Engine Oil Rise

[baronx]

2. The dipstick X should be at 24mm above max not 13mm as manufactured. I WAS SKEPTICAL ABOUT THIS! However I was honestly told and I have no reason to disbelieve them that it was a calculation error. The same engine using the same method of DPF regen is in the Mazda 6 just without skyactive elements and the X is apparently at 24mm on this model.

Calculation error ?? what a load of crap !!

Sorry to say, but unless I see some figures around how Mazda did that calculation & where they got it wrong initially, I'm convinced they are only doing this to hide the problem.

We in Australia were "honestly" told by Mazda that there were no issues with the new CX-5 Diesel.

 

[GiddyGoanna]

I purchased a CX5 diesel in July. Was told at delivery to check engine oil level every 1000km.

Queried what I thought to be such a short interval. Haven't owned a diesel before, so followed procedure.

Received notification from Mazda about engine oil rising and the need for vigilance, explanation of X mark on dipstick.

I normally travel around 9000km every six months. No trips were less than 10km in length. No stop/start traffic, plenty of highway travel.

I watched the oil level rise to just beneath the X @ 7000km, serviced @ 8000km just on X mark. (19/12/12)

Drove 100km home, oil level was almost to X mark (shocked) I put this down to overfilling by service dept. "We put in the textbook 5.1 litres of oil"
They drained 600ml of oil, reading was midway between low and full indicators.
BTW, this is the most difficult vehicle I have owned to get an accurate reading of oil level.

No mention of software update or replacement dipstick when I voiced my concerns of rising oil levels.

Thanks for all the posts, much appreciated, am following with interest!
Hoping oil dilution will decrease with bedding in of motor, Mazda can ill-afford to damage the enviable reputation that it trades on!

 

[Morsa]

Sorry to say it but. welcome to the High Oil Club, membership all around the world.

 

[apexanimal]

Just for the record... Subarus are most annoying car I've ever worked on in regards to the dipstick... It doesn't read the bottom only the top 3 quarts- ish... And it has to be warm but not run in 10 minutes or so... Etc.. Annoying

 

[baronx]

The new dipstick has arrived and surprise surprise.. the X mark has been raised by 12mm.

Here is an image comparison: http://goo.gl/lme2d

OLD DIPSTICK
Code: SH01 10 450A
Low Mark: 8-9mm
Full Mark: 29-30mm
X Mark: 43mm
Twist: 60mm

NEW DIPSTICK
Code: SH01 10 450B
Low Mark: 8-9mm
Full Mark: 29-30mm
X Mark: 55mm (mark is fainter than before)
Twist: 71mm

Overall length of the dipsticks & location of low & full marks seems to be same. The X mark has definitely been raised by 12mm which raises a very serious question - If Mazda was so confident that their PCM update will fix the issue, then what was the need of raising the X mark?

The Mazda service technician also advised that the new instructions with the dipstick state that less oil needs to be filled at the time of service.

Only time will tell if the PCM “update” actually fixes anything, but I’ve lost any faith that I had in Mazda after all this !

 

[CX-SV]

The Mazda service technician also advised that the new instructions with the dipstick state that less oil needs to be filled at the time of service.

So did Mazda provide a revised page for your owners manual with new oil capacity specs?


For example, listed in US owners manual is this (2.0L gassers):


qCapacities
(Approximate Quantities)
Item Capacity
Engine oil
With oil filter replacement 4.2 L (4.4 US qt, 3.7 Imp qt)
Without oil filter replacement 4.0 L (4.2 US qt, 3.5 Imp qt)

 

[baronx]

So did Mazda provide a revised page for your owners manual with new oil capacity specs?

Nope.. no revised documentation provided. This has been Mazda's norm in Australia.. don't provide any documentation and deny any issue.

 

[Morsa]

Mazda will have to tell us what are they doing. They can't simply call the owners and change the dipstick with an X mark soooo far.

 

[dad of jon]

Mazda will have to tell us what are they doing. They can't simply call the owners and change the dipstick with an X mark soooo far.

I had a reply from Mazda about my letter of concern about rising fluid level as measured on the dipstick.

selection of quotes from it... "I can confirm that some vehicles have been subject to oil rising up the dipstick" - good no BS there.
"currently this matter is being addressed by Mazda" - again this is fair
"a resolve will be forthcoming in the future" - testing the software, perhaps?, they don't want the fix for the rising fluid level to cause DPF's to clog up!
they say that a visit to the dealer may be required "if a software upgrade or any other modification is required" - true unless they plan to just send some dipsticks in the mail (rofl2)

they also say that any defect would be able to be addressed within the warranty period.

they also told me to read the section about the DPF in the manual (headshake) - my letter to them indicated that I know all about dpf's.

If there is a faulty batch of injectors or sensors that cause too many regens that would be the best outcome i'd argue, as they could be replaced. Tweaking the software to balance rising fluid level VS keeping the DPF from clogging might be a difficult balancing act.

So I'll just see how it goes, if there are excessive oil changes - look out.

 

[Morsa]

TODAY I posted my case here:

http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-replies.cfm?t=1979291&p=92#r1833

I got the new dipstick!!!. I'm happy my oil-gasoil has plenty of room to go now!!!!. Problem is over!!!.

 

[jozi-111]

It is funny how some people think that higher placed x mark has solved their oil dilution problem!

 

[Applauso]

It is funny how some people think that higher placed x mark has solved their oil dilution problem!

I agree! Another sillyution would be to replace the oil sump with one which is lower to the ground. Can't think why Mazda didn't think it first!(laugh)

 

[thisman]

Can anyone confirm that the "diluted oil" is causing actual harm to the engine? Then I'm not talking about something happening 10 years down the line, because quite frankly, I don't care.

 

[jozi-111]

Mazda uses special DPF oil so small amount of diesel should not harm lubrication ability of it. But I don't know what could happen if you drive with bigger amount like 15-20% of diesel in oil?!

 

[change-man]

Percentage dilution

Mazda uses special DPF oil so small amount of diesel should not harm lubrication ability of it. But I don't know what could happen if you drive with bigger amount like 15-20% of diesel in oil?!

I am getting my oil tested after every service, by Caltest (Caltex). Had the oil changed at 2800, 4000, 7600 and early service at 8700 kilometres. My car is getting a new dipstick and PCM (ECU) next Monday.

At the old X mark the diesel in the sump oil was circa 7%. So the new dipstick will allow for circa 14%? At that amount the oil needs changing anyway.

So all CX5 diesel owners need to be vigilant!

 

[Canadian-ES-GT]

Hopefully the ECU reflash will solve the problem.

 

[Morsa]

Hopefully....but the only thing I have is a rised X mark. jozi-111 I'm not so naive to think that the new dipstick has solved any problem. Just you don't understand the irony, my friend.

But this is what we have got with Mazda, My car has not been re-flashed, so what is the aim of the new stick without any explanation?, to shut up the mouths?.

I expect still more from Mazda.

 

[dad of jon]

Hopefully....but the only thing I have is a rised X mark. jozi-111 I'm not so naive to think that the new dipstick has solved any problem. Just you don't understand the irony, my friend.

But this is what we have got with Mazda, My car has not been re-flashed, so what is the aim of the new stick without any explanation?, to shut up the mouths?.

I expect still more from Mazda.

Hi Morsa,

re: post #170

That is a superb level of sarcasm. Are you sure you're not british?

 

[Jasonjames]

The main effect of diesel entering the oil-pan will be to reduce viscosity. By how much, will be a case of how much oil is in there.

In the case of petrol engines, the worst case I had seen was approx 1/2 a pint of dilution. They really do need to come up with a workable solution instead of supplying new dip-sticks! I mean what is wrong with that picture? Just ignore the problem?

J J

 

[thisman]

But that's the whole thing - is there actually a problem? All modern diesel engines using this technology to clean the particulate filter, will, under certain circumstances, experience some oil rising and that IS perfectly normal. Other technologies are no better in my experience - just ask my friend who's driving a brand new Nissan and has his "Check engine" light constantly on because of particulate filter issues.

The questions then becomes if Mazda actually put the new X mark so high that it damages the engine?

Until someone:
1) Using the exact right type of oil on their engine (which surprisingly many don't!)
2) and making sure the oil lever never exceeds the NEW X mark
3) has an engine failure that's not covered by the warranty..

..I'm not a least bit worried. (yawn)