Any chance we ever see an AWD CX5 with MT in the US?

[soobaerodude]

Yep. I concur. I've been looking at the sportwagen as well. Manual vs Manual. That thing holds a TON. Maybe more than the CX-5, especially longer cargo.

I will second this. I was looking at the Sportwagen TDI for a long time and never considered any SUVs until the CX-5 came along with it's MT MPG

 

[pt00323i]

I wouldn't mind AWD w/ 6sp

I've almost bought VW SW TDI but after reading all the HPFP issues, I 'm staying away, even my vw/audi mechanic said they don't make it like they use to, the older 1.9L TDI's. I sure hope Mazda is not using Bosch FP on their Diesel.

 

[soobaerodude]

I wouldn't mind AWD w/ 6sp

I've almost bought VW SW TDI but after reading all the HPFP issues, I 'm staying away, even my vw/audi mechanic said they don't make it like they use to, the older 1.9L TDI's. I sure hope Mazda is not using Bosch FP on their Diesel.

The HPFP issue with the SW TDI is exactly the reason why I stayed away

 

[ta240]

The problem with the jetta sportwagon is it is shaped too much like a suppository, in our car shopping I didn't look at it for more than 2 seconds before moving on. The problem with most VW's is a complete lack of style. They are just boring looking.

I see it all the time on forums online, 'MT's would sell like crazy' then the MT cars sit on the dealer lots for month after month with little interest. Car enthusiasts tend to know and associate with other car enthusiasts and message boards tend to attract enthusiasts which greatly skews the projected numbers from real world numbers. I checked a local Subaru dealers site and about 20% of their cars (160 total cars) were MT, which was more than I thought there would be. However there is no way Mazda would steel all the MT customers from Subaru if they offered more, they'd just split the market to where neither company would sell enough MT's to make them really profitable in multiple trim levels.

Dealers can only stock a limited number of cars which is why some car companies are shrinking the number of trim levels and factory options to make it simpler. If you have 6 different colors, and 4 different trim levels and 3 major option groups and 2wd/4wd you are already looking at 144 different combinations and that isn't even working in combining the option groups and then you add 2 transmissions and 2 engines to the mix and you are at 576 different combinations. And that is just for one model. And you've got a recipe for "but I want a different car than what you have"

Back when VW decided not to bring the Scirracco to the US I read that the dealers here didn't want it because it would water down their GTI sales. My first thought was that was crazy, why not offer another choice and get a few more buyers. But the problem as above is then they have to stock a range of yet another car that overlaps quite a bit with a current one they offer. Less choices makes it easier for them in a lot of ways. Plus it is expensive paying the interest on the cars that sit on the lot.

It is a similar thing with diesels, a car company has to find new diesel customers not just steal them from VW if they want to be successful and that isn't going to be as easy as the vocal few online believe. A good start at changing people's perception of diesels would be to crush every one that is spewing smoke everywhere it goes on the road now.

 

[CX-SV]

The problem with the jetta sportwagon is it is shaped too much like a suppository, in our car shopping I didn't look at it for more than 2 seconds before moving on. The problem with most VW's is a complete lack of style. They are just boring looking.

I see it all the time on forums online, 'MT's would sell like crazy' then the MT cars sit on the dealer lots for month after month with little interest. Car enthusiasts tend to know and associate with other car enthusiasts and message boards tend to attract enthusiasts which greatly skews the projected numbers from real world numbers. I checked a local Subaru dealers site and about 20% of their cars (160 total cars) were MT, which was more than I thought there would be. However there is no way Mazda would steel all the MT customers from Subaru if they offered more, they'd just split the market to where neither company would sell enough MT's to make them really profitable in multiple trim levels.

Dealers can only stock a limited number of cars which is why some car companies are shrinking the number of trim levels and factory options to make it simpler. If you have 6 different colors, and 4 different trim levels and 3 major option groups and 2wd/4wd you are already looking at 144 different combinations and that isn't even working in combining the option groups and then you add 2 transmissions and 2 engines to the mix and you are at 576 different combinations. And that is just for one model. And you've got a recipe for "but I want a different car than what you have"

Back when VW decided not to bring the Scirracco to the US I read that the dealers here didn't want it because it would water down their GTI sales. My first thought was that was crazy, why not offer another choice and get a few more buyers. But the problem as above is then they have to stock a range of yet another car that overlaps quite a bit with a current one they offer. Less choices makes it easier for them in a lot of ways. Plus it is expensive paying the interest on the cars that sit on the lot.

.

Good points. When we talk about take-rate on MT's we are not talking about Porsche 911/Boxsters, we are talking about crossover/SUVs (and we are not talking about station wagons either).

In the US market people actually want the ride height (chair-like height for driving in traffic) and (snow) clearance of a SUV, not a station wagon and they prove it by buying crossover SUV's by the tens of thousands each year. (Example of the numbers are the Sportwagon at 59.2 inches tall versus CX-5 at 65.7 inches, and the CX-5 outselling Sportwagon by 2x in US market)

btw-speaking of Subaru. Both the very successful Forrester and Outback are now SUV's, both designated as SUV's by Subaru and have the height of 65.9 and 65.8 inches (taller than CRV and CX-5 for example).

 

[mazda3NH]

I know my local Mazda dealership can't keep the MT CX5 on the lot. They sell almost as soon as they arrive. However, they do currently have 7 ATs on the lot.

I'm not suggesting they sell more MT than AT, but they're having zero difficulty selling them and have admitted that almost every single buyer who has bought a MT, would have bought it in AWD instead of FWD if it was available.

 

[CX-SV]

I know my local Mazda dealership can't keep the MT CX5 on the lot. They sell almost as soon as they arrive. However, they do currently have 7 ATs on the lot.

I'm not suggesting they sell more MT than AT, but they're having zero difficulty selling them and have admitted that almost every single buyer who has bought a MT, would have bought it in AWD instead of FWD if it was available.

Sounds like their inventory control system is working fine. And the 7 remaining AT CX-5's will sell faster (or turn faster) than any Mazda model at the dealership and generate higher revenue and profit margins than the few MT's sold. Good business model and inventory planning.

 

[mazda3NH]

Dude, do you work for Mazda or something? My god do you homer up every possible thing they do.

For your information, the owner of the dealership wants the CX5 AWD available in MT and also available in Diesel. He has zero concerns about selling them and turning a profit.

And I'm aware what Subaru has done to the Outback. The new car is no where near as fun to drive as the old model. Handling sucks in comparison. Hence why I am looking for other alternatives that are fun to drive and offer good fuel economy. Those options are the CX-5 and the Sportwagen. I'd like it to be the CX5 as I'm on my second Mazda 3 and they are my favorite brand. Only have the AWD car out of necessity due to our winters.

 

[CX-SV]

Dude, do you work for Mazda or something? My god do you homer up every possible thing they do.

For your information, the owner of the dealership wants the CX5 AWD available in MT and also available in Diesel. He has zero concerns about selling them and turning a profit.

And I'm aware what Subaru has done to the Outback. The new car is no where near as fun to drive as the old model. Handling sucks in comparison. Hence why I am looking for other alternatives that are fun to drive and offer good fuel economy. Those options are the CX-5 and the Sportwagen. I'd like it to be the CX5 as I'm on my second Mazda 3 and they are my favorite brand. Only have the AWD car out of necessity due to our winters.

Dude, I don't work for Mazda. My other car is Lexus and a Mercedes, so much for loyalty to Mazda, lol.(boom01). I don't have a favorite brand and have owned Ford, GM, Honda, Acura, Porsche, Jag, and Mercedes vehicles, not just Mazdas. And I prefer my sport sedans to be rwd, so I have no interest in owning 6's or any other Mazdas currently. Mazda is running a business, that's my background too, so I understand business decisions.

Good for your dealership owner, the more breadth in products, the better for his business from his narrow view of the world. He does not represent the larger Mazda corporate, nor does he have the resources that they do.

Like you, I always have 1 AWD SUV in my fleet, due to snow use in high Sierra mountains (Lake Tahoe area).

 

[mazda3NH]

He doesn't have a narrow view of the world, just the reality of what drivers want in this area. He loses business to Subaru everyday due to a lack of MT on an AWD offering. He also has numerous Wrangler, Xterra and FJ drivers looking for a more fuel efficient AWD/4WD alternative in a MT. Believe it or not, many people who buy those vehicles do so because of the transmission, not because they want the off road capability.

 

[CX-SV]

He doesn't have a narrow view of the world, just the reality of what drivers want in this area. He loses business to Subaru everyday due to a lack of MT on an AWD offering. He also has numerous Wrangler, Xterra and FJ drivers looking for a more fuel efficient AWD/4WD alternative in a MT. Believe it or not, many people who buy those vehicles do so because of the transmission, not because they want the off road capability.

Not believing it (not that it matters here), we see far more Wranglers and Subies sold in California and I know how they are equipped (and Xterras and FJs are old/dead news). Don't care about his narrow view of the world, in light of the topic here, not relavent.

And now back to the CX-5, AWD, MT (topic presented by OP)....

 

[mazda3NH]

What's the point of having a discussion? You apparently know all the answers and are unwilling or accepting of anyone else's POV.

On diesel, I point out 85% of Sportwagens sold are diesel. You don't think think Mazda can be successful with the diesel and point out all the cards stacked against it. The exact same cards the sportswagen is playing and winning with. I present data, you present opinion. But, I'm wrong?

I point out real life experience of what MT drivers are looking for; you, "Nope, nope, mazda is doing the right thing only offering it in entry level FWD."

I guess this is where my participation in a conversation with you ends. Enjoy your boring ass automatic.

 

[CX-SV]

What's the point of having a discussion? You apparently know all the answers and are unwilling or accepting of anyone else's POV.

On diesel, I point out 85% of Sportwagens sold are diesel. You don't think think Mazda can be successful with the diesel and point out all the cards stacked against it. The exact same cards the sportswagen is playing and winning with. I present data, you present opinion. But, I'm wrong?

I point out real life experience of what MT drivers are looking for; you, "Nope, nope, mazda is doing the right thing only offering it in entry level FWD."

I guess this is where my participation in a conversation with you ends. Enjoy your boring ass automatic.

Thanks. You are so kind. And I do acknowledge and understand your POV.

 

[Suddueth13]

Seeing a gas powered AWD manual CX-5 is probably slim to none at least at the current moment. If they were to offer it at all it would probably be with the diesel but again, even that's not looking promising. I can understand from a business perspective of not building them in volume but I think it would be perfectly viable for them to offer it as an order option.

 

[CX-SV]

Agreed, it would be nice to offer the MT with AWD as a option, not sure for Mazda if the economics (including revenue/profit) justifies the cost of emissions certification, increase in in inventory carrying costs and production costs, etc. I suspect Mazda did the analysis and we now know/see the outcome.

The diesel and 2.5L options might make more business sense from Mazda's perspective as extra charge options with significant incremental revenue and profit implications.


Note: As I said earlier, I predict the take rate for either of the 2 optional extra charge engines (2.5L or diesel) to be under 50% or not be the predominate engine in the US market for CX-5. But that by no means means either of those engines would be a business failure, even with that sub 50% take-rate.