what should i get....

[slug420]

this is for my MSP....

My friend used to have a 15" RF power with 800 watts and that would his really hard. I liked how you felt your organs quiver or somethin when it hit.....but i dont think I want a 15, id rather 1 or 2 12s......even if they arent as loud as the 15, as long as they have that same kind of hit to them im sure i will be satisfied. I was tenatively thinking of a 12" power RF with a 1000bd RF power series amp. Anyone think this will satisfy my need for thump? What other sub/amp combos do u reccomend for this sort of sound? 1 or 2 12"s.......tight is good......clean is ok, i want a hit that i can feel.....

1stmp3inNH, if you could give me multiple suggestions in addition to a JL setup id appreciate it

oh yea, and i think his box was ported...do i have to go ported to get the hard hit? and all i have ever heard is subs that fire back, is there a big diff in sound if a do a raised floor and have it fire up?

thx

 

[Sir Nuke]

bigger is not always better......my single 10 will make you feel it all the way to your bone when it hits hard.....and yes it can make your organs tingle too.

 

[slug420]

what kind of 10?

I have heard some loud 10s, W7s and Flame Q audiobahns with 700+ watts but they didnt seem to hit like a bigger sub

 

[Sir Nuke]

what kind of 10?

I have heard some loud 10s, W7s and Flame Q audiobahns with 700+ watts but they didnt seem to hit like a bigger sub

Keep in mind I am not one to want the blow the windows out....but I do like to crank it up pretty good when I am alone in teh car and the tunes warrant it. I have a 10W0....and feeding it only 120WATTS RMS, I know, it doesn't sound like much but.....some of tunes I feed it can really rattle the car....and its crystal clear too. its not the QUANITY that counts...its the QUALITY.

(stash)

 

[1sty]

2 12"s are the way to go. What budget are you working with?

2 POwer 12"s or Kicker L7s would do the task but each are over $300 apeice. I'd perfer the fosgate to the L7s. Either speaker will need a minumum of 500 watts to get going. I'd recommend 750 rms per driver. Also the loudest truck i ever heard was 4 MTX 15"s so maybe you want to look there.

The thing about using all RF power stuff is it is actualy very good and very expensive equipment unlike the absolute garbage they sell at best buy. JL W7s are more then loud with enough power but they need alot of power. A 12W7 want 1000 rms alone. a 13W7 can easily take 2000 rms.

Your budget is going to determine this system.

 

[slug420]

hmm....

you think a power 12 with 1000rms would be similar to the power 15 with 800?

Those were kind of the brands I was thinking of too, W7, L7, or Power......the W7s are harder to find a good deal on than RF stuff is, and I think I like the RF look better than the uber clean W7. and as for the L7s i had heard they werent as good for tight hits as round subs....also, at this local stereo shop where im gonna buy my stuff from, the guy who carries a ton of both kicker and rf, said that kicker amps arent so hot compared to the RF ones (too bad, they look better....)......which actually brings up another point.....type RF amps. Do you know anything about these? is there any reason I would go to type RF instead of power series? Im thinking type RF is more for people who are fickle about being able to fine tune the precise sound of the sub......

my budget is around 1500 bucks.....out of crutchfield a power 12 and 1000bd amp which is 1000x1@2 ohms, run like 1200. And I think that I could get the both of them from a local stereo shop (authorized) for 1000 or 1100 at the most...if this will do the trick, all the better, im totally fine with spending 1000 for the equipment and can afford to spend 1500 or so on it, but the closer to 1000 I stay, the more money I have for the install and whatnot.....

what about the direction they fire? what do u reccomend?

and will I be able to stick with sealed or do I need to go ported to get the hit?

thx

 

[slug420]

another concern I had with 2 12"s is the following....

the fired with a 15 had it in his bravada and it was amazing, then got a 2.5rs and put his box (ported) in the trunk and it sounded like ass......i believe we found that this was because there was not enough air movement in the trunk, like there was in the open space of the truck. Is this a problem i would have with a 12 in a protege? 2 12"s? or is this just because the box was ported? If this is going to be an issue and the following would help at all.....I was thinking of replacin the read deck with one without the child safety seat hooks (which rattle I assume) and put one in that has some ports to help air move between the cabin and trunk......

once again, thanks for your time and effort....maybe we can meet up so u can see the final product this summer, i go to kittery on a pretty regular basis

 

[slug420]

feel free to drop me an IM

AOL IM: slug420

 

[1sty]

You'll never get the volume form the Protege as esily as he would with the bravado. No matter how the subs face you'll loose alot of sound unless you totaly rebuild the rear deck as the baffle. I don't anything less then 2 12"s will meet your need but you may want to drop Blue LEDz over on protegeclub a line. He does db competitions with one sub and tends to kick alot of ass. His secret is actualy very simple. YOu have to make a ton of boxes and different setups before you find one that works. I find for a trunk subs facing up or boundry loaded down work the best other wise the subs have to generate air movement through not only the rear seat but also the sub enclosure. I actualy have mine facing foward right now and find it decent but I am going to get new subs soon so these will be history.

PRF punck series amps are junk. A buddy at mine at BB actualy told me the other night that the SOny stuff is out performing the Rockford. He knows his s*** so I take him at his word. Only consider RF power amps. I think the New RF power stuff is bulls*** too thouhg. For example the bd1000 POwer series amp claims it can get 1000 watts rms using a 100 amp fuse in line. Even if a car could stay at 14.4 volts when the bass hit, which it won't, that amp would still only give you 860 watts.

If you want to match brand of sub to amp then I think Audio bahn or MTX would be better. If your doing RF then 2 12"s with a bd1500 power would be best. JL is SQ so they are not realy aplicable here unless your send major cash. Althouhg 2 12W7s each with a JL 1000/1 would destroy just about everything. Kickers won't be as accurate but they will be loud. You could do a MTX RFL but they are ment for DB only.

2 RF Power 12's with a bd1500 will be $2000 retail alone.
So even that is somewhat out of reach.

For your system I think INstalation will make a bigger difference then equipment. If you were my customer and I had only our brands to use I think 3 12W3 subs with a JL 1000/1 would be the loudest, sickest hitting setup for around your budget, ruffly $1600.

If SQ was a bigger concern then 2 12" Eclipse aluminums witthe the same amp.

As for loud for cheap. 2 Kicker L5s 12" with a single Kenwood 929 per sub. which goes for $1100.

 

[slug420]

thanks for your tips.....by type RF i meant type RF not punch.....its a new line they have, best buy certainly doesn carry it, i dont think crutchfield does either......

http://www.rockfordfosgate.com/products/2002_typerf.asp

 

[1sty]

Since I have no experience with these amps I have no clue on there performance.

 

[1sty]

I'd like to see the spec sheet but the one online has basicly no info at all as far as Signal to noise ratio, damping factor, or even the voltage there specs are done at. One of the things that realy pisses me off about rockford is originaly they did power specs at 12 volts then it crept up to 13.8 volts then up to 14.4.

Any amp taking power specs with a constanct 14.4 volt is bulls***. Unless you have a shitload of alternator power and batteries, no cars charging system stays steady at 14.4 when drawing 1000 watts for an amp. Most will drop to at least 13. A car without a beefy alternator caan drop bellow 12. So you only get the 1000 watts for a millisecond then it drops off witht he voltage of the car.

Thats why I like the JL amps. they produce the same power with anything from 15 volts-11 volts.

 

[NewP5owner]

Keep in mind I am not one to want the blow the windows out....but I do like to crank it up pretty good when I am alone in teh car and the tunes warrant it. I have a 10W0....and feeding it only 120WATTS RMS, I know, it doesn't sound like much but.....some of tunes I feed it can really rattle the car....and its crystal clear too. its not the QUANITY that counts...its the QUALITY.

(stash)

I think this is very true. I used to have one 10" Blau in a 1990 mazda 626 4dr hatchback, and man did it ever sound good. My friend had two 12" and sure it was more powerful, but it seemed to me as though some of the clearity of the bass was lost. Soon I'll be adding a sub and amp to my P5 and I think I'll be going with the single 10""again.

 

[slug420]

assuming the following setup, what kind of stuff am i gonna need for the install? like caps, certain gauge wiring, new battery maybe? what kinda ballpark am i lookin at for install parts like that?

2 RF Punch 300s (75x2 each powering 2 6x9s)
1 RF Power 1000bd (1000x1 powering a RF power 12")

also, im planning on amplifying (sp) 2 pairs of 6x9s, only 75 watts each...I picked those RF amps because they are pretty reasonable it seemed, and would match the amp for my sub. Do you have any different reccomendations for powering the 6x9s? Different brands or models, cheaper or 'better'.....either way..... 4 channel amps seemed to be more than 2 2 channels.....

thx in advance as always

 

[slug420]

c'mon 1stmp3inNH

i have been DYING to read your reply since i posted last night. checking every 10 minutes

i wanna have some idea of whether im gonna be able to afford this right after i get my car and cant go to the shop where im gonna be buyin it for a few days.....i know im annoying but please, indulge me once more

 

[1sty]

assuming the following setup, what kind of stuff am i gonna need for the install? like caps, certain gauge wiring, new battery maybe? what kinda ballpark am i lookin at for install parts like that?

2 RF Punch 300s (75x2 each powering 2 6x9s)
1 RF Power 1000bd (1000x1 powering a RF power 12")

also, im planning on amplifying (sp) 2 pairs of 6x9s, only 75 watts each...I picked those RF amps because they are pretty reasonable it seemed, and would match the amp for my sub. Do you have any different reccomendations for powering the 6x9s? Different brands or models, cheaper or 'better'.....either way..... 4 channel amps seemed to be more than 2 2 channels.....

thx in advance as always

Sorry for the delay I was up for almost 40 hours just working and was unable to monitor the boadr the second half since i was on job sites installing and troubleshooting systems.

I would get a power 450S and use it to a good componenet set in the front otherwise you'll never hear anything but bass. Let the head unit power the rears and keep faded some to the front.

Regular RF is garbage especialy on door speakers. The only cheaper set up is if you want my Xtants. Unfortuinty cheap in audio is crappy electronics.

Since your runnning that amp you'll need atleast a 4 guage run, I'd personally run 2 4 guages or a 1/0. I'd do 2 1 farad caps with the stock alternator and an optima battery with upgraded wires to the alternator and factory grounds from the battery.

 

[slug420]

the MSP comes with excelon speakers. 6.5s int he rear doors and 6x9s in the front doors with tweets by the mirrors ( http://www.msprotege.com/vbb225/showthread.php?s=&threadid=10217 ) There also are spaces in the rear deck for 6x9s. The plan i mentioned would mean filling those empty spaces with 6x9s ( Excelon ) and aplifying both pairs of them. The only reason I went with those amps was because they would match my sub's amp and make for a more pretty install and all power series amps looked like too much juice for the 75watt speakers.

So given the current setup in the MSP, and knowing i dont want to replace any excelon speakers but wouldnt mind amplifying some if it would help.......what do you reccomend?

no worries about the delay, i just had nothing better to do at work all day than check the board repeatedly

 

[1sty]

The 6x9s are in the rear deck but don't seem present according to the thread you linked to. The fronts are 5x7/6x8.
The subwoofer most likely interfeared with the depth of the Kenwood 6x9s which is why they were not used.

As I said I would do a good set of 6.5" component speakers inthe front and since you have rear door speakers do mathcing coaxle 6.5" in the back and run the rear off the deck and the front off a better amp.

Oh one last thing. the Kenwood speakers are junk, plain and simple. Every pair of Kenwoods i ever heard were terrible. The ones in my MP3 were ripped out in a week of bying the car. I'd strongly reccomend replacing them.

 

[slug420]

u sayin the fronts are not 6x9s because they dont look like it in the pics? or do you know they arent?

I didnt think they looked big enough to be 6x9s in that pic but everythnig i had seen from mazda said 6x9s in the front.....of course, what mazda says doesnt mean a whole heck of a lot at this point

http://www.mazdausa.com/mazdaspeed/driving_tech/dt_int_ext_kenwood.asp

 

[1sty]

They have some sidcrepencies on that page. The features section pasted below lists 6" speakers all the way around.

Features

450-watt Kenwood AM/FM/CD/MP3 audio system
KDC-MP919 head unit with self-hiding faceplate
Four 50-watt amplifiers
Wireless remote control
Liquid gel 3-D display
Four 6-inch coaxial speakers in doors
Two tweeters in front doors
One 250-watt 8-inch powered subwoofer