Cx-5 Pro Parts Coil Over kit

[MikeM.]

front camber spec on a fwd car for a dd can be anywhere from -.8 to -1.3 without seeing camber tire wear...

Hmmm...I just inspected my winter tires using a tire tread gauge (5000+ miles of mostly curvy state and county roads) and the wear across the tread is amazingly flat. I wasn't expecting that because I've been cornering pretty hard. This is with OEM camber but I've never had it checked.

Some of my driving is on icy roads and I would be concerned about safety in a number of situations if I dialed in more camber than normal OEM specs.

Specifically, cornering on icy surfaces. When traction is that low you need all you can get and since cornering forces are so low, the suspension is not being loaded (which is the usual reason more neg. camber is used to increase grip). I'm concerned I would lose corner grip in this (important) situation.

Also, deer are pretty prevalent and can dart onto the road without warning. Pretty common for the results to be serious. My friend lost his life a couple of years ago from an elk strike. So, it's important to have excellent stopping ability on moments notice. Fortunately, the CX-5 performs better than average here. Even a small deer can easily total a car even if no one is seriously injured. But running more camber than OEM typically increases stopping distances. This is true regardless if it's wet, dry or icy/snowy. While OEM camber settings might not provide the fastest lap times on a dry race track, they are optimized for safety by minimizing stopping distances and maximizing traction on slippery surfaces. I have no plans to take a SUV to the track! LOL! But the car does see plenty of winter conditions. Currently, my CX-5 tracks exceptionally well on ice, better than most other cars on the road from my experience and from watching them slide around while I am securely tracking. And yes, tires are the single most important variable but secure tracking and stopping can be compromised by a number of factors.

I just don't believe that most modern daily drivers would benefit from an increase in negative camber.

 

[apexanimal]

^ not that most dd's would even know what camber is...

i do my own alignments and whatnot, and with better than stock tires (which by and large - suck horribly), around a degree of negative camber up front (isn't drastic by any means), especially when we're talking about a 55-65 series tire, you'll still see a decrease in stopping distance, better turn-in, and more stable corners... but i'm not trying to convince you.

sorry to hear about your friend...

 

[MikeM.]

i do my own alignments and whatnot, and with better than stock tires (which by and large - suck horribly), around a degree of negative camber up front (isn't drastic by any means), especially when we're talking about a 55-65 series tire, you'll still see a decrease in stopping distance, better turn-in, and more stable corners... but i'm not trying to convince you.

But that's well within the spec recommended by Mazda. It sounded like you were suggesting a spec that deviated from Mazda's approved range.

Are you not familiar with the factory recommended range for camber?

Which begs the question "decrease in stopping distance, better turn-in and more stable corners compared to what?"

 

[brainbasher]

Where were the coilovers sourced from I have only seen them on Japanese sites.

 

[Chris_Top_Her]

Actually I noticed that you can import the Jap coil overs for less http://usa.auto-style.jp/?pkey=parts_free_word&id=&page=3&max=20&free_text=cx-5

 

[pt00323i]

with only a beefier rear sway bar, light wheels, good tires, adjusting tire pressures, and a good alignment, it will really liven it up even more... mazda does a good job with chassis tuning, but with a few minor details (without getting into c/o's, caster, etc) it can be even more fun...

someone please make the larger sway, I've contacted racing beat they said maybe after 14 mazda6, Cork never reply, I hope others will make it in a year or so.

 

[apexanimal]

But that's well within the spec recommended by Mazda. It sounded like you were suggesting a spec that deviated from Mazda's approved range.

Are you not familiar with the factory recommended range for camber?

Which begs the question "decrease in stopping distance, better turn-in and more stable corners compared to what?"

we've been through this in another thread... the stock camber specs in front call for -0,21', rear -0,52'... this was posted by another member from the service manual...

so please be sure to check before you insinuate that i'm not aware...

someone please make the larger sway, I've contacted racing beat they said maybe after 14 mazda6, Cork never reply, I hope others will make it in a year or so.

it'll happen... on vehicles like this its a super simple upgrade that typically really helps response and the typical understeering characteristics... i am a bit surprised corksport hasn't come out with one yet considering they have the springs already...

 

[MikeM.]

we've been through this in another thread... the stock camber specs in front call for -0,21', rear -0,52'... this was posted by another member from the service manual...

so please be sure to check before you insinuate that i'm not aware...

Mazda doesn't expect the alignment technician to be able to hit an exact spec - that's one reason why they supply a range of acceptable values.

For the front wheels with a half tank of fuel but no passengers or luggage it is between 1.35 degrees negative camber and 0.65 degrees positive camber.

Mazda also specifies the difference in camber between left and right wheels should not exceed 1.5 degrees. That just means the two wheels shouldn't be near the opposite ends of the 2 degree specification range.

Your recommendation of "about 1 degree negative camber" is well within the range that Mazda represents as being within spec and only 0.6 of a degree from the mid-point of Mazda's recommended range.

 

[apexanimal]

Thanks for speaking to me as though I don't understand mike...

One, if you don't think .6 of a degree will make a difference, then you probably don't really care about this topic as I'm trying to speak about it...
Two, if you think that a 1.5 degree cross-camber difference is okay walking out of a dealer, or any alignment shop for that matter, then have at it... The cars handling difference from left to right would be creepy at best, and downright dangerous in many situations...
Lastly, I realize what I recommended is within what mazda will allow for - which is quite different from what is ideal and recommends...

 

[MikeM.]

I realize what I recommended is within what mazda will allow for - which is quite different from what is ideal and recommends...

There is no single ideal setting - that's why Mazda specifies a rather wide range with the target in the middle and probably why you think that isn't enough negative camber for the typical driver. The ideal camber for a car that typically carries a solo driver on dry pavement is not the same as for a car that is often loaded with skiers and luggage on a icy road. As the car is loaded to it's GVWR, the camber of the wheels becomes more negative (and more negative yet as the loaded car hits a typical compression dip at speed). And the more negative the camber, the harder it will be to maintain traction on slippery ice. When Mazda specifies a camber spec, they need to insure that it will result in safe handling under a wide range of vehicle loads and road conditions. If it sounded like I talk to you as if you don't know anything, it's probably because you come off as sounding like you think you know better than the people who designed the specification in the first place when you make nearly blanket statements as in the following:

the factory camber is VERY mild and more would be good for all but a car that only sees straight highways...

As someone who has driven all kinds of cars, vans, suv's and trucks (including commercially) back and forth to a ski area every winter for the last 32 years (and the road is not a straight highway) I know what's important, not only to simply make it up the hill but to keep the vehicle between the lines when there is treacherous ice. And the last thing I want is to be behind the wheel of a fully loaded vehicle that some know-it-all thought they could improve the handling by dialing in more negative camber. The reason why this is a big no-no is because under slippery conditions, those in which it is necessary to have maximum traction just to stay on the road, there is so little traction that there is no significant weight shift to the outside of the turn and the tread does not have enough traction to want to "tuck under". You want your tread flat on the icy surface. Even on dry pavement negative camber reduces the available corner grip of the inside tires. This is accepted because it improves the grip of the more heavily weighted (outside) tires more than it reduces the grip of the inside tires. But on ice, dialing in more negative camber is a double whammy. If the car is heavily loaded the effect is even worse due to the way that extra weight compresses the suspension more and increases the amount of negative camber.

So, yes, I take exception to your statement that Mazda's spec is "too mild" and more negative camber would be good for all CX-5's except those that only see straight highways. That is not only a dangerous statement but demonstrates a lack of understanding. The spec is not what it is because Mazda catered to the mythical driver that rarely travels on anything but straight highways, they designed it to be safe and effective under a wide range of loads and road conditions.

 

[apexanimal]

Shame on me for thinking you actually asked a question... in my heart i knew you were making a statement... i only blame myself... I've been tricked before and took another chance for happiness... (sadbanana)

 

[MikeM.]

Shame on me for thinking you actually asked a question... in my heart i knew you were making a statement... i only blame myself... I've been tricked before and took another chance for happiness... (sadbanana)

Fair enough.

But please don't think that I tricked you into believing the content of the answer you provided.

 

[Chris_Top_Her]

Fair enoug
But please don't think that I tricked you into believing the content of the answer you provided.

Why do you feel the need to turn most threads you visit into an argument? You always try to make some stupid point, even looking s*** up just to support your statement, or disprove someone else's. You act like a douchebag know it all here and frankly, it's ******* annoying. People can't even ask simple question without some stupid remark such as a generic "if it ain't broke don't fix it". I mean someone asked about changing their exhaust and you put a lame ass herp derp remark about you seeing nothing wrong with the stock exhaust.. come on. This is a forum about cars. People will mod their s***, just because you don't approve, or it lessens performance in certain area doesn't mean you need act negative or hostile towards the poster. I mean if you act like this when you socialize in person, I don't see how anyone could stand you.

 

[MikeM.]

Why do you feel the need to turn most threads you visit into an argument? You always try to make some stupid point, even looking s*** up just to support your statement, or disprove someone else's. You act like a douchebag know it all here and frankly, it's ******* annoying. People can't even ask simple question without some stupid remark such as a generic "if it ain't broke don't fix it". I mean someone asked about changing their exhaust and you put a lame ass herp derp remark about you seeing nothing wrong with the stock exhaust.. come on. This is a forum about cars. People will mod their s***, just because you don't approve, or it lessens performance in certain area doesn't mean you need act negative or hostile towards the poster. I mean if you act like this when you socialize in person, I don't see how anyone could stand you.

Sorry if you're not enjoying my perspectives. I recommend you skip over them in the future (my posts have a black dog icon so they are easy to spot without having to read them).

What makes forums great is the ability to exchange ideas. No one will agree with all of the information presented (at least I hope not!). The good thing about forums is that if some of the information is misleading or inaccurate, someone else may provide a different perspective. Of course it's up to every individual to weigh and balance and take everything with a grain of salt (sometimes a very large one, lol!)

What we don't need are self-styled sensors who try to censure dissenting opinions or facts they don't want to hear.

I have nothing against people modding their own vehicles to their hearts content. Hopeful they will be knowledgeable and informed of some of the side effects and compromises involved before they finalize their plans.

I'm sorry you disagree.

 

[Chris_Top_Her]

Sorry if you're not enjoying my perspectives. I recommend you skip over them in the future (my posts have a black dog icon so they are easy to spot without having to read them).

What makes forums great is the ability to exchange ideas. No one will agree with all of the information presented (at least I hope not!). The good thing about forums is that if some of the information is misleading or inaccurate, someone else may provide a different perspective. Of course it's up to every individual to weigh and balance and take everything with a grain of salt (sometimes a very large one, lol!)

What we don't need are self-styled sensors who try to censure dissenting opinions or facts they don't want to hear.

I have nothing against people modding their own vehicles to their hearts content. Hopeful they will be knowledgeable and informed of some of the side effects and compromises involved before they finalize their plans.

I'm sorry you disagree.

It's not about censoring facts people don't want to hear, or correcting a wrong piece of information . It's the arrogant and or demeaning manner in which you respond to other posters, sometimes without even addressing the question asked. Just because know more about a topic from experience (or looked it up) doesn't mean you have to be disrespectful to others when you post.

 

[MikeM.]

You always try to make some stupid point, even looking s*** up just to support your statement, or disprove someone else's. You act like a douchebag know it all here and frankly, it's ******* annoying

This kind of hateful personal attack is uncalled for here.

It's the arrogant and or demeaning manner in which you respond to other posters, sometimes without even addressing the question asked.

If you think my contributions here lack style points, you need to take a look in the mirror.

Hint: You can start at the top of this page.

 

[Chris_Top_Her]

Your a disrespectful PoS. Bottom line. Therefore, I'll call you out on it however and whenever. Your generally smart alec/patronizing comments are uncalled for here. If you think you're being funny, you're not.

 

[brainbasher]

If people have no interest in springs/coilovers, why would you try to convince others to have no interest, and why would you even check out this tread if you have no interest in the topic. If I saw a thread titled "I wanna leave my s*** stock" guess what, I have no interest in posting about why you should lower the vehicle or even any interest in posting in the thread.

The point is every one is entitled to their opinions but don't try to alter peoples opinions because you don't like it.

PS If I could I would slam the hell out of MY CX5 , some air suspension would be the s***. I would love to park it hard.

 

[MikeM.]

If people have no interest in springs/coilovers, why would you try to convince others to have no interest, and why would you even check out this tread if you have no interest in the topic.

I haven't seen any posts in this thread from people not interested in coilovers, nor have I seen anyone trying to dissuade someone not to have any interest. If you re-read the thread you will see that it is a discussion of the effects one might expect from various changes in alignment parameters that such a suspension mod might have and how those changes might impact driving dynamics in different situations.

And yes, making changes to these things WILL change driving dynamics. Isn't that the primary point of spending money on new suspension components? I have a long history of upgrading the suspensions of just about every vehicle I've owned, cars as well as motorcycles. It's one of my primary interests in vehicle performance. Of course everything in this world is a compromise, the important thing is to understand how these compromises will affect the intended use of the vehicle.

Discussing a negative consequence of a modification is not trying to dissuade someone, it's to increase understanding. It's probably not a bright idea to modify your suspension until you know what you are doing and how it will affect your intended usage.

BTW, our CX-5's come with coilovers from the factory. The difference with these is they have an adjustable spring pre-load collar and probably different spring lengths and rates as well as different damping rates. It would be nice if people were discussing specifics such as this rather than stooping to ridiculous personal attacks with little substance.

 

[MikeM.]

Your a disrespectful PoS. Bottom line. Therefore, I'll call you out on it however and whenever. Your generally smart alec/patronizing comments are uncalled for here. If you think you're being funny, you're not.

Wow! I think you need to re-read your own messages to see who's being disrespectful here.

It's rare to see someone so disconnected from reality, even on an Internet forum.

What is this world coming to?