This makes my blood boil!

[Peter B]

OK
So we gave all that friggin bail out money to GM and Chrysler. I was against it but fine! Out of my control whatever im never buying one of their s*** box cars... unless its a corvette. Anyhow the whole point of giving them my ******* tax money was to save AMERICAN jobs. Or thats what I was told.

I ******* said it was bad idea! I ******* said we were only masking the problem! I knew this would ******* backfire!

...and now? I heard on the news GM wants to move their factories to CHINA! Good thing we gave em all that money to save all those AMERICAN jobs. I wonder how many americans will be working in their plants in ******* china!

I think MR Obama should take the bail out money back from GM if they move to china.

This pisses me off! I ******* knew something like this would happen.

 

[Hyun]

id say go handle that s***!

 

[Metro Gray]

No excuse for the last 20 years of poor management from GM but they have turned the corner and their latest cars are comparable to the Japanese as far as fit/finish and reliability goes.

They want to move the jobs to China because the labor unions aren't cooperating. Add to that the fact that our lawyers and insurance companies are taking healthcare costs through the roof and you create a situation where GM and other companies can no longer be competitive.

 

[ForceFed]

Wow..where are you getting your info guy.....
GM is still building here and planning on bringing some plants that are idle back on line with new models.

 

[Peter B]

Wow..where are you getting your info guy.....
GM is still building here and planning on bringing some plants that are idle back on line with new models.

Saw it on the news, fox or nbc or cnn or one of them durring the week.

http://www.moneymorning.com/2009/05/18/general-motors-china/

The other reason i want to seem them fail is to break the ******* unions

 

[RODSCALIP5]

Last I heard GM was converting one of their SUV factories to build these new small cars....

 

[Peter B]

I honestly hope the reports are wrong... it would be a real slap in the face to the American people if they did that

 

[oaklandopen]

americans slap themselves in the face enough

 

[Silver Ecstasy]

I felt the same as OP when I first heard GM's "Emergency Plan". If all hell broke loose, they'd make sure nothing happened to Buick and specifically, the Corvette. Also, GM's started to discover within the past 5 years that they're more profitable in China than they are in the hometown. So they've done nothing but continued to send production and business out there.

It's one thing to share business and trade, but it's another to bail out of your home country and run for the hills. I don't want to hear s*** from a single person about "not buying American". And I live in Detroit for christ sakes!

Give me something for $22k that does what my MS3 does and i'll gladly consider it. But I don't consider a cheap, plastic Cobalt SS as a product of comparable value AT ALL.

 

[6SpeedTA95]

This has been blown wayyyyy out of proportion...

First of all bankruptcy is how this should have been handled initially, not 6 mos later...

Secondly GM does want to build some plants in China because a LOT Of their vehicles are sold in China. This would displace few if any US jobs and they would be building super tiny cars as the majority of chinese production...

Third, if you think GM builds shitbuckets you haven't been in one of their newly designed products, they're on par or better than the jap stuff. Chrysler still builds s*** buckets overall, no two ways about it...

GM has turned a corner, ford turned the corner and put the pedal down, they're building top to bottom the best brand/overall line in the US right now and once we get the rest of their models filtered out they'll be on par with Honda which is damn impressive.

 

[mr_mazda329]

I totally agree with you Silver. I also think they should pull their plants out of mexico and bring those jobs here. Survival of the motherfuckin fittest(rockon)

 

[daonly1around]

ok... soooo. you think it would be better for the GOV't NOT to help out GM, but better, let them shut down, have 100s of thousands of people standing in unemployment lines? paying out about the same amount of money but see NOTHING in return? yeah thats a GREAT idea...

the govt will now OWN 70% of GM, and last time i checked, majority ownership makes the decisions...

 

[Silver Ecstasy]

I totally agree with you Silver. I also think they should pull their plants out of mexico and bring those jobs here. Survival of the motherfuckin fittest(rockon)

Last time I checked:

-OnStar is a complete joke
-Interior quality is still mediocre
-4 Speed Transmissions are STILL BEING USED
-The 3.1 to 3.9l pushrod is still being wrung dry of technology..
-Dexcool STILL causes manifold gasket dryrotting (coolant in oil...not good)
-Gas mileage? What's that?
-Navigation? Who needs that when you've got OnStar baby!

I'll say it like this:

GM and Chrysler -- You CANNOT keep thinking you'll fool people with tastefully designed exteriors when underneath is a bunch of cheap BS. Not everyone is leasing cars anymore so they're keeping cars a lot longer and your cars will have to be tolerable for more than a 3 yr/36,000 mile lease!

Here's a fact folks: Michigan had the highest lease percentage of the country 2 years ago. 82% of car consumers LEASED. That means that only 18% were buying, and they were probably buying foreign. The rest were leasing. GM and Chrysler had no real reason to make their s*** last long. Everyone was only borrowing it for a couple years and turning it back in for their next new flavor!!

I'll give all my credit to Ford. Freshest line up of cars PEOPLE ACTUALLY WANT, staying ahead of the tech curve, offering as many hybrid solutions as possible (for the tree huggers) while still maintaining their performance, heart and soul within the company. You want an example of an American car company? There's your example.

*steps off soapbox*

 

[mr_mazda329]

Well put Silver

 

[micronesia]

When I was shopping around I seriously considered leaning American. After all my research was done I realized that would be a sacrifice.

Unfortunate, but true.

Despite the American companies being cocky for too many years, they also do have a problem, as far as I understand it, where they are paying more in the way of pensions/etc than all the foreign car companies which have been tearing things up lately, so it's not all their fault that they have difficulty competing.

Regardless, I'm getting sick and tired of living in a system where big business needs to be protected by the government. Any time a big business is suffering, I hear that we need to save all those jobs or prevent an economic meltdown. Doesn't this demotivate bigger companies from avoiding doing stupid s***?

 

[Peter B]

When I went car shopping for my MS3, the only American car I considered was a focus. Not because I wanted one, but because I have had god luck with ford, and Its one of their more successful lines. But I never even test drove one. Never even looked at any American cars. I just have so little faith in them.

Like I said... its all like putting a band aid on a bullet wound. The system is flawed. The unions are to big and too powerful. The cars are too bad, the product lines spread to thin and move in the wrong directions. Who wants a hummer when gas is $4.00 a gallon. I know it dropped but it will rise again.

I honestly could care less if GM and Chrysler disappear. Let new, better car companies grow up from where they once stood. And why should I care if all those employees loose their jobs? What are they doing to protect themselves? You know what my company did? They froze everyone's salary, cut our employee stock plan and took away one of our vacation days. On top of that they are letting people go from our shop which is unionized. Yet when the autoworkers unions are asked to help out, they wont budge.

So I say **** em! I think that when all those poor factory workers, some of whom make over $70/hour, realize their company is about to tank, they might rethink things a little, perhaps speak with their rep.

Just in case its unclear, everyone on this forum is paying so this s*** show can continue. We are paying now, and I promise you we will pay even more $$ down the road.

The right thing to do is the more painful thing to do upfront. But if we fix the system we wont be here again in another 15-20 years.

Edit: I back everything Silver Ecstasy says, and want him to help me lead an angry mob to burn down the headquarters of GM and Chrysler.

 

[my3needsaname]

x...whatever post this is...

 

[Knox Joe]

Almost all these problems can be attributed to the UAW. Too many benefits, and too much money for the work performed. I don't make as much as some assembly line production workers, and I am a regional sales manager for a very large company. To me that just doesn't make sense.

 

[evilmonkey]

lol like its the unions fault, GM makes cars the majority doesn't want. Bashing the union who in fact lets people live better lives is a joke ....dont like unions? Try being in one, your mind will change damn quick. Remember ...not everyone shares your OPINION

 

[Knox Joe]

lol like its the unions fault, GM makes cars the majority doesn't want. Bashing the union who in fact lets people live better lives is a joke ....dont like unions? Try being in one, your mind will change damn quick. Remember ...not everyone shares your OPINION

My BIL is in a union and he hates it.

The union over pays people, and give them far too many benefits for the job they perform, causing GM (Ford and Chrysler too) to raise the prices of their product due to higher overhead. How many trucks would GM sell if they reduced their overhead to put a fully loaded Silverado at say $28K? A lot. How may Cobalts's would they sell if they reduced overhead and could charge $7.5K? A lot.

I think you get the idea. Almost all the major overhead at these companies is due to payroll. Which is cause by the UAW and their overcompensation for employment. Take a look at auto workers' wages at any other major plant in any other major country and you'll see a stark difference.

Should someone building a car, in a factory, really make that much money, and have that many benefits? Do you even know what the average going rate for a line level employee is at these factories, and what kind of benefits packages they give?