Feedback after 2 full tanks of 89 in my MS3

[camrycev6]

there is one thing which has not been mentioned; if mazda for any reason feels that you ran anything other than 93 with regularity in this car, they are within thier bounds to void the warranty.

I have heard that as well. (From an Acura dealer.) However, I challenge them to prove this, so I would say this point is moot.

 

[robin2660]

What information are you referring too?

Sorry, thinking of Scangauge or whatever it is that allows you to view engine parameters such as knock, timing, etc.

 

[camrycev6]

I'll spend the extra .20cents per gallon for (93 octane) no matter what the gas prices do. I prefer the piece of mind knowing I'm putting in the manufactured recommended fuel in my vehicle. To do otherwise just seemswell dumb IMO. Of course in a crisis if you have no choice you could put in a lower octane, it says this in the owners manual. However, it's certainly not recommended.

Not dumb Ghost Rider! Scientific curiosity! I wasn't planning 89 in it forever. I just wanted to see the short term effects.

 

[FrequentFlyer]

there is one thing which has not been mentioned; if mazda for any reason feels that you ran anything other than 93 with regularity in this car, they are within thier bounds to void the warranty.

Of course, they can "feel" whatever they want. It's kinda hard to prove after you go to the gas station and refill with 93.

I also find it amusing gas stations always add 9/10 to the price. People very rarely look at the 9/10, but virtually every gas station charges it, which means they're basically getting 1 cent more per gallon than most people think they are.

 

[camrycev6]

Sorry, thinking of Scangauge or whatever it is that allows you to view engine parameters such as knock, timing, etc.

Got it... Nope. Just a simple experiment for gas mileage and obvious engine problems. (i.e. Knocking, obvious power loss, etc., etc.)

 

[Koenig]

I have heard that as well. (From an Acura dealer.) However, I challenge them to prove this, so I would say this point is moot.

Unless you run each and every gas tank BONE DRY, I'm pretty sure you're going to have some 89 octane in there..... you'd be amazed at the things science can do these days, and a simple analysis may very well be able to tell them at one time you had 89 octane in it. (sludge from the inside of the tank, leftover gas in tank maybe?)

As for running 89 octane, I would have never thought to do it. When the Mazdaspeed6 first came out why do you think people had problems with it? California doesn't get 93 octane gas, Mazda designed the car on 93 octane, people where only 91 octane is sold had issues and thus mazda releases their "recall" to flash the ECU so the car (computer) can use 91 octane in the car. when the 2007 speed3/speed6 models came out they had already been programed to run the 91 octane in certain states, but you'd still be recommended to put 93 if you could, and wanted the best performance.

Around here the difference between 89 and 93 (mid-grade and premium) is only 10 cents at every gas station I see. I think for 18 gallons, I'd rather take the hit on the $1.80 and get 93 octane knowing my car is running cleaner and performing to it's BEST limit. Maybe that's just me (boom01)

 

[xboxlivemonkey]

I did the exact same test in my 325i. I lost 1.5 MPG with 89 octane. The car ran no different. It wasn't worth it. I went back to 93 octane.

I do find that getting gas at shell nets me another MPG vs. gas at a discount place. I'm one of the lucky ones who's relatively unphased by current gas prices. So a few extra pennies a gallon isn't a deal breaker for me.

Thanks for giving it a shot camryce. It's a good test to see what we can run in the car. In the event of another major oil disruption, I'd like to know *if* I can run other octane levels if 93/91 isn't available. During Katrina, we had no high test at several stations locally.

is your bimmer a turbo ? if its stock then here is the difference . gas octane is a rating used to determine if it should be used in a high compression engine . in a reg 4banger or 6 cly it will barely make a difference unless you dont take good care of the engine .shell and bp use aditives that help clean the fuel line , meaning if you use 89 or 87 octane in a high compression car with a turbocharger your going to risk the cars performance and its life , lol for us motor heads thats a risk not worth 180 cents . and the " oh but ididnt use boost " the cars compression is still higher then a regullar 3

can you guess which is which ? guess not , more reason to take care of your car , wht do you think auto makers test there cars thousands of times , to prevent you from doing damage

137.9/2260
Bore x stroke (inches/mm) 3.44 x 3.70/87.5 x 94.0
Compression ratio 9.5:1

Displacement (cubic inches/cc) 137.9/2260
Bore x Stroke (inches/mm) 3.44 x 3.70/87.5 x 94.0
Compression ratio 9.7:1

 

[camrycev6]

Unless you run each and every gas tank BONE DRY, I'm pretty sure you're going to have some 89 octane in there..... you'd be amazed at the things science can do these days, and a simple analysis may very well be able to tell them at one time you had 89 octane in it. (sludge from the inside of the tank, leftover gas in tank maybe?)

As for running 89 octane, I would have never thought to do it. When the Mazdaspeed6 first came out why do you think people had problems with it? California doesn't get 93 octane gas, Mazda designed the car on 93 octane, people where only 91 octane is sold had issues and thus mazda releases their "recall" to flash the ECU so the car (computer) can use 91 octane in the car. when the 2007 speed3/speed6 models came out they had already been programed to run the 91 octane in certain states, but you'd still be recommended to put 93 if you could, and wanted the best performance.

Around here the difference between 89 and 93 (mid-grade and premium) is only 10 cents at every gas station I see. I think for 18 gallons, I'd rather take the hit on the $1.80 and get 93 octane knowing my car is running cleaner and performing to it's BEST limit. Maybe that's just me (boom01)

Speaking as minor chemist, I am afraid there really is no need to run it bone dry to get rid of the 89 octane. It is a matter of dilution. If I have a 1/2 tank of 89 and a half of tank of 93, the new solution will be 91 octane. (Assuming they both use the same n-heptane and iso-octane that most places do.)

The two liquids would be a completely homologous and there would be no way to "extract" the 89 from the 93. It would be the same as mixing a 25% salt water solution and a 10% salt water solution. After mixing them, there would be no way to separate the two again.

As far as "sludge" in the tank. I again, find it hard to scientifically believe that there would be anything remotely noticeable after even a few tanks of 89 versus 93. Perhaps, if they are willing to pull in the CSI teams... but I doubt they are willing to go so far.

The one thing you mentioned that I had considered previously, was that the computer may record some secondary data about pressure reduction, etc., that occurred to facilitate the use of the 89 gas, that could be used to extrapolate the implied use of 89 gasoline. If they could use this data to show definitively that 89 was certainly, but not possibly used, they could have a case. I feel confident that there could be a number of explanations for changes in pressure, engine timing, etc., that would serve just as well as plausible explanations, freeing me from culpability.

 

[SwampAss]

is your bimmer a turbo ? if its stock then here is the difference . gas octane is a rating used to determine if it should be used in a high compression engine . in a reg 4banger or 6 cly it will barely make a difference unless you dont take good care of the engine .shell and bp use aditives that help clean the fuel line , meaning if you use 89 or 87 octane in a high compression car with a turbocharger your going to risk the cars performance and its life , lol for us motor heads thats a risk not worth 180 cents . and the " oh but ididnt use boost " the cars compression is still higher then a regullar 3

can you guess which is which ? guess not , more reason to take care of your car , wht do you think auto makers test there cars thousands of times , to prevent you from doing damage

137.9/2260
Bore x stroke (inches/mm) 3.44 x 3.70/87.5 x 94.0
Compression ratio 9.5:1

Displacement (cubic inches/cc) 137.9/2260
Bore x Stroke (inches/mm) 3.44 x 3.70/87.5 x 94.0
Compression ratio 9.7:1

It's NA. However, BMW recommends 91 or higher.

 

[ZooMIN3]

Good info.

Why is everyone bashing this guy's/gal's balls/vag? (you aint a girl are ya?)

Anyways, camery was just doing an experiment..incase you must've missed it at the beginning of the reading, or didn't read it to begin with? I read else where that camery has polls and what not; leads me to believe he/she's a scientist...or something along those lines...let the guy/gal do what they do best... at least good info is being shared with everyone....

It's good knowing that you'll be able to get by with a tank of 89 octane gas if the station that you happen to "E" light it to there didn't have anything but that, and there wasn't another station for another 100 miles.. (i'm just saying) I know I'd put half a tank of 89 fuel and drive to the gas station that does have the 91/93 octane gas..... camery did us all a favor... so instead of busting a dudes nutz or vag, how's about a thank you or something...

By the way camry, you should be classified as the "Mr/Mrs Wizard" on these boards...lol that's who you remind me of....lmao





EDIT: LOOK I EVEN BOLDED/HIGHLIGHTED THE PART WHERE, "I'M JUST SAYING"

 

[camrycev6]

Good info.

Why is everyone bashing this guy's/gal's balls/vag? (you aint a girl are ya?)

Anyways, camery was just doing an experiment..incase you must've missed it at the beginning of the reading, or didn't read it to begin with? I read else where that camery has polls and what not; leads me to believe he/she's a scientist...or something along those lines...let the guy/gal do what they do best... at least good info is being shared with everyone....

It's good knowing that you'll be able to get by with a tank of 89 octane gas if the station that you happen to "E" light it to there didn't have anything but that, and there wasn't another station for another 100 miles.. (i'm just saying) I know I'd put half a tank of 89 fuel and drive to the gas station that does have the 91/93 octane gas..... camery did us all a favor... so instead of busting a dudes nutz or vag, how's about a thank you or something...

By the way camry, you should be classified as the "Mr/Mrs Wizard" on these boards...lol that's who you remind me of....lmao

Thanks! I am a scientist dude. I have taught college / high school / others (professionals) for over a decade now. My old student's have called me Mr. Wizard... how ironic! Anyway, I am more a biologist than a chemist, but I have taught both. (And lots of other physical science classes too.)

Seems like we have a few people (Jville to name one) afraid of a little testing! Look on the bright side folks, I am using my car. You can call me unintelligent (yes...I caught that back a page Jville), but you are missing my point on this thread. Finally, I am not worried about the name calling. I have nothing to prove on the intellect front.

All said, it was interesting to me to try it. I expected different results and it cool to see something unexpected.

 

[Koenig]

Speaking as minor chemist, I am afraid there really is no need to run it bone dry to get rid of the 89 octane. It is a matter of dilution. If I have a 1/2 tank of 89 and a half of tank of 93, the new solution will be 91 octane. (Assuming they both use the same n-heptane and iso-octane that most places do.)

The two liquids would be a completely homologous and there would be no way to "extract" the 89 from the 93. It would be the same as mixing a 25% salt water solution and a 10% salt water solution. After mixing them, there would be no way to separate the two again.

Maybe I'm the idiot here, but I suppose it all depends on where you live...... if they test your gas & it reads 91 octane...... and (for example, I live in Florida so these are our octane levels) All the gas stations say 87, 89, 93....... where did you get your 91? (there are no 91 octane stations I have every seen living here for 25 years)

Oh well that's not to hard to figure out is it? (braindead and with Mazda voiding peoples warranties these days I wouldn't surprised if someone DOES pull out the CSI teams (lol2) ******* Mazda....

Anyways, camery was just doing an experiment.. It's good knowing that you'll be able to get by with a tank of 89 octane gas if the station that you happen to "E" light it to there didn't have anything but that, and there wasn't another station for another 100 miles.. (i'm just saying) I know I'd put half a tank of 89 fuel and drive to the gas station that does have the 91/93 octane gas..... camery did us all a favor... so instead of busting a dudes nutz or vag, how's about a thank you or something...

If he wants to mess with his engine like that....... all in the name of science, good for him. I for one would rather not run that risk. Your car does not "E" light when it's about dry, you have approximately 3 to 4 gallons in it.

and you should fill up with gas BEFORE you get to the "E" light if you know gas stations are scarce with 100 mile distances, that there and of itself is common sense.

 

[lestat13]

Thanks! I am a scientist dude. I have taught college / high school / others (professionals) for over a decade now. My old student's have called me Mr. Wizard... how ironic! Anyway, I am more a biologist than a chemist, but I have taught both. (And lots of other physical science classes too.)

Seems like we have a few people (Jville to name one) afraid of a little testing! Look on the bright side folks, I am using my car. You can call me unintelligent (yes...I caught that back a page Jville), but you are missing my point on this thread. Finally, I am not worried about the name calling. I have nothing to prove on the intellect front.

All said, it was interesting to me to try it. I expected different results and it cool to see something unexpected.

Hey I live 10 minutes south of Columbia, MD! I taught a half year this spring (December graduate) and I'm about to start my first full year of teaching in a few weeks! Currently I teach elementary music pre-K to 5, special needs, chorus, and do musicals. After I get my masters I want to be a high school choral director!!

Yay for teachers!!!

 

[xboxlivemonkey]

Speaking as minor chemist, I am afraid there really is no need to run it bone dry to get rid of the 89 octane. It is a matter of dilution. If I have a 1/2 tank of 89 and a half of tank of 93, the new solution will be 91 octane. (Assuming they both use the same n-heptane and iso-octane that most places do.)

The two liquids would be a completely homologous and there would be no way to "extract" the 89 from the 93. It would be the same as mixing a 25% salt water solution and a 10% salt water solution. After mixing them, there would be no way to separate the two again.

As far as "sludge" in the tank. I again, find it hard to scientifically believe that there would be anything remotely noticeable after even a few tanks of 89 versus 93. Perhaps, if they are willing to pull in the CSI teams... but I doubt they are willing to go so far.

The one thing you mentioned that I had considered previously, was that the computer may record some secondary data about pressure reduction, etc., that occurred to facilitate the use of the 89 gas, that could be used to extrapolate the implied use of 89 gasoline. If they could use this data to show definitively that 89 was certainly, but not possibly used, they could have a case. I feel confident that there could be a number of explanations for changes in pressure, engine timing, etc., that would serve just as well as plausible explanations, freeing me from culpability.

well iv been told to add 5 ounces of atf with a full tank of gas so it can clean out the fuel lines since the detergents will help clean it out . also im pretty sure the ecu will record any knocking or irregularities that happen inside the engine

 

[xboxlivemonkey]

It's NA. However, BMW recommends 91 or higher.

where (bump)

 

[camrycev6]

All points well taken. Anyway, I am out to happy and hour and a fine looking blonde. Everyone have a great weekend!

 

[jville]

Thanks! I am a scientist dude. I have taught college / high school / others (professionals) for over a decade now. My old student's have called me Mr. Wizard... how ironic! Anyway, I am more a biologist than a chemist, but I have taught both. (And lots of other physical science classes too.)

Seems like we have a few people (Jville to name one) afraid of a little testing! Look on the bright side folks, I am using my car. You can call me unintelligent (yes...I caught that back a page Jville), but you are missing my point on this thread. Finally, I am not worried about the name calling. I have nothing to prove on the intellect front.

All said, it was interesting to me to try it. I expected different results and it cool to see something unexpected.

Your point? what point? you ran a couple of tanks of low grade gasoline, and didn't see any obvious effects, whoop de doo. Your not testing anything. Your just hoping that nothing happens, which it didn;t, this time. I'm not doing any "testing" on my car well because it's something i pay my hard earned money to own/drive/enjoy. And want to continue to.I don;t care what kind of teacher you are. Yea theory may say it will burn, I'm an ASE certified master technician, and know what happens when people don't follow vehicle manufacturers suggestions, been there seen that. Do what you want. You want me to show you statements from mazda and information to backup my points while you won;t even pull a plug to see what's going on. So much for scientific testing.

 

[camrycev6]

Your point? what point? you ran a couple of tanks of low grade gasoline, and didn't see any obvious effects, whoop de doo. Your not testing anything. Your just hoping that nothing happens, which it didn;t, this time. I'm not doing any "testing" on my car well because it's something i pay my hard earned money to own/drive/enjoy. And want to continue to.I don;t care what kind of teacher you are. Yea theory may say it will burn, I'm an ASE certified master technician, and know what happens when people don't follow vehicle manufacturers suggestions, been there seen that. Do what you want. You want me to show you statements from mazda and information to backup my points while you won;t even pull a plug to see what's going on. So much for scientific testing.

You clearly are missing the point of this. I am only making conclusions about my experiment. (Which were only a couple.) If you would stop and read my posts, you will see I admit I can draw no long term conclusions about whether I have done long term damage. I openly admitted multiple times that I cannot confirm or deny that I have, because I don't have the data. You assert I have done damage, yet you have done nothing to support your statements, and you provide no evidence! You are placing the burden of proof on me! (Go pull your plugs, etc., etc. blah...) Why don't you produce some information? Surely I am not the first person to run less than the recommended octane in their car!

You make ad hominem attacks. You sir, are a lousy scientist, lack skills in logical discussions. I have given you ample opportunity to respond to my requests, but you prove incapable. Clearly are not worth listening too. I am sorry if that hurts your feelings, but I doubt you would last long in one my classes.

Good evening to you sir.


Edit: I am leaving for the day, so please don't feel if I don't respond to your reply that you have had some sort of "victory". It's just a car forum, and I have bigger fish to fry at the moment.

 

[jville]

You clearly are missing the point of this. I am only making conclusions about my experiment. (Which were only a couple.) If you would stop and read my posts, you will see I admit I can draw no long term conclusions about whether I have done long term damage. I openly admitted multiple times that I cannot confirm or deny that I have, because I don't have the data. You assert I have done damage, yet you have done nothing to support your statements, and you provide no evidence! You are placing the burden of proof on me! (Go pull your plugs, etc., etc. blah...) Why don't you produce some information? Surely I am not the first person to run less than the recommended octane in their car!

You make ad hominem attacks. You sir, are a lousy scientist, lack skills in logical discussions, and clearly are not worth listening too. I am sorry if that hurts your feelings, but I doubt you would last long in one my classes.

Good evening to you sir.

You sir have wasted everybodies time and forum space with you vague and very not so conclusive "experiment" you could have just said: hey i ran 2 full tanks of 89 and my car didn't blow up, dee dee dee." But i'm the lousy scientist. Prolly wouldn't last in your class because i'd call you on your bulls***. What information do you want? Besides the fact that everyone else on here agrees with my original statement: The vehicle calls for premium unleaded only and thats what it gets. That lower octane fuel gives more probability to know/detonation under higher heat and pressure ie:boost? I;m not worth listening to yet you still feel the need to quote my every post and try to prove your useless test as a success.(braindead

 

[ZooMIN3]

Maybe I'm the idiot here, but I suppose it all depends on where you live...... if they test your gas & it reads 91 octane...... and (for example, I live in Florida so these are our octane levels) All the gas stations say 87, 89, 93....... where did you get your 91? (there are no 91 octane stations I have every seen living here for 25 years)

Oh well that's not to hard to figure out is it? (braindead and with Mazda voiding peoples warranties these days I wouldn't surprised if someone DOES pull out the CSI teams (lol2) ******* Mazda....



If he wants to mess with his engine like that....... all in the name of science, good for him. I for one would rather not run that risk. Your car does not "E" light when it's about dry, you have approximately 3 to 4 gallons in it.

and you should fill up with gas BEFORE you get to the "E" light if you know gas stations are scarce with 100 mile distances, that there and of itself is common sense.

Sylvester Voice "Suffering SUCCATASH, I WAS JUST SHAYING" SHEESH!

I even put it in my comment about the "E" light coming on... of course I know its common sense...

That is good to know that the "E" light comes on with approxmiately 3-4 gallons of dino fuel...

By the way, from about AZ to CA(braindead...I believe 91 octane is the premiums of dino juice there is... once you hit up New Mexico and go east, it goes to 93..bummer 93 isn't used in Cali...that sux... lol