what if? should I have gotten a ms6?
- Thread starter MS3Chik
- Start date
justa4banger
Member
- :
- 2007 SILVER MS3
MS3 all the way baby.........
IF you want AWD and the pep of a MS3 buy a SUBY.
I like the MS6 but the price can't justify the lack of oommph compared to our cars.
IF you want AWD and the pep of a MS3 buy a SUBY.
I like the MS6 but the price can't justify the lack of oommph compared to our cars.
Price isn't that much different when you consider dealers are unloading 06 MS6s for below invoice minus $4750 in incentives. That brings the price of a MS6 GT to $23-24K (before TTL). How much are people paying for MS3s? I'm guessing at least $20-22K right?
For that extra money you get quite a bit more than just AWD. Compare GT to GT and you'll get heated seats, heated mirrors, one-touch up/down windows, power driver's seat, side and curtain airbags, keyless entry/ignition 4yr warranty, and more. However, you lose cargo space and the versitility of the hatch. The added weight of the MS6 may make it feel less sporty but the AWD keeps all that power on the ground.
Now jump to August or so when dealers are selling 07 MS6s without incentives and the MS3s have incentives on them...I think the price advantage of the MS3 will outweigh some of the creature comforts the MS6 provides. My point being...don't buy a MS3 now if you truely want one. Instead, watch the incentives and pounce when the price is right. Trust me, it will drop. They couldn't get rid of MSPs and MSMs and now MS6s are a hard sell. The MS3 is getting a positive market response but by the end of the summer they'll stop selling like the rest of the mazdaspeeds. Once everyone has one that wants one....the price must go down to make it appealing to non-enthusiasts.
For that extra money you get quite a bit more than just AWD. Compare GT to GT and you'll get heated seats, heated mirrors, one-touch up/down windows, power driver's seat, side and curtain airbags, keyless entry/ignition 4yr warranty, and more. However, you lose cargo space and the versitility of the hatch. The added weight of the MS6 may make it feel less sporty but the AWD keeps all that power on the ground.
Now jump to August or so when dealers are selling 07 MS6s without incentives and the MS3s have incentives on them...I think the price advantage of the MS3 will outweigh some of the creature comforts the MS6 provides. My point being...don't buy a MS3 now if you truely want one. Instead, watch the incentives and pounce when the price is right. Trust me, it will drop. They couldn't get rid of MSPs and MSMs and now MS6s are a hard sell. The MS3 is getting a positive market response but by the end of the summer they'll stop selling like the rest of the mazdaspeeds. Once everyone has one that wants one....the price must go down to make it appealing to non-enthusiasts.
I went to test drive a speed3 and a speed6 at my dealer and didn't get any farther than sitting in the speed6 before I knew I couldn't live with it every day. The interior is really atrocious--it looks like Mazda made the dash from recycled milk jugs.
Add that to the extra weight and "kind of" AWD, and it was an easy decision for me. If I wanted a bigger AWD sedan it would be the Legacy GT, not the speed6 </flamesuit on>
Add that to the extra weight and "kind of" AWD, and it was an easy decision for me. If I wanted a bigger AWD sedan it would be the Legacy GT, not the speed6 </flamesuit on>
elderlycoffee
Member
- :
- 2007 Sunlight Silver mazdaspeed 3
speed 3 is faster...
"Kind of" AWD? Exactly what does that mean? I can atest to "snow mode" kicking in when needed. It also has "sport mode" which supposedly will kick in when you are on the track. I have never been at a lost for traction so I'm not sure that I can accept this argument from someone who never drove one. However, I have never driven it on the track nor do I intend to...so whether the added weight is justified I couldn't tell.
Interior style is personal. Its not the best, but neither is the MS3. However, it is comfortable and everything is layed out in easy to reach locations.
Interior style is personal. Its not the best, but neither is the MS3. However, it is comfortable and everything is layed out in easy to reach locations.
AFAIK it is pretty much a driver's game. The 3 has the weight advantage while the 6 has the traction and added HP advantage. 0-60 the 6 should win, 5-60 (not using the clutch for 1st) the 3 might win. Around the track, well I don't know but I'm sure it is still a close call.elderlycoffee said:
Well I guess the "kinda AWD" really depends on what your reason for having it in the first place is. If you want AWD for autox racing then the MS6 isn't the car for you. A Legacy GT or something smaller is a better option...and while you are at it, you don't need any of the creature comforts.
If foul weather stability and control is what you are after, the MS6 AWD works just fine and is a major advange over a standard 6 w/o AWD.
If foul weather stability and control is what you are after, the MS6 AWD works just fine and is a major advange over a standard 6 w/o AWD.
CoachZed said:
ok a few things. the AWD system is realtime. meaning that the system will divert power if wheel slippage is expected, not when it occurs. biggest difference being that the system will send power to the rear wheels before slippage occurs. A big plus as the engagement is not noticable and will not wait for a dangerous situation to occur.
I will refute the rumor as well seeing as Ive taken the speed 6 through corners and had the rear come out from behind me with mild throttle modulation - shouldnt be possible if there is no rear bias @ extreme steering angles...
I dont know where youre getting the fact that the Haldex system is not that great? Its what audi/VW have used for years (otherwise known as quatro/4motion). Its proven reliable and more than capable as an AWD system. Though not as complex/customizable (in stock form) as subaru's I wouldnt discount it as being not that great. I can name countless other AWD systems which in comparison, SUCK.
oh and chuyler - The MS6 outhandled/outperformed the Legacy GT Spec B in slalom, skidpad, and braking tests... so I wouldnt call that the better choice. You also get a sunroof and advance keyless entry/start (keycard) over the GT comparisons of MS3 GT/MS6 GT.
B1GHAM said:
1) The AWD system can predict or extrapolate based on current data, but it can't see into the future. Delays and response lag are inevitable. Haldex VWs and Audi TTs have been doing this for years.
2) Even on a FWD car, it is entirely possible to get the rear to hang out. Drop throttle and throttle modulation can put the rear out on a well balanced car regardless of drivetrain.
3) Haldex is *not* necessarily quattro. Any AWD VW with a transversely mounted engine will get the Haldex system (e.g., AWD versions of the Golf and the Mk 5 Passat, but not the Mk 4 Passat). This extends to the Audi A3 and the Audi TT. The AWD system that Audi is legendary for, however, is the *Torsen* system that longitudinally-engined Audis (A/S/RS4, A/S/RS6, A/S8) get. This is not a FWD biased system. The Haldex AWD system is widely regarded as the inferior version of "quattro."
If all you're worried about is straight line traction in inclement weather, buy good sets of summer and winter tires and you won't have to deal with weight and parasitic loss.
CoachZed said:
2) yes I know you can (as I have done that very thing on my fwd MSP). Im speaking entirely of rear bias rear wheel spin. On dry surfaces no less. By throttle modulation Im talking of specifically taking the vehicle @ roughly 40 MPH in second gear through a turn. Where it will normally plant, throttle modulation will allow the rear wheels to over power and swing the vehicle around. Im not simply speaking of throwing the rear of the vehicle around simply by entering a corner too fast and oversteering proportionately as on a FWD vehicle.
3) I stand corrected. I completely forgot that the torsen system was used with most Audis... You are right
ms6utah said:
I havent fully tested the vehicles side by side, however as stated in another thread 70-120 pulls were visually identical. We didnt do any official Dig/roll runs so I can speak fully for the capability of both vehicles from a true statistical standpoint.
We can argue this all day long...but even though the two cars are close in performance, I really don't see them being in the same class at all. The MS3 is a lightweight fast tuner car. The MS6 is a luxury sport AWD sedan. We can try and convince each other that each has a little of the other but as long as you are driving a Mazda, I really don't care.
