YOU AND/OR OTHERS MAY BE INJURED OR KILLED!
PERRIN PERFORMANCE IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR ANY DAMAGES AS A RESULT OF USE OR INSTALLATION OF THIS PART. CHECK YOUR LOCAL LAWS PRIOR TO ORDERING AND/OR INSTALLATION.
IF YOU DO NOT AGREE TO ASSUME THIS RESPONSIBILITY,
PLEASE RETURN THIS ITEM TO YOUR DEALER FOR A REFUND.
QUESTIONS: CONTACT US DIRECTLY
TECH@PERRINPERFORMANCE.COM
503-643-4677 VOICE, 503-644-9857 FAX.
We are very frank in discussing the legality of our products and the proper usage of these products. We pride our selves on being the only aftermarket component manufacturers who has a written dealer agreement, which states that all PERRIN Performance dealers must accept returns of uninstalled PERRIN products, which will alter safety or emissions equipment.
We will not force a customer to take a part if, at the time of purchase, they did not realize it was going to make their vehicle illegal or unsafe to drive on public streets and highways. Additional warnings are included in paperwork which accompanies intake and exhaust components which alter vehicle emissions.
I hope that none of you feel deceived. We certainly are not here to make profit over customer safety.
I cannot stress enough that our high horsepower products are designed and intended for the consumers looking to maximize the performance of their vehicles. In order to achieve the goals of our consumers some emissions equipment and safety equipment must be altered. We do our best to educate the consumer before and after the purchase of our products as to proper usage and regulations for which it was designed.
Final usage of any of our products should be determined by the consumer as to the situation in which they intend for its use.
Please.if any one has a question about any PERRIN Performance products please give us a call or shoot us and E-mail (tech, sales, or info@Perrinperformance.com.). Our sales, technical and marketing staff are here to help.
I will be leaving town for the holidays so I may not be able to comment again until next week.
Happy turkey day to all.
strongbear0
Member
PERRIN_JOHN said:We are not out to deceive any one.
Of course I can only comment on the information, which our company provides directly to the consumer.
The beam in question.. is a bumper beam used to support and mount our front mount intercooler to the vehicle.
It replaces and resides in the same location as the factory bumper support beam. We do not imply nor state that because the product is mounted in the same location as a factory part that it will perform in the same manor as the factory unit.
The example of a body kit is perfect. These products are for show vehicles only. These products are not intended to be used on street vehicles and are not intended to perform as the products that they are replacing. They are for show only.
Replacement brakes are another great example. Many brake pad compounds will not function properly until they reach a specific operating temperature. Using these pads on the street will increase stopping distances tremendously. They may be sold as performance brake pads and replace a factory installed component but do not insure that they will function as well as the stock unit when placed onto a street vehicle.
Strogbear0
I am not trying to give you a bad time. I just want to clarify the situation.
The fact that this is a new bumper beam does not and should not imply that it performs the same duty as the factory unit.
Again not trying to give you a bad time.maybe in the excitement of your new product you may have overlooked the paperwork that comes with your intercooler. Below is the text from one of the documents addressing this exact problem.
SPECIAL NOTICE REGARDING USE OF THE FOLLOWING PARTS:
PEP-ENG-400 FRONT MOUNT INTERCOOLER EVOLUTION 8
PSP-ENG-400 FRONT MOUNT INTERCOOLER WRX/STI 02-04
PNP-ENG-400 FRONT MOUNT INTERCOOLER SRT-4 NEON
PMP-ENG-400 FRONT MOUNT INTERCOOLER MAZDASPEED PROTG
THESE PARTS ARE DESIGNED, MANUFACTURED, AND SOLD SOLELY FOR USE ON OFF-ROAD AND RACING VEHICLES. IT IS NOT INTENDED FOR USE ON VEHICLES THAT OPERATE ON PUBLIC STREETS AND HIGHWAYS. USE OF THIS PART ON STREET VEHICLES MAY BE A VIOLATION OF FEDERAL OR LOCAL LAW!
INSTALLATION OF THIS PART MAY RENDER INOPERABLE OR REMOVE SAFETY EQUIPMENT ON YOUR VEHICLE. THIS MAY AFFECT HOW THE VEHICLE PERFORMS IN THE EVENT OF A COLLISION. AS A RESULT OF INSTALLATION, YOU AND/OR OTHERS MAY BE INJURED OR KILLED!
PERRIN PERFORMANCE IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR ANY DAMAGES AS A RESULT OF USE OR INSTALLATION OF THIS PART. CHECK YOUR LOCAL LAWS PRIOR TO ORDERING AND/OR INSTALLATION.
IF YOU DO NOT AGREE TO ASSUME THIS RESPONSIBILITY,
PLEASE RETURN THIS ITEM TO YOUR DEALER FOR A REFUND.
QUESTIONS: CONTACT US DIRECTLY
TECH@PERRINPERFORMANCE.COM
503-643-4677 VOICE, 503-644-9857 FAX.
We are very frank in discussing the legality of our products and the proper usage of these products. We pride our selves on being the only aftermarket component manufacturers who has a written dealer agreement, which states that all PERRIN Performance dealers must accept returns of uninstalled PERRIN products, which will alter safety or emissions equipment.
We will not force a customer to take a part if, at the time of purchase, they did not realize it was going to make their vehicle illegal or unsafe to drive on public streets and highways. Additional warnings are included in paperwork which accompanies intake and exhaust components which alter vehicle emissions.
I hope that none of you feel deceived. We certainly are not here to make profit over customer safety.
I cannot stress enough that our high horsepower products are designed and intended for the consumers looking to maximize the performance of their vehicles. In order to achieve the goals of our consumers some emissions equipment and safety equipment must be altered. We do our best to educate the consumer before and after the purchase of our products as to proper usage and regulations for which it was designed.
Final usage of any of our products should be determined by the consumer as to the situation in which they intend for its use.
Please.if any one has a question about any PERRIN Performance products please give us a call or shoot us and E-mail (tech, sales, or info@Perrinperformance.com.). Our sales, technical and marketing staff are here to help.
I will be leaving town for the holidays so I may not be able to comment again until next week.
Happy turkey day to all.
I fully understand your position, but if you will remember mine was the first unit sould by street unit. My box did not include bolts to mount the new beam nor did it come with instructions not to mention mine was the one with off set holes which made centering it impossible without drilling new holes. I am very pleased with the performance, but would like to know that if I am involved in a front end collision that the perrin fmic won't end up in my lap. The process of strenght testing the stock and supplied beams would be cheap and would probably make a lot of people feel safer or not as safe driving their cars. Even if mine had come with instructions and warnings I probably would have done it anyways so it's ok. Thanks for the quick response. Now on with the motor build and 20psi here I come.
Thanks,
Adam
strongbear0
Member
03MSP said:
Bigger is most deffinantly better when it comes to high horsepower. I plan on running 20psi on a gt2871r after my motor is finished, so I should be around the 400whp mark. I doubt the begi fmic can flow enough for 400whp. You know how the old saying goes, "Different strokes for different folks."
To each their own and as far as I am concerned the Perrin fmic is the best kit on the market for the msp.
I concur if your running boost up to around 18 to 20 psi. At that point one hell of a FMIC would be needed, such as the PERRIN.... until then I think the Thumper Kit FMIC would be efficient like they say up to 300 hp then more then that would need a bigger FMIC. I don't know which way to go right now, I'm thinking about the new mustangs so much lately. Putting a Vortech on one and having some fun... oh man. Anyway, back to reality and my MSP and my Fiance's 6s.03MSP said:
