v8 rx7

[MP3skaterNC]

I hope you plan on keeping your Piston powered FD. They instantly loose ALL value as soon as one is swapped in.

If you loved your RX-7, you'd keep your Rotary. Camaros weigh close to the same as FD's.

V8's feel too truck like and old-fashioned to me. No RPM's. Ever thought of a 20B? Would cost a little more but it would be sooooooo much better.

As for power? Last year at a car show in washington I witnessed a 1040 RWHP FD. It ran on a Street Port 20B (3-Rotor) with a single Turbo. I also witnessed a Street Port 13B 2nd Gen putting out 744 RWHP.

2 Days ago I talked to a kid who was aiming for 500RWHP in his 2nd Gen.

All claimed they were daily drivers and ran on Pump Gas.

And I passed a 400cui powered 2nd Gen at the track last season in my buddy's First Gen.

So far the only reason a V8 is better is that its more reliable.

camaro's are no where near weighing as little as an FD.

and don't really see how the car would lose value, you'd still be able to get just as much for an ls1 powered rx as you would one with the 13b in it. the demand for a pre-swapped car is there.

 

[1garnetredlx]

When people swap the 13B for anything other than maybe a three rotor 20B, I just want to cry. :'( There's nothing like winding up the rpm's in a rotary motor. I really miss my RX-7's.

 

[Iggy]

someone said "if you want a ls1 powered coupe, then why dont u get a camaro"

I believe that was me.

Ok first of all, thats probably the most stupid comment ive ever heard. We have rx7s because we love rx7s. If we loved camaros we would have camaros. How many camaros do you see on the road...how many fds?

Not a whole hell of a lot of them, which is why it makes me cry when an owner such as yourself is contemplating this. I'm not calling you stupid because I know myself the power thata V8 can make (last night I saw a Plymouth Cude with a 572 Hemi and the largest supercharger i've ever seen,period. owner of the shop it belongs to said it makes around 1500 WHP. lets see that out of a 4-banger)

I just feel that when you swap out the 13B for a LS1, you are raping the RX7 of all its uniqueness. While I don't see alot of FD's driving around. I ask you this question. How many rotary powered vehicles do YOU see driving around? How many V8's?

For the money it would take you to swap in a LS1 and have it run properly you could get a Camaro/Trans Am/Firebird and have it making waaaay more power then your FD with an LS1 will have.

The best reason to replace your engine with an ls1 is bc of the reliablility. Whats the achilles heal of the rx7...reliability. How many turbo 13bs do you see with 150k miles on them that havent been rebuilt....NONE

While I agree that a small block Chevy is more reliable (hel they've made 90 million of them since the first one in the 50's) I'm just saying that I personally wouldn't do the conversion. If you want to, thats cool it's your car.

but if your thinking of obscure engines for it. Why not a Grand Natonal Engine? 3.8 turbo V6. it truly is a monster.

 

[Roywhitep5]

call me crazy but i'd rather drive a reliable fd than a top fuel dragster to work

 

[Iggy]

the rotary can be made to be reliabe. but just like any engine, if you beat the piss out of it, it is going to break soon or later.

 

[Alak]

the rotary can be made to be reliabe. but just like any engine, if you beat the piss out of it, it is going to break soon or later.

More you beat on a rotary, the better it responds.

I drove my 12A First Gen for along time and it never gave out or broke down. I had it flood once and it didnt start for 24 hours. That was it. It was more reliable than my 400cui powered chevy astro. That thing broke down all the time and it had half the kms.


I know someone whos put a 350 into a 2nd Gen. After he installed the engine, transmission, rear end, and all the customs to make it appear stock and function properly, he could have put in a 20B. He did everything new, but it would have upped the value with a 20B. Also, the handling was s*** because of the rear end. That car was never the same. He doesnt drive it much anymore.

I'd also like to say that I've personally never met someone whos bought a Piston powered rotory. I've met lots of people who have sold them.

 

[Dexter]

The rotary engine is the coolest part of the RX series of cars. Without the engine itself, the car loses appeal in my eyes. Whats the point of another piston engine? Oooooh LS1, OMG MY PUSSY HURTS FOR V8 ENGINES.

 

[spacemonkey]

RX = Rotary Experimental

Not pistons....its just isnt right puttin a piston engine in a RX-7...doesnt matter in any other car.

Can you find me any other engine that has a broad powerband like the RX-7? What I mean is a peak hp at 8500-9000 rpm. only car I can think of is a Ferrari 360 GTC with peak hp at 8570 rpm. Its a good engine if your not pushing the limits.

People forget how reliable a Rotary engine is. They still go on even when over heated when a piston engine would just stop. Plus I have never heard of a rotory engine poping form the factory. What I have heard of is a piston engine with spun bearings. Less moving parts means less chances of breaking down. The bad image came from drg racing rotary cars which try to sqease as much hp as possible and thus pushing the limits. I very rarely hear of a 300-400 hp RX-7 blowing.

Rotory engines were designed as a reliable engine for aircrafts...to replace pistons in airplanes. Piston engine overheat and are prone to detonation...rotary engines dont. But unfortunately when the 1st working model was invented it was the begining of the jet turbine era. And Gas prices and tough emission laws finally killed rotary engines by other manufactuers. NA rotories also lack torque which is always good for daily driven cars.

Also Rotary is comming back due to its ability to take all diffrent kinds of fuel sorces with little modifications.

 

[spacemonkey]

Also we are forgeting about the whole concept of a rotary engine. Small engine that can be mounted futher back for 50/50 weight distribution. Plus it lays low for a low center of gravity. All this means a car that has great responnse due to low yawn inertia....turns better.

When you put a 20B or a V8 it messes up the weight distribution that makes the RX-7 such a sucess in road racing. Thus why a LS1 is gay in a RX-7...screws up what the car was ment for. Taking a short wheel base car for drag racing is dumb. Short wheel base chasis are ment for handlign...not drag racing.

A rotory engine is really good for short wheel base cars under 3000 lbs. It produces more power then some NA 4 bangers...and gives a nice power band. But it awful for efficency.

 

[CommieSpeed]

Rotaries are the coolest. They go round and round. Put a V8 in something else I say...like a Festiva or a Paseo.

 

[JONBOY688]

rpm's? ok ure saying a rotary will turn more then a v8? to bad the rotor design doesnt count like that. divide it by three? so now 9000rpm is what? 3000rpm's? rpm is based off one rev of the crank, ok so it take a rotary motor,3 rev for the rotor to make a complete turn, a piston motor takes one rev of the crank for a complete stroke. if the rotor would turn any more then 3000 to 4000rpm it would never last, it would nothing but a keg shaped turd.

 

[GreenPic1]

rpm's? ok ure saying a rotary will turn more then a v8? to bad the rotor design doesnt count like that. divide it by three? so now 9000rpm is what? 3000rpm's? rpm is based off one rev of the crank, ok so it take a rotary motor,3 rev for the rotor to make a complete turn, a piston motor takes one rev of the crank for a complete stroke. if the rotor would turn any more then 3000 to 4000rpm it would never last, it would nothing but a keg shaped turd.

here this pic should help you out... yes, a V8 has to rev more to make the work neccissary to do the power stroke than a rotary does, it still doesnt rev higher at the crankshaft tho. At the same time the intake phase is occuring in a rotary, the power phase and exhaust phase are also occuring. whereas in any 4 stroke piston engine it has to make 2 revs to do another intake/power/exhaust stroke, it only does one at a time. so the rotary makes power every rev while the 4 stroke piston engine makes power every 2 revs. you can compare the rotary to a 2 stroke piston engine, it makes power every revolution.

rpms are rpms... why are you cutting it in 3rds for the rotary? the rotor is not connected to the crankshaft, it revolves around it on splines... and revs are counted at the crankshaft, not the rotor. thats like saying im gunna cut a 4 stroke engines rpms to a quarter cuase it takes 4 strokes to make a complete cycle.

so what, your 6500 rpm 4 stroke is now only a 1625 rpm engine by your theory. (dunno)

so do this lil number (sssh) and show some respect for the rotary... they're really impressive.

 

[steve0178]

I hope you plan on keeping your Piston powered FD. They instantly loose ALL value as soon as one is swapped in.

If you loved your RX-7, you'd keep your Rotary. Camaros weigh close to the same as FD's.

V8's feel too truck like and old-fashioned to me. No RPM's. Ever thought of a 20B? Would cost a little more but it would be sooooooo much better.

As for power? Last year at a car show in washington I witnessed a 1040 RWHP FD. It ran on a Street Port 20B (3-Rotor) with a single Turbo. I also witnessed a Street Port 13B 2nd Gen putting out 744 RWHP.

2 Days ago I talked to a kid who was aiming for 500RWHP in his 2nd Gen.

All claimed they were daily drivers and ran on Pump Gas.

And I passed a 400cui powered 2nd Gen at the track last season in my buddy's First Gen.

So far the only reason a V8 is better is that its more reliable.

2002 Camaro LS1 weighs 3466 lbs MT and 3524 lbs AT
1993 Rx7 LS1 weighs aprox 2800 lbs
Yeah good call, they are about the same weight....

You also said that they lose their resale...WTF are you smokin? I have NEVER seen a nicely swapped rx7 with an LS1 go for under 20k. Most go for 22-25K And i have looked....trust me. If anything they INCREASE the value becasue they are so rare and in demand.

Yes i have looked into a 20b....aparently you havent becasue then you would know that its not "a little more" To do a 20b swap you are looking at at least 15K. If you dont believe me, research it. Why do u think whenever you see one for sale they are selling them for so expensive?....cause it cost 15k to put the dam engine in! Yeah it would be sweet but who has the money to do that?
Also, everyone thinks that an ls1 swap is so expensive when in reality, it doesnt cost much more than a new or rebuilt 13b. Especially if you want to get one with a port job (which i would assume you would if you would want to make any type of power).

As far as power, yes the 13b can make a lot of power...but the v8 can make a lot more! A 13b making 700 plus hp has to have a huge turbo with a monster or peripheral port. How long do you think that motor is going to last? Well according to http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/cowley/51/rx7facts.html Who gives info on ports in the 13b, the monster port will last about 6 months and the peripheral port will last only a little longer. Thats assuming you dont beat the car. On the other hand....many, many people have made 700 RELIABLE hp on an ls1 which will last MUCH longer. Trust me, ive done my research. My 13b will be putting out about 450 at the wheels but i would rather have 450 from a reliable ls1. Moveover, the ls1 can make much more than 700 hp....a 13b is pretty much maxed out around 750-800...and like i said, lets see how long that one lasts.


Oh and i love all the people on here that give their opinions and dont know anything about the car. For example...someone said
"Can you find me any other engine that has a broad powerband like the RX-7? What I mean is a peak hp at 8500-9000 rpm" Well do your research and you will find out that an rx7 makes it peak hp around 6500 - 7000 RPM. A close to stock rx7 makes its highest hp around 6500. A heavily modded rx7 will make its highest power around 7000 - 7500. Want proof? here take a look. http://www.catenet.net/dyno.php here is a set of dyno graphs for a bunch of rx7s with mods. Read it and check the dyno charts. you will see that even the heavily modded rx7s with hugh turbos make their peak power around 7k - 7.5K rpm.

Trust me this isnt something that i just sat here and thought up one day. I have done my research on this for months now and im telling you its a good thing.

 

[steve0178]

How many rotary powered vehicles do YOU see driving around? How many V8's?
For the money it would take you to swap in a LS1 and have it run properly you could get a Camaro/Trans Am/Firebird and have it making waaaay more power then your FD with an LS1 will have.

but if your thinking of obscure engines for it. Why not a Grand Natonal Engine? 3.8 turbo V6. it truly is a monster.

Ok you make a good point with which is more common, the rotarty vs v8. But there is good and bad in that. How hard is it to find parts for a 13b vs a v8 that, like you said, they made 9million of them?

You also make a good point about for how much it would take to swap you could get a much higher hp domestic. This is true, but we own rx7s bc we love rx7s. If i was going for maximum hp in any car i would buy an old grand national or something with a big block. But im not, im going for high, reliable hp in a car that i love.

I would love to put a grand national engine in but they dont make a kit for that and im not about to try to fabricate one

 

[steve0178]

Also we are forgeting about the whole concept of a rotary engine. Small engine that can be mounted futher back for 50/50 weight distribution. Plus it lays low for a low center of gravity. All this means a car that has great responnse due to low yawn inertia....turns better.

When you put a 20B or a V8 it messes up the weight distribution that makes the RX-7 such a sucess in road racing. Thus why a LS1 is gay in a RX-7...screws up what the car was ment for. Taking a short wheel base car for drag racing is dumb. Short wheel base chasis are ment for handlign...not drag racing.

A rotory engine is really good for short wheel base cars under 3000 lbs. It produces more power then some NA 4 bangers...and gives a nice power band. But it awful for efficency.

Ok sorry to tripple post but i cant let this go....

This is where most everyone makes their mistake on the ls1. They think that just bc its a v8 it adds a lot of weight and throws off weight distribution. THIS IS NOT CORRECT. The swap only adds aproximatley 25 lbs to the car. In the process of the swap, a battery relocation is necessary. This weight transred to the back evens the car back out, making it a perfect 50-50 weight distribution.

 

[VR RX7 R1]

rpm's? ok ure saying a rotary will turn more then a v8? to bad the rotor design doesnt count like that. divide it by three? so now 9000rpm is what? 3000rpm's? rpm is based off one rev of the crank, ok so it take a rotary motor,3 rev for the rotor to make a complete turn, a piston motor takes one rev of the crank for a complete stroke. if the rotor would turn any more then 3000 to 4000rpm it would never last, it would nothing but a keg shaped turd.

You're a little mistaken. 6000 rpm on a rotary is 6000 rpm on a piston motor. The rotors turn at 1/3 the speed of the e-shaft. I think that's where you got confused.

And who was it that said you'd get 50k out of a rotary if you're lucky? Damn...you need to read a little. If you don't take care of it, just like ANY other motor, of course it's going to die on you. That's the majority of why these motors go. Bad tuning, bad rebuild, bad owners...the list goes on. Any properly built and maintained rotary can last well over 50k.

Pistons don't belong in a 7. Where I understand the logic behind it, the rotary is one helluva fun motor. And turbo or not...500hp outta 1.3L...that's some bang for the buck there.

 

[Metal MP5]

here's some more info on the lt1 swap
http://members.tripod.com/~grannys/

its not expensive, doesn't add too much weight like it was said here, and getting to 800/1000hp will most likely be alot easier, if that's what you're going for.

i personally would keep the rotary just because it's a rotary ... id love to do a 20B swap in a 2nd gen =)

 

[atticus1398]

yea, but its still kind of sacrelige(sp), i drove an 86 glx for 12 years. its a cult kinda thing. i had a couple mullet machines suggest the v8 thing, and it offended me. if i wanted an v8, i wouldve bought a camaro.

and that was one of the rx7s highlights, the weight distribution. practically a mid engine. maybe im wrong but i dont think any v8 culd possible weigh near the same as a 13b. 13bs are lighter than a 4 cyl.

 

[steve0178]

maybe im wrong but i dont think any v8 culd possible weigh near the same as a 13b. 13bs are lighter than a 4 cyl.

check it out...do some research and you will find that as ive stated a ls1 only adds aprox 25 lbs. A 13b is actually pretty heavy with all the turbos on and everything.

Just for reference...Heres a touring model fd that weighs in with a ls1. Remember that the touring model weighs a lot more than a r1.
LF: 746 RF: 677 Total Front: 1,423lbs
LR: 675 RR: 733 Total Rear: 1,408lbs


And another point that found today. I was looking for times with an ls1.... A STOCK ls1 fd ran a best time of 11.4 @ 120. THATS STOCK. ok add some head work, some exhaust and you are in 10s easy.

 

[Iggy]

hmmm...how about an ls6? if those are around the same size physically, you could drop one of those in and be even faster.

this is an interesting concept to me even though i've seen the swaps before. right now im torn about what car to get when i graduate. a new mustang gt or an rx8