from impressed to scared

[gadget]

when I start my car after it has been off for more than 5 or 6 hours i hear a rattle right after it the revs kick up. Starter runs, engine turns over, rattles on the way down, then idles. not sure when it started, but it wasn't after anything significant and since the warm weather hit here in ontario (in april). my active imagination tells me i need a top end adjustment and I only hear it after its off for a while because the oil has drained away. I use 5w30 synthetic oil.

I ask bc I have been reading up on other user's issues and martispeed's thread scared the pants off me.

thoughts?(ughdance)

 

[martispeed]

what rpm does the noise become auditable?

Oh and my noise it present when its hot and cold...

 

[dstmsp03]

broken motor mount, loose exhaust? start it up.. grab a stethoscope and put against oil pan, thats the easiest way to tell if its a rod bearing, i dont think it is though as its just there and goes away.. sounds more like motor rattling aruond due to a ripped mount

 

[gadget]

i don't think it's the same issue; i'm sure of that. Ive heard a spun bearing before and it's all the time, like you said. The part of you story that got me paranoid was the bit about your experience with that shop. It's proof to me that you can never really tell if they know what they are doing or just putting you on.

I guess I'm looking for thoughts to reaffirm my own suspicions or bring light to a possibility that hadn't occurred to me.

i hope yours works out, gotta keep the lasers flashing (breakn)

 

[gadget]

broken motor mount, loose exhaust? start it up.. grab a stethoscope and put against oil pan, thats the easiest way to tell if its a rod bearing, i dont think it is though as its just there and goes away.. sounds more like motor rattling aruond due to a ripped mount

good thought... I'll have a look

 

[martispeed]

i don't think it's the same issue; i'm sure of that. Ive heard a spun bearing before and it's all the time, like you said. The part of you story that got me paranoid was the bit about your experience with that shop. It's proof to me that you can never really tell if they know what they are doing or just putting you on.

I guess I'm looking for thoughts to reaffirm my own suspicions or bring light to a possibility that hadn't occurred to me.

i hope yours works out, gotta keep the lasers flashing (breakn)

Yea, about the whole shop thing, you just neverknow. The one i went to is a family owned business, and every day they worked in it i was there helping them out. The problem was i am a noob at all of this and i didnt know what all should be done. So the end result is a car right back where it was and 1200 dollars out the door.

All in all i wish you luck.

 

[gadget]

thanks, dude. don't be so hard on yourself. mistakes are made, by you and those you hire. Just don't tell the dealership; they'll take it as a sales opportunity... "well when you come to the dealer you get quality...blah blah blah"




anyway, i think I'm jacking my own thread here...

 

[martispeed]

yea haha sorry for the thread jack...

 

[orangeade]

mine does this as well but usually in cooler weather.....it'll do it for a few seconds on initial start up and then it'll go away....

 

[MSP2k3]

Mine does this also... Im almost 100% positive it is Piston Slap. The reason it goes away after the car is warm is because the pistons expand as they get warm to fill the slightly larger cylinder holes. It is said that it does not affect the longevity of the engine. I researched for awhile and this is the conclusion i have come up with. It happens to alot of cars, not just MSP's.

 

[gadget]

Mine does this also... Im almost 100% positive it is Piston Slap. The reason it goes away after the car is warm is because the pistons expand as they get warm to fill the slightly larger cylinder holes. It is said that it does not affect the longevity of the engine. I researched for awhile and this is the conclusion i have come up with. It happens to alot of cars, not just MSP's.

what's the mileage on your car? I'm just under 61k

I'm installing a set of front and rear lower mounts that i filled w/poly to test dstmsp03's thought. If it works or not I'm sure I'll realise some benifit. I've always had stiffened engine mounts in my cars; my ls integra's dash shook like a mf, but it's not like the doors fell off or anything (silly)

jeep style (nana)

 

[MSP2k3]

My car has right at 62k... been doing it since i bought it with 49k on it, in March.

 

[magnumP5]

Loose heatshield? IC pipe rattling against something? I know that before I got my IC pipes properly adjusted some would rattle against other parts of the car at certain RPM. Once I forgot to completely bolt down the heat shield and it would rattle like crazy when the RPM drop down and then be nonexistent at idle. Just throwing this out there...

 

[gadget]

My car has right at 62k... been doing it since i bought it with 49k on it, in March.

and it's only when the car is dead cold, right?

if so, have you tried a compression test after the car has sat overnight? I'll know about the engine mount idea by the end of the week.

 

[magnumP5]

^^^ Do NOT do compression tests cold! It explicitely says in the factory service manual to bring the car to operating temperature before running a compression test.

 

[gadget]

^^^ Do NOT do compression tests cold! It explicitely says in the factory service manual to bring the car to operating temperature before running a compression test.

is this because the oil has all drained out of the bearings and rings and buckets and everywhere else the oil is required to be when it is running?

 

[magnumP5]

is this because the oil has all drained out of the bearings?

Not just the bearings but pretty much every other part of the engine as well. Also, with the warmed up engine all the components are in their fully expanded state therefore the compression measured is more indicative to the compression during actual driving.

 

[gadget]

Not just the bearings but pretty much every other part of the engine as well. Also, with the warmed up engine all the components are in their fully expanded state therefore the compression measured is more indicative to the compression during actual driving.

the issue I'm trying to track down only happens when the engine is cold, so I'll just figure out another way to find it.

 

[MSP2k3]

I am 110% positive that it is piston slap... try adding some oil additive to the motor.. i think its called Engine Restore.. it will help the oil stay on the pistons when the engine is off so there is more lubrication until the pistons are warm. Pistons will slowly wear away at the sides of the cylinder walls over time to the point that they are slightly larger than when they were made. The piston is at its smallest when it is cold and therefore will create a knocking sound until they warm up and expand. Type in Piston Slap into google and you will find a bunch of cases of people with similar symptoms across a wide variety of vehicles. It is said that they only way to cure piston slap is to rebuild the engine... and since it does not affect performance or longevity you can just deal with it. In a way, it makes me stay out of the throttle until the car is completely warmed up, which you should do anyway.

 

[gadget]

thanks for the info. Not yet convinced we have the same problem, but you given me some food for thought.