Smoke!

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fathergene

Member
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02' Protege5
I have been combating the smoking on startup issue for a more than a month now, and I still can't figure out where it is coming from. It is blue smoke so I know that it is oil being burnt. I changed the valve seals myself already (head stayed on block), but they were rock auto ones and they are all the same color unlike the factory ones that are green and black. I think that it still might be coming from the exhaust valve seals since the exhaust valves are .005" smaller than the intake valves. I tried using bardahl stop smoke, has not worked so far. I tried using the marvel mystery oil piston soak from the saturn forum guys, didn't work and none looked like it went past the piston rings. I have yet to get a good compression check on the engine since I modified the tester hose to work as a tool for the valve seal change. I am at a loss right now. It used to only smoke on startup and now it smokes almost all the time, even when warmed up.(argh)

I know that this has been discussed a lot, does any one have any ideas on a direction for me to go in? If so please let me know. Also I don't know how much I am burning since I am not commuting in the car right now, but I am trying to get it healthy for my 600 miles commute every weekend starting next month. Thanks.
 
Yea Im in the same boat got the felpro one's which are all the same color and I still smoke sometime's.So I went and bought the oem one's which are black and green to install those this spring only thing I could think of is just to stick with oem. I bought that tool to do the valve seal job without pulling the head off also...my question to you is how did you do it..rope trick or air?

On a side note I just bought a oem pcv valve the other day because my cheapo took a crap and I really don't see any smoke on startup or driving around anymore might wanna look into that..I paid prob $22 bucks for that and around $144 for the oem valve seals..
 
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I used air to keep the valves up. I have the supercharged millenia pcv from autozone, it does not look like there is any oil in the pcv lines at all. I know that I read some where that the millenia valve is supposed to have a higher tension spring there for reducing pcv oil loss vice the stocker one. I know the oem seals are expensive! I was hoping to not go that route or maybe someone on here would have a different route to go since I am at the end of my rope with this smoke issue. It looks like I am trying to kill all the bugs in the town when I start the damn car up!
 
Another thing you could do which your not gonna like is to do a compression test to see if your piston rings are ok..
 
That is my next step, but I have to get another compression tester air hose because I had to modify the one that came with it to do the valves. The check valve in the end is gone due to the modification, so now the gauge will not retain the pressure.
 
How many miles on the car? A good culprit has been the valve guides and seals for other members. ANOTHER problem is Our valve cover is a major fail from Mazda. There were no provisions for baffling when designing the PCV system. Just a metal plate. This allows blow-by and condensation to pool in the IM where the "T" enters the runners. The PCV fails from the crud constantly building up on it. The Millenia S PCV valve is an ok short term fix, but there is a better alternative. I made a catch can that has a check valve in it, allowing the PCV to be eliminated completely. The valve is on the vacuum side of the system and sludge never gets to it, so it will never fail. The can has its own baffling to help condense the sludge and gasses and all the heavy stuff goes to the bottom of the can. Once full (about every other oil change) I simply empty it from the built in drain on bottom. It works great and helps with the fuel octane not getting contaminated. Plus your spark plugs last longer and the valve seats wont get gummed up like they are with the stock configuration.

I dont ever guarantee this is the fix all for people. It definitely takes care of one of the many issues with the design flaws of our car. One less variable in the equation!
 
The car has 170k on it. I don't think that I have ever seen anything other than clean oil on the PCV. But I have only had the car for about 2 months.
 
same here. that was the whole reason I built the check valve catch cans to begin with. The millenia S PCV only worked to a certain point and still failed form the lack of VC baffling. I was pissed because all the hard work of polishing the inside of that IM and to find it covered again in 2 months time. The catch can is keeping it clean now and reduced the consumption big time. There are about 200 other people that could tell you the same exact story right now. If only my threads didnt get deleted....
 
Signature Sound said:
same here. that was the whole reason I built the check valve catch cans to begin with. The millenia S PCV only worked to a certain point and still failed form the lack of VC baffling. I was pissed because all the hard work of polishing the inside of that IM and to find it covered again in 2 months time. The catch can is keeping it clean now and reduced the consumption big time. There are about 200 other people that could tell you the same exact story right now. If only my threads didnt get deleted....
Click to expand...

Yea I made one also cost me like 8 bucks to make but I still need to find a breather that will fit the top no such luck yet.
 
Ok, new info I did a compression check today. Drove the car a while and looked at the pistons, the tops were dry. Did the compression check #1 @ 140, #2 @ 140, #3 @ 150 and #4 @ 145. I know that this is the middle of the road for compression but it is still within limits. Also after the car cooled down all the way I started it again and shut it off when it started smoking, pulled all the plugs and they were coated in oil, also the top of the pistons had oil sitting on them. So with all that being said, the compression check was good. The oil control rings might be bad, but I think that I am going to pull the intake this weekend and see what it looks like and probably get rid of the VTCS. Anyone else have any ideas?

Oh yeah the millenia S PCV I get was from autozone, so it might not be up to par.
 
fathergene said:
Ok, new info I did a compression check today. Drove the car a while and looked at the pistons, the tops were dry. Did the compression check #1 @ 140, #2 @ 140, #3 @ 150 and #4 @ 145. I know that this is the middle of the road for compression but it is still within limits. Also after the car cooled down all the way I started it again and shut it off when it started smoking, pulled all the plugs and they were coated in oil, also the top of the pistons had oil sitting on them. So with all that being said, the compression check was good. The oil control rings might be bad, but I think that I am going to pull the intake this weekend and see what it looks like and probably get rid of the VTCS. Anyone else have any ideas?

Oh yeah the millenia S PCV I get was from autozone, so it might not be up to par.
Click to expand...


Look.



If you want to check if the PCV si giving you the headache, it is a simple test to do...

PCV valve splitts into two rubber hoses going to the intake manifold. Unhook the PCV from the valve cover, (let the cover breathe) and use a bolt or something to plug the two rubber tuber so the engine won't suck fresh air.
That way you have literally cut of completely ANY sorec of oil getting to the intake through the PCV.

Drive the car like that for a day or two and see if it smokes.

My money will be on - YES it will smoke again. Because it is not the PCV, it is the oil rings. Not scraping off the excess oil, thus the oil being sucked into the champers, due to a high vacuum on cold idle, helping the compression ring keep the good compression, but as soon as the pistons warm up a bit, the oil rings expand and start scraping the oil.

I'wv been there, done tons of stuff, replaced the stem seals, did the seafoam through the spark plugs to unstuck the rings, played with catch cans, PCV-s, but to no avail. I have smoked up the entire neibhorhood every morning.

And, as soon as I have taken the engine apart, cleaned the pistons, reringed the sucker and deglazed the cyl walls, put it back togather, the smoking stopped like it had never been present...
 
Hi my milly smoked bad on startup (lots) it was sucking oil through the supercharger, you can check this by taking off the front intercooler if there is oil in itand the intake pipes thats your problem, you can also take off the small inspection plate on top of the supercharger to check for oil in the charger. i am trying a quick fix and it's working so far, I will post my quick fix and results after 1000 ks, so far it's working very well and only cost NZ$15 and one day working on it.
 
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