Gi: Downpipe Or Ems

[jestermsp]

this is why nothing gets made cuz these threads just die. how bout we make a list with how much we are willing to invested in cpe before we even see a product or final cost. cmon if ya just bought a 07 cx7 then we know ya aint broke!

1. jestermsp $200

 

[www.cp-e.com]

this is why nothing gets made cuz these threads just die. how bout we make a list with how much we are willing to invested in cpe before we even see a product or final cost. cmon if ya just bought a 07 cx7 then we know ya aint broke!

1. jestermsp $200

This is a frustrating situation for all of us. Clearly, there are people on this board who wish to modify their CX7's, but their small numbers make producing new products hard to justify. Judging from the few responses we've received in the this thread, I'd imagine that this idea isn't going to pan out. With that said, we sincerely appreciate your efforts both in supporting the CX7 community and cp-e (usa)

Generally speaking, I think the CX7 community would prefer ease of installation and bang for the buck over big performance gains. I don't think many CX7 owners have ever installed a downpipe, let alone know what one is (not meant as an insult by any means). So I'm wondering if our Standback engine management isn't a better option for this community. The PnP option would allow average Joe enthusiast to plug in our EMS, flash one of our tunes, and immediately realize substatial gains for a modest price (about $835 for the PnP version, and $635 for the wire-in). So not only is the bang for the buck factor high, but the installation is as easy as plugging a hard drive into your computer.

We're very close to getting PnP connectors for the SPEED3/6, so I don't think CX7 connectors are out of the question. Since the hardware for our Standback is identical between all the cars, there are no development costs, no chance of wasted material, and we can satisfy small production runs with very little penalty.

And I'm sure people are curious about the performance gains. After increasing boost from 15.6psi to 17psi and changing the AFR to about 12:1, we gained about 30hp on a customer's MS6, and made about 50hp after 6000rpm (when the electronic throttle starts to limit boost). This was all without any changes to the ignition advance.

So maybe this is a better way to go for everyone, especially considering that we wouldn't need any money upfront like we would with the downpipe project. I'm still discussing this idea with our electrical engineer, and I'll let everyone know what his position on the matter is. I'd like to hear some comments from people about this too. Is this more appealing to you guys than a downpipe?


Jordan

 

[9Hooker]

... maybe.. what kind of resolution do your maps have? part throttle mapping too or just WOT?

Knowing this, every mod that changes air flow characteristics will also dick with your maps thus the need for custom maps for each application. Am I way off base here?

 

[HeavyH20]

I would definitely be interested in the EMS. In fact, with that, the CAI and BOV would now be be a wise investment. On the stock program, it seems these two items help marginally. With the EMS, they become more of a necessity.

I think that due to the simple install of each of the items as well as the EMS, they may make a good package. So, instead of a stand alone product, you make a good EMS tune assuming these two items, and then provide the three items as a tuned package. I also suspect the horsepower gains with all three in place would be better than a simple EMS on the stock ( a blinding statement of the obvious, ). So much so, the horsepower dyno and torque curve of the "package" will help drive some sales on the CAI and BOV. You could also have a stock only tune, but you can highlight the package EMS versus the CP-E tuned stock EMS and stock engine tune. It would be (should be) hard to resist the gains. (2thumbs)

Definitely count me in on the EMS. If you have an EMS tune assuming the BOV and CAI, count me in for those, as well.

 

[9Hooker]

In my opinion neither a BOV or CAI are a bottleneck in the system. I'm not saying they don't work. If you are looking for strictly performance a CAI and BOV are low on the totem pole.

Remember the hard intercooler piping on the Lancer EVO's (or was it WRX's) that replaced flexible piping that gained something like 12whp without touching anything else? I have a feeling something like that can be unlocked in the 7... I would go for a $500 top mount upgrade over a $200 intake and $xxx BOV, and $300 HID's (no offense to CP-E for selling the CAI... I'm down for one as soon as other things get accomplished)

 

[HeavyH20]

In my opinion neither a BOV or CAI are a bottleneck in the system. I'm not saying they don't work. If you are looking for strictly performance a CAI and BOV are low on the totem pole.

Remember the hard intercooler piping on the Lancer EVO's (or was it WRX's) that replaced flexible piping that gained something like 12whp without touching anything else? I have a feeling something like that can be unlocked in the 7... I would go for a $500 top mount upgrade over a $200 intake and $xxx BOV, and $300 HID's (no offense to CP-E for selling the CAI... I'm down for one as soon as other things get accomplished)

Agreed. The intake and BOV do little on stock tuning. But, with more boost offered by an EMS, the stock BOV may not be up to task. And, with things properly tuned, a less restrictive air intake will be key to getting things flowly correctly. I think this is the main reason for the less than stellar acceptance of these two products, they do little help stock tuned performance. That may change if CP-E adds an EMS product to the mix.

 

[jestermsp]

This is a frustrating situation for all of us. Clearly, there are people on this board who wish to modify their CX7's, but their small numbers make producing new products hard to justify. Judging from the few responses we've received in the this thread, I'd imagine that this idea isn't going to pan out. With that said, we sincerely appreciate your efforts both in supporting the CX7 community and cp-e (usa)

Generally speaking, I think the CX7 community would prefer ease of installation and bang for the buck over big performance gains. I don't think many CX7 owners have ever installed a downpipe, let alone know what one is (not meant as an insult by any means). So I'm wondering if our Standback engine management isn't a better option for this community. The PnP option would allow average Joe enthusiast to plug in our EMS, flash one of our tunes, and immediately realize substatial gains for a modest price (about $835 for the PnP version, and $635 for the wire-in). So not only is the bang for the buck factor high, but the installation is as easy as plugging a hard drive into your computer.

We're very close to getting PnP connectors for the SPEED3/6, so I don't think CX7 connectors are out of the question. Since the hardware for our Standback is identical between all the cars, there are no development costs, no chance of wasted material, and we can satisfy small production runs with very little penalty.

And I'm sure people are curious about the performance gains. After increasing boost from 15.6psi to 17psi and changing the AFR to about 12:1, we gained about 30hp on a customer's MS6, and made about 50hp after 6000rpm (when the electronic throttle starts to limit boost). This was all without any changes to the ignition advance.

So maybe this is a better way to go for everyone, especially considering that we wouldn't need any money upfront like we would with the downpipe project. I'm still discussing this idea with our electrical engineer, and I'll let everyone know what his position on the matter is. I'd like to hear some comments from people about this too. Is this more appealing to you guys than a downpipe?


Jordan

yea actually i was refering to the ems rather the downpipe. corksport is working on a cx7 exhaust as well. but ems i think you would be the only option. i plan on getting the tmic available now then would like a nice 18psi tune. regaurdless as soon as you make and ems system for the cx7 ill take one!

 

[www.cp-e.com]

... maybe.. what kind of resolution do your maps have? part throttle mapping too or just WOT?

Knowing this, every mod that changes air flow characteristics will also dick with your maps thus the need for custom maps for each application. Am I way off base here?

The maps have 30x30 tables for very fine resolution. You may also tune the car at any RPM or throttle position, so it doesn't need to be in an open loop or closed loop condition.

As far as maps go, there is of course some variability between tunes across different cars, but the difference is small. But since the mixture is unnessecarily rich, and the boost is consistent for all cars, we can lean the mixture out slightly, and increase boost by one or two pounds without risking a lean condition or overboost situation. So if we create a mild tune for a CX7 with an intake, then the tune should be valid for any other CX7 with an intake as well.

Now, if our canned tunes were aggressive, then yes, the differences from car to car would cause a problem. Our canned maps are meant be a starting point, and not a fully optimized tune. So if you want to push the envelope a little, the unit is fully adjustable and can be tuned right on a dyno.

I hope I interpreted your question correctly, but please let me know if I didn't.


Jordan

 

[9Hooker]

you did... and sign me up.

 

[jestermsp]

can we get it pretuned though? for example i plan on running the tmic, intake, hybrid bov, and tbe at around 18psi. would your base map be sufficient?

 

[jestermsp]

sorry if this is a double post but my comp is gettin screwey. i was wonderin if your pretuned base maps would be sufficient to run a tmic, cai, hybrid bov, and tbe at about 18psi. shooting for about 300hp what ya think?

 

[atticus1398]

Just traded my MSP in on a cx-7, definately interested in downpipe, catback, and ems. Also, I did not know you offered an intake. I will buy one of these as soon as I find a page on it.

Thanks,
Shane

 

[www.cp-e.com]

sorry if this is a double post but my comp is gettin screwey. i was wonderin if your pretuned base maps would be sufficient to run a tmic, cai, hybrid bov, and tbe at about 18psi. shooting for about 300hp what ya think?

Hmm, tough question. I (personally) think 18psi is high for this car because we didn't make any appreciable power with anything over 17psi. However, if the top mount intercooler has a lower pressure drop than the stock unit (up to 4psi pressure loss!!) then yes, 18psi is a reasonable boost pressure. Whether or not you'll make 300hp is a great unknown. As far as I know, the MS6 guys need a turbo upgrade to clear 300 wheel horsepower. So if you're talking at the crank, then absolutely, 300hp won't be a problem. But at the wheels, that may be a stretch.

Just traded my MSP in on a cx-7, definately interested in downpipe, catback, and ems. Also, I did not know you offered an intake. I will buy one of these as soon as I find a page on it.

Thanks,
Shane

Excellent to hear! You can order an intake directly from us, or one of our vendors:

http://www.cp-e.com/2035.html
www.therpmstore.com




I'm at home at the moment, but when I'm at the shop tomorrow I'll start a list of people interested in a Standback. I think if we can generate enough interest then we'll get the CX7 wiring diagrams and write some instructions up. We're also waiting for the PnP connectors to come in, and they should be arriving this week.


Jordan

 

[shadow1]

I'm totally interested in any performance parts for my CX-7. I would love for my CX-7 to have similar power numbers as my 05 Evo VIII (which has boost control, turboback exhaust, ECU reflash, etc). Right now I've been waiting for Corksport to finish their catback. We need a downpipe (preferably with a high flow cat) to realize maximize gains though. A PnP EMS solution will also be a lot easier than going to a shop for a reflash (or removing and FedEx'ing the ECU to a tuner for reflashing). So sign me up CP-E!

 

[1Sleepy93]

1. jestermsp: downpipe, catback, and ems
2. 1Sleepy93: ems, downpipe, catback

 

[shadow1]

1. jestermsp: downpipe, catback, and ems
2. 1Sleepy93: ems, downpipe, catback
3. shadow1: catback, downpipe, EMS

 

[jestermsp]

keep the list growing!!

 

[cx-7_racer]

1. jestermsp: downpipe, catback, and ems
2. 1Sleepy93: ems, downpipe, catback
3. shadow1: catback, downpipe, EMS
4. CX-7 Racer: downpipe, catback, and ems

 

[HeavyH20]

Add,

HeavyH20 - EMS and CAI from the RPMStore, right away. I will do the exhaust items a little later (downpipe and cat back).

 

[9Hooker]

i think we're talking CP-E stuff right now.. yes?