so lets talk coilovers

[essejkcamraw]

ill be in the market for coilovers soon, and im down to either BC's or H&R's. if i remember correctly i think the h&r's will go lower than BC's but for those of you who have have either, hows your ride quality? any problems with either? and how long have you been using them? what are you using for camber adjustments? ill be coming off road magnets which for springs have been good.

i know a lot more of you are rockin the BC's i haven't seen too many guys rolling on the h&r's really but, im going to be selling the rota torques soon also an going with a new wheel set up also. lookin into advan rz's 17x8.5 45e on a good conventional drop.

 

[not yellow]

i just installed H&Rs about a week ago. the ride quality is great! struts are bilsteins and springs are H&R. definitely stiffer than the stock setup, but not uncomfortable at all. i have them all the way down in back and about a 1/2" above the bottom in front(which makes them even!). no camber or damper adjustments. took it in for an alignment and ended up with about -1.5 up front and -2.5 in the rear. best they could do and fine for me. if you don't lower it as much there won't be as much neg camber. hard to give a complete review yet since i haven't had them for very long, but so far so good. stay tuned...

as for the BCs... i had them on my MSP. don't know how similar they are for the MS3 but the handling was amazing and the ride was harsh(even with the dampers on the softest setting). also had some build quality issues on the BCs, but the attractive thing about them is the price point and adjustability. they do have front camber plates, but they are not accessible on the MS3 unless you cut away the sheet metal around the upper mount under the hood. you will be able to adjust the damper stiffness up front but the rears will take some modification of the trunk liner to access. maybe some one else knows about this? did it for my MSP, but it wasn't easy.

 

[essejkcamraw]

damn you car looks good man! and i have heard about build quality being bad on some of the BC's. haven't heard much about the H&R's.

 

[not yellow]

thanks! i'm real happy with the drop and the ride so far... haven't had the chance to punish any real corners yet but looking forward to doing it soon.

 

[STRICK-]

essejkcamraw, ill let you check out my BCs in person when were at raceroots.

 

[shaneS]

I've nheard nothing bad about the H&Rs. As soo as my dad lets me buy them... im going to!

 

[Design]

In terms of quality and ride comfort, H&R all the way. At rock bottom, I've read they can get a bit harsh. But for the average DD, there's really no better choice IMO.

 

[essejkcamraw]

essejkcamraw, ill let you check out my BCs in person when were at raceroots.

you gonna hangout at the dyno day at fordspeed? i may be able to get some BC's for pretty cheap from a buddy of mine that works for JDMups, i might be goin that route. you had any problems with them?

 

[charlessss]

How low are you trying to go? H&Rs are lower than BCs I believe, but are godawful at the lowest setting. After a couple thousand of miles of driving them(after setting them higher), they feel great. Almost like stock. But they really don't compromise performance for how comfortable they are.

 

[mazdaspeed kid]

How do the H&Rs compare to the Mazdaspeed coilovers?

 

[Design]

How do the H&Rs compare to the Mazdaspeed coilovers?

Having experience with both of them, (rode H&R's on another car), Mazdaspeed is more of a track setup. Adjustable compression and rebound on a twin-tube body. Very stiff but not uncomfortable.

H&R's do not have adjustable compression/rebound; adjustable height only. Progressive springs make them more comfortable for daily driving as long as you don't drop them too low.

 

[derspi]

If you're looking for a great street setup then H&Rs are your best bet. So long as you don't go nuts on the drop then they're actually quite comfy and ride almost as good as stock without the wallowing.

Like someone else mentioned, H&Rs are high quality - Bilstein struts with custom matched springs. This is my second car with them and unless I want a dedicated track worthy set of coilovers, I'll probably continue getting them in my next car.

 

[SRTie4k]

Can the H&R's be rebuilt? If so, anyone know how much they charge?

 

[Design]

Can the H&R's be rebuilt? If so, anyone know how much they charge?

You mean the dampers? Yes - they are Bilsteins and can be rebuilt. Standard rate for rebuilds ranges from 125-150 most places last I remember.

 

[noobinacan]

if I was going coilovers...primary reason would be track.
and that would mean, you would want to adjust your compression and rebound.
...

that would also mean that you can adjust your suspension for the street.
run faster rebound and softer compression. ..or depending on where you drive...etc.

 

[Design]

if I was going coilovers...primary reason would be track.
and that would mean, you would want to adjust your compression and rebound.
...

that would also mean that you can adjust your suspension for the street.
run faster rebound and softer compression. ..or depending on where you drive...etc.

If you're referring to BC's - which is the focus of this thread - there is hardly any compression adjustment:

 

[SPEEDYHANS]

what about the KW??

 

[not yellow]

design, those charts are a bit hard to read... care to interpret?

 

[Design]

design, those charts are a bit hard to read... care to interpret?

Sure, but I'm no expert and still learning myself.

The horizontal axis is the speed of the piston movement. The vertical axis is the resistance to movement (damping). Above 0 is rebound, below 0 is compression. As the piston moves faster, there should be more resistance to help maintain vehicle stability.

Without getting too technical, the lines you see above 0 are damping curves which should change each time you adjust the rebound. The graph clearly shows a unique curve for each "click" in rebound adjustment. However, on the compression side, the curve below 0 is virtually the same for each "click." That tells me there is little to no change in compression no matter what setting you adjust to.

 

[Nliiitend1]

Sure, but I'm no expert and still learning myself.

The horizontal axis is the speed of the piston movement. The vertical axis is the resistance to movement (damping). Above 0 is rebound, below 0 is compression. As the piston moves faster, there should be more resistance to help maintain vehicle stability.

Without getting too technical, the lines you see above 0 are damping curves which should change each time you adjust the rebound. The graph clearly shows a unique curve for each "click" in rebound adjustment. However, on the compression side, the curve below 0 is virtually the same for each "click." That tells me there is little to no change in compression no matter what setting you adjust to.

I'm pretty sure that those "Buddy Club" dampers are NOT from the same company as the "BC BR Type dampers" that are available for our platform...


That being said, here's a plot for BC damper from a "BR Type" setup for an 8th gen Civic that were posted on another forum by a BC salesperson (note that this is only for one damper in each graph - 1 front damper and 1 rear damper - and for some reason one of the graphs is in metric units and one is imperial units, so making a judement about consistency across the dampers in a set cannot be made easily from these graphs):

And here's the thread I pulled it from (the thread was initially started as a discussion about a Stance setup):

Stance Coilovers Information - 8th Generation Honda Civic Forum

And for some contrast here are the dyno plots that KW has on their website that show the shapes of the damping curves and how they change with rebound and compression adjustment (I'm also trying to find some "independently obtained" shock dyno results for a KW setup as well right now):

Rebound:

Compression:

KW automotive North America Inc. Suspension -- Coilovers -- Shocks -- Springs


As you can see in the BC plots, there is really no compression damping adjustment to speak of, and the MINIMUM ratio of rebound:compression damping near mean velocity is roughly 2:1 (with an arguably useless 8:1 ratio at full stiff). It's no wonder people describe these things as bouncy/harsh, since the car is likely "jacked down" over sections of road/pavement with a series of small bumps and ends up riding on the bumpstops.