HiCompression VS Turbo

[mrpopnfresh]

Hmm...well just remember that if a car didn't come off the lot with a stock turbo, you're bound to have problems. Unless you're able to maintain it well.

My cousin started boosting his civic back in '92. When he traded it in for his WRX we stripped everything and when we opened up the head, it was looking nasty. He took care of it and did everything you were supposed to do. The car just wasn't built for a turbo so it didn't last.

The real question is, how long do you expect to keep your car and how much money are you willing to invest into it while you have it?

 

[Familia323]

Ak:

eh.. I partially agree with you...
The RSX is highly overrated and priced. But, I think 200whp N/A at 3k is pushing it a little. 180whp, probably, but 200whp, probably not without some great ass tuning. And you can for sure get that much for 3500K in a turbo... Plus with a turbo you can upgrade further later.. If you went N/A getting to 200whp is probably the MAX that anyone is gonna see for now.... especially under 3 grand. I vote turbo, mostly because of reliablity and bang for buck. FS is not a good N/A build up motor.

 

[akhilleus]

People..seriously..u turbo zombies...NA has the quickest off the line pull... Even on the s*** the nA pulls harder..No Turbo lag...and unless u r supercharged the 200whp NA will beat a 220whp turbo any day..enough said...even a AT...Bring it.

 

[deckedoutmp5]

People..seriously..u turbo zombies...NA has the quickest off the line pull... Even on the s*** the nA pulls harder..No Turbo lag...and unless u r supercharged the 200whp NA will beat a 220whp turbo any day..enough said...even a AT...Bring it.

a super charger on a fsde is crap thats why they dont make them, you dont get your power till like 5K. i dont have turbo lag. to get a fsde to 200 whp NA id love to see a dyno. and for the money the turbo is the way to go. and a turbo will kick a protege na's ass. but i cant really say that since its not really been done yet... or has it...

people running hi comp na, please post your times and traps. peace- trav

 

[perfworks]

turbo, turbo and more turbo

 

[PaulMP3]

I really like how with a turbo you can drive around normally without going into boost if you want (its hard not to though (laugh)) My car feels completely stock untill i demand power, and then its there in a sec. Turbo just make sense.

 

[Matthew]

hey install, what would you guess my hp to be

Injen CAI
RacingMazda Header
Catless Exhaust w/HKS rear section

im stickin NA also, and plan on my next mods being:

Pulleys
Cams
Clutch/Flywheel

wonderin what im lookin at after that?

 

[PaulMP3]

go to the dyno. i would be interest to see how much hp is in that header. Everyone always said that the first cat robbs a lot of power.

 

[Matthew]

i wish i had the money, and i dont have a dyno before the header either arent dynos like 100 bucks a hour?

 

[Installshield 2]

The going rate around my area (closest I believe is in Harrisburg, PA) is around 100 bucks for 3 pulls, and $150 for 5...so yeah it is sort of pointless unless you are really interested in your gains or need the pulls for tuning purposes...

I have never seen a dyno with your exact mods more or less...I would bet you are around 115whp, that being on the conservative side...You completely cured the single most restrictive part of a P5 (being the down-pipe)...and some guys were gaining as much as 11whp with only a AWR header, while maintaning the secondary cat...the axle back/intake combo should be good for "at least" 4whp I would think...

Assuming you are going with the J-spec cams, expect another 10whp on top of your already 15...the other two mods are more difficult to predict...both lightweight flywheels and pullies help mostly with acceleration and first, and a good bit in second, but by 3rd gear they start to become less noticable...More importantly they will immensely help with a hard pull to redline in first and second, which is excellent for 1/4mile runs...if your tires are in good shape I would bet you could be getting into 15.60-70-80 range...

IMO don't worry about the pullies as much as the flywheel...try getting a custom 60-65mm center pipe to complete your exhuast (do you know what the diameter of the HKS axle back is by the way?), that could free up another 2-3whp for relatively cheaply and with the other mods you will be easily over 130whp...

To put this in perspective on straight line acceleration, a 60lb lighter 02 Spec V, which is crippled by unbeilevably bad breathing above 5 grand and horrible gear ratio's can manage a 1/4 mile time in the 15.20-30 range with a decent driver (and the spec V has a stock whp rating of about 142) yes it has more tourque but don't worry about that, the gearbox does not allow the car to take advantage of it... if you have roughly 135whp, and in this case much better breathing (most of the time in a 1/4 run the engine is boiling...your FS will be much happier in these rpms than the QR25DE?? or whatever the Spec V has) and much better ratio's (still be hitting 62mph in second gear, and have a much shorter 3rd than the spec...)...You will probably clock in around mid 15's or a little above...so yeah the spec v will still be a little faster, but you will have definatley made him sweat a little with a little over a grand in mods....

 

[Matthew]

with the center pipe, what is 60-65mm into inches?

the hks bolts directly to the stock piping so its prolly the same size. should i get a custom pipe made and just utilize the hks muffler? what is the stock size of piping? also, if i just got the pipe between my test pipe and axle back made bigger at a shop would that be pointless seeing that the axle back and the forward sections leading to the header would be smaller?

 

[Installshield 2]

umm...my s*** was confusing I think...

60mm is about 2.375 inces...the stock exhuast was 2 inches I believe...what is the diameter of the test pipe? If you were going to do it just get a piece from the header to the axle back, and get rid of the test pipe...60mm would be just about perfect for your mods and even as big as 2.5" but no bigger than that with your mods,...also that HKS may be a little larger intenally than the stock exhuast, I think the racing beat axle back that came with the MP3's was anyway...

Also, the header runner diamaters are not important in this becuase they only contain the pulses of one cylinder each...the diameter of the pipes after the header is what is in question...Don't do any of this until you find out the diameter of the axle back...since we are only talking about maybe 4-5whp maximum the axle-back being 2" could kill the whole thing and yeild no gains...But again I bet it is bigger, the stock muffler is the least ristricitive part of the stock exhuast, and in order for an aftermarket muffler to yield any results is should be at least a 1/4 inch bigger...Hell the tip is ******* bigger than the stock muffler's so internally it probably is too...

 

[acidbug]

Everyone Negated the use of nitrous...Best $$ per hp you can spend! Asjustable from 35-75hp! I said it before and i will say it again...200hp is easily attainable w/ nitrous..and don't forget...that all my mods leading up to 200hp..will still cost under 2k!!!

Chas

 

[xoom xoom]

... Oh and RSX-s arent all they are hyped to be. 200@crank with 150-160 whp 125 torque...A SE-R could beat them or an MSP stock

I have driven my friends 2003 rsx type s and it very fast. If are cars were as fast as that thing is there would be less people actully getting turbos. His RSX was bone stock with 700miles on it and was to 75-80mph in 6-8 secs.

 

[Installshield 2]

More like 60mph in abut 7 seconds...it won't get to 80mph before 10 seconds...

 

[p5sundevil]

hehe, i skipped pages 2 and 3 untill i replied here to the first post so if I repeat or sound dumb, forgive me =P

between N/A and turbo I think your best bet is BOTH.
yes I said BOTH.

not necessarily higher compression, just a partially built engine with a small turbo kit I think is the best of both worlds.

For example my plan:
Start N/A with;
custom intake-exhaust-OBX or custom header.(bolt ons)
custom camshafts, lightened flywheel, port and polished heads(maybe some valve work) clutch(obviously) lightened pulleys, ecu for timing and etc. ie e6k/x.
At that point I should be going from the 98-100stock whp to about 145-155whp depending on how agressive the cam and head work is and if I end up getting the Jspec intake manifold.
At this point I will have spent 1500-2500 over the first yr or so of having the car.

Then boost. Spool Stage 1 kit with custom FMIC(already have ecu upgrade) and spool tubular manifold, t3/t4 turbo(maybe) and the spool CAI.

Since this kit makes the car normally go from 100whp to 150-160 on a stock engine I figure I can hit 200-210maybe215 whp.

That is enough to kill anything short of an evo or STi.

If you do want to kill an evo or STI then I suggest forged internals and a SPool stage 3/x or HiBoost running at 12psi for track use. That should be 4-5grand. yes its alot but for that power it about all you can do. Plus this will only make you close to the same as an STI, since they dyno around 252-258whp and you should be at 250 with 12psi and alot of tuning.

 

[Installshield 2]

Dude...that is exactly what I am currently working on...more or less...

I am working on ZE specs...(cams, manifold, compression)...with a T-25 set at about 5 psi...I know that will yeild over 200whp...probably over 220whp...and hell I am even going to bet it will easily do it on stock internals as long as my tuning is perfect...

Also, North American EVO's dyno at about 222whp to all 4 wheels...ANY 2800lb protege 2.0L turbo'd to 220+whp, an LSD, and good tires in the 215 width range will scare the s*** out of the EVO driver...You will get toasted on the hole shot, but if your launch is still pretty good, your front bumper will be all over his rear doors...IF you have 250+whp, you will still loose (probably worse) on the launch, but then glide right past him after the 1/8...

Remeber that hp/psi is functioned directly from static compression ratio among other things...a 10.5:1 FS will make more hp/psi than a 9.2:1 FS, given the same turbo setup is used...hopefully I will be making around 150whp NA and then go with 6psi of boost, I bet 6 psi with this setup will make more than 10hp/psi...and that is where I am getting the claim of around 220whp...With a TINY, fast spooling, silly little turbo...

 

[zmepro]

yea, that is what i think im gonna do, get some headers, then mabye cams then some other stuff (drivetrain) then ditch the headers and get a turbo

 

[Matthew]

shield you are the man, i just need to find someone that knows what the internal spec is on the stock piping and hks rear section....worst case i just have them weld on the muffler to a header-back exhaust right?

 

[deckedoutmp5]

Everyone Negated the use of nitrous...Best $$ per hp you can spend! Asjustable from 35-75hp! I said it before and i will say it again...200hp is easily attainable w/ nitrous..and don't forget...that all my mods leading up to 200hp..will still cost under 2k!!!

Chas

but its great having an extra 150 hp ALL THE TIME

i plan on running nitrous too. turbo tom is goin to help, he just helped my buddy figure out a turbo running 25 lbs on a zx2 with nitrous and will be running propane injection. turbo tom in the man. stay tuned for more hehe.

but na and then n2o would be great never use it unless you have to but nitrous and boost are VERY addictive. and dont say "i can control myself" cause ya know i thought i could and everyone else i know... wont happen. bottle be empy all the time. :mad: