Everything brakes. Input please?

[Mid_Life_Crisis]

It's hard to comment on the rotors since you mentioned the weight savings benefit. I personally don't know how noticeable the weight will be. The heat dissipation shouldn't be a selling point unless the car will be on the track as well, IMO. I know you autocross too though, so hopefully I can remember to follow up on whatever decision you make and read how you like it .

Look at it this way. People spend a small fortune to save three or four pounds per wheel when buying new rims. Saving three pounds in a rotor is the same effect. Rims and rotors are both unsprung weight, which is always good to reduce (makes the suspension more responsive). They are also rotating mass that has to be spun by the engine, so reducing it helps acceleration. In addition, the mass of the rims/tires/rotors acts like a flywheel, in that once they are spinning, they want to keep spinning, which means the reduced weight will affect how quickly your car responds to brake pressure. I don`t know exactly how significant that last effect is, but it is there.

 

[mysleeper6]

Saving three pounds off a rotor will not be as significant as saving three pounds on a wheel because of a shorter moment arm (the distance from the center of the rotational mass), but it will still make a difference, but I don't know if it will be something you can feel. I saved 7 pounds per corner with RX-8 wheels and General Exclaim UHP tires (225/40/18) over stock MS6 wheels and Kumho Ecsta ASX tires in the same size and I definitely could tell a difference.

 

[vtakk]

Saving three pounds off a rotor will not be as significant as saving three pounds on a wheel because of a shorter moment arm

truth.

 

[cymx5]

sleeper, that's the same thought I am using. My tires squealed constantly with the ones that were on the car when I purchased it. They were 5lbs heavier than stock per corner, and they 'skipped' under even moderate acceleration. I put the factory wheels back on and 'wala!' no more squealling and much more comfortable.

 

[Mid_Life_Crisis]

I said it was the same "effect". I wasn`t trying to say it was identical. Poor wording on my part, I guess.

 

[H3br3w_Ham3r]

As listed below I have the Goodridge lines, and the Hawk Plus brake pads and I'm happy with them. The pads work excellent once bedded, however they are very noisy and dusty, too much for the street, but great for the track. I take them off after track days, The nice thing about the Hawks is that the material is the same as the stock pads, so I don't have to machine or change rotors when switching between the two types of pads. The Goodridge lines are well made.

For the brake fluid, I use Motul RBF 600. I use this for both street and track.

For the rotors, I would go with the light weight rotors. In the future, anytime I can save weight on the front of the car I will. This car is front heavy.

I noticed that you don't have a RSB, that would be a good addition to your set up. I have the Hotchkis sway bars, only the rear is now installed and it makes a difference. I plan on having the front installed soon.


07 Silver MS3, Mazdaspeed CAI, Mazdaspeed CBE, Mazdaspeed coilovers, TWM short shifter and bushings, SU rear engine mount, Hotchkins RS, Cobb shifter weight, Cobb turbo intake, Goodridge stainless steel brake lines, Motul RBF600 brake fluid, Hawk plus pads (track only), RE-01's (track only), Dashhawk, Fuel-Filler door.

That is also something that will be done before spring. I'm looking at the Hotchkis bar and getting some adjustable AWR rear endlinks as well.

 

[FCNutCase]

HPS and HP+

Correct Racing Brake has just released some one piece rotors that are 3.75 lbs lighter than stock so you would be saving some considerable weight.

A complete set is $390 for slotted so the price is unbeatable.

I would go with the HP+ pads, better intial bite ove HPS.

You can read more about the rotors here:

http://www.mazdas247.com/forum/showthread.php?t=123762238

Also we have bundle deals for all of above!

I autocross my MS3 regularly for the last 2 years. I switched from Stock to HPS to HP+. I was impressed with the bite of the Hawks, but their is one problem that I could never get away from - they are very non-linear.

In other words, their is a sharp ramp-up in their stopping power near maximum braking force. So, if you're trying to maximum brake to a certain speed in an autocross, it's almost impossible to hit that point, because you'll be stopping at a steady rate, you adjust with a bit more pressure, then all of a sudden the car stops like you dropped anchor! This is safe to be sure, but f**king frustrating when you're autocrossing and you're looking for consistent performance. I've asked around the autocross clubs here in So Cal, and many people looked at me like a dope and said, " you didn't know that already? Hawks are not linear near maximum friction, and everyone knows that".

I've just purchased Porterfield R4-S pads, which were strongly recommended by the autocrossers in my area. I'm spoiled, because many of the people I was asking are national champions- it's great to have access to decades of experience.

I'll post how they perform after next weekend - ProSolo at El Toro!

Cheers,
Collin

 

[freeflyfreak]

I'd go OEM or equivalent blank rotors.
Motul 600 (I have boiled Ate blue)
Pads cant speak to, I just bought some Carbotech XP-12 to try for my Front track pads.

 

[mortimersnerd]

Gotta say I agree with staying stock on the rotors. You're not going to see a huge benefit to going to lighter rotors for autocrossing unless you're a stellar driver or on an extremely bumpy surface. Do the lines and more aggressive pads, which will wear out your rotors faster. That'll give you a great excuse to upgrade the rotors at that point.

 

[FCNutCase]

Porterfield R4-s

I autocross my MS3 regularly for the last 2 years. I switched from Stock to HPS to HP+. I was impressed with the bite of the Hawks, but their is one problem that I could never get away from - they are very non-linear.

In other words, their is a sharp ramp-up in their stopping power near maximum braking force. So, if you're trying to maximum brake to a certain speed in an autocross, it's almost impossible to hit that point, because you'll be stopping at a steady rate, you adjust with a bit more pressure, then all of a sudden the car stops like you dropped anchor! This is safe to be sure, but f**king frustrating when you're autocrossing and you're looking for consistent performance. I've asked around the autocross clubs here in So Cal, and many people looked at me like a dope and said, " you didn't know that already? Hawks are not linear near maximum friction, and everyone knows that".

I've just purchased Porterfield R4-S pads, which were strongly recommended by the autocrossers in my area. I'm spoiled, because many of the people I was asking are national champions- it's great to have access to decades of experience.

I'll post how they perform after next weekend - ProSolo at El Toro!

Cheers,
Collin

I've now spent a day on Porterfield R4-S pads, Corksport SS Lines, and ATE Super Blue DOT 4 Fluid. Can't say the one thing that made the difference since I've made more than one change. But I can say it's a world of difference. I had Stock lines, stock fluid, Hawk HPS pads. I was unhappy with the non-linear nature of the Hawk pads vs stock, with all else being equal.

I can say now that everything is firmer - pedal, e-Brake handle, etc. They seem very linear, and very direct, with good initial bite.


Tomorrow - El Toro SCCA Pro Solo Event. I'll let you know what I find, but so far, so very damn good!

Cheers,

Collin Webster
'89 RX-7 Turbo
'08 MazdaSpeed 3

All cars must live on the track to live in my house!

 

[FCNutCase]

I've now spent a day on Porterfield R4-S pads, Corksport SS Lines, and ATE Super Blue DOT 4 Fluid. Can't say the one thing that made the difference since I've made more than one change. But I can say it's a world of difference. I had Stock lines, stock fluid, Hawk HPS pads. I was unhappy with the non-linear nature of the Hawk pads vs stock, with all else being equal.

I can say now that everything is firmer - pedal, e-Brake handle, etc. They seem very linear, and very direct, with good initial bite.


Tomorrow - El Toro SCCA Pro Solo Event. I'll let you know what I find, but so far, so very damn good!

Cheers,

Collin Webster
'89 RX-7 Turbo
'08 MazdaSpeed 3

All cars must live on the track to live in my house!

Well, completed the weekend, the car did 12 autocross runs. My driving wasn't the best, but one thing that was great was the brakes. Very linear, very firm, fantastic stopping power from the first application all the way to maximum panic stop. In fact, it stopped so hard, the gear shifter actually popped out of 2nd and into neutral with out me touching it!

All in all, this was one of the best mods for my car - Corksport SS lines and Porterfield R4-S Pads, and ATE Super Blue Fluid are a heck of a combo!

Cheers,
Collin Webster

 

[bacarl]

Old thread, but wanted to thank FCNutCase for the info in his last three posts. Nice to have some useful info posted.

Upgrade you're dampeners befour you're breaks.

Kain: hilarious! I can't believe this was lost on everyone in this thread [facepalm]

 

[Breezy]

Lightweight rotors won't be able to dissapate as much heat, which is what brakes do. I wouldn't get too excited about it myself.

BTW, EBC has a special for SCCA members (maybe NASA too) where you can get 2 sets of pads for about $200. They even will do custom pads. I just got my set of ECB blues (not a pad they make in production) for the MS3. I haven't put them on yet but I will soon. They spec out to be exceptional pads.