P5 Transmission Swap ?

[syst3mr00t]

Hey all,

I've searched around the forums and havent had much luck with this question. I have a 2002 Protege5 5speed, the transmission is junk. I went to the local junkyard and purchased a 1994 Mazda 626 transmission, which is pretty much the same as a G Series Ford Probe transmission. I have seen a few people swap their Protege 2.0 transmission's with Probe transmissions and vice versa, but no decent writeups with any complications or expectations.

My two main questions would be, will the Bell housings have to be swapped from the 626/Probe tranny to my stock Protege bell housing. Next, will I need to purchase 626/Probe Clutch Kit, or will Protege clutch be okay.

Are their any other issues I will run into? Example, do sensors need to be swapped or are they okay, do all bolts line up, tranny mount issues, etc.

Any input is greatly appreciated.

Thank You Very Much in Advance!

 

[tweety2300]

Everything should be the same. Easy on those synchros though they're not built well

 

[Installshield 2]

I totally understand where you're coming from with finding the right info with this...tweety and i were going around with it a few weeks ago, and ended up more confused than when we started...

Since you're utilizing the stock P5 engine...it may be a little easier...from what i've found, for the most part, the only important differences with the different G series gear boxes is the bell housing...and that is what, seemingly, makes the difference between a G15, G25, G5, etc...

the main thing is if the used box came from a 4 cylinder or 6 cylinder engine...if it was the 4, chances are the bell housing already installed on it will work...if its from a 2.5L, you'll probably need to swap bells...in either case, you should be able to utilize your existing clutch and flywheel (although, since you'll be in there, now would be a good time for a factory replacement...which is only ~$140 for a full kit)

As far as sensors...that will depend on if you're car has ABS or not...If it does, you're probably fine no question on sensors...but if it doesn't, your stock speedometer is fed from a sensor mounted on the gear box...the sensor reads a pressed plastic gear installed on the differential inside...you won't have any easy way to know if the used gear box you found has this gear inside...and if it doesn't, you won't have a working factory speedometer...you would then have to swap differentials, or at least get that gear pressed on the used differential...and then would have to verify there is a correct hole for installing the sensor...

Sorry, wish i could be of more help...but that is most likely the only issues you may face...

 

[xxxmonoxidechil]

Th probe FS has the exact same bellhousing as the protege. you shouldnt have to change anything there. But if its off the KL, its a totally different shape, and the starter is even at a different spot. Sadly none of the probe trannies are going to have that gear in place, so yea, goodbye speedo. Unless you want to take both cases apart, and swap it over. Which is more then possible, and will only take about 30 minutes if you know how to take the trans apart. The only thing you will need for that is a press to get the gear off.

Clutch will all work just the same, even if its out of a v6. The clutch's are more mazda trans family specific. So in most cases a clutch from any G series will fit in another G series. I have a Clutchmaster stage 3 out of a MSP in my V6 626 right now. direct bolt in. Same clutch can even be used in a old BP with a G series.

 

[syst3mr00t]

Hey guys , just wanted to update everyone. First off .. THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR EVERYONES INPUT ON THIS, without the forum I would have never got this project completed.

When my transmission blew on the P5 I searched everyone local and online junkyard and could not find one for under $500+ , with this forum’s help and input, I got a 1994 Mazda 626 transmission for $75.00.

Since, I had some difficulties with my swap and finding answers, I just want to conclude some concrete facts that I experienced with my swap for anyone in the future.

Transmissions that work:

First off the 1993 – 1997 Mazda 626 4cyl Transmission / 1993 – 1997 Ford Probe 4cyl Transmission IS A DIRECT BOLT ON REPLACEMENT with our 2.0 Protege5 cars. ***Although they are geared slightly different.

(I cannot confirm this as I had not done this, but putting this on for reference, the 6cyl transmissions from the previously mentioned cars can also be used with slight wrenching. The Bellhousing will need to be utilized from the original transmission out of our cars and swapped on the 6cyl. *Not sure if there is any other modification required ie. Shifter linkage.)

Speedometer issues:

As long as the 1993 – 1997 626 / Probe Vehicle came WITHOUT ABS, the speed sensor is already inside the transmission as well as the gear ring, and the transmission is plug and play. Just install in vehicle and speedometer will work as stock.

If the donor vehicle HAS ABS, then there will be a dummy plug and the speedometer will not work in the Protege5 without modification.

(I lucked out and used a 1994 Mazda 626 w/o ABS , so it was direct bolt on)

Speedometer solutions:

There are 3 solutions for the speedometer fix. I found the first solution with my own research, and decided to share as it is the cheapest and easiest option, and I have yet to see anyone recommend this.

1.) Install the ABS Transmission as is with dummy plug. Next purchase a JEGS Racing GPS Speedsensor, which is compatible with 4, 8, and 16 pulse speedometers. Set the wiring for 8 pulse per revolution on the sensor, as this is what ford and mazda use from factory. Wire the gps speedsensor to your speed sensor wire that is no unplugged, route the antenna to the drivers side dashboard close to windshield, as this is the best spot for signal. The GPS Speedsensor will take approximately 10minutes to locate location when first started. After the first start, GPS Speedsensor will work like stock sensor with only 5 seconds of lag when car is started. I am not sure if links are allowed on this forum, if they are not MOD please edit this thread, or PM me and I will edit the link out. THANKS!

http://www.jegs.com/i/JEGS+Performa...&cagpspn=pla&gclid=CI_asJjfs7UCFcZFMgodgRUAUQ


*** Reason for recommending this option :
a.) Transmission does not have to be disassembled to install speed ring and speed sensor
b.) Cheaper option, GPS Speedsensor costs $99.00 vs Speed ring and sensor $199.00
c.) Less labor, GPS Speedsensor – 15min install vs disassemble transmission – 60min install.

2.) The second option is to install the speedo gear ring , bearing, and speed sensor into the non-abs transmission. This is not my thread, but this guy does an amazing job with instructions on what is needed to install the speedometer parts into the non-abs transmission.

http://www.mazdas247.com/forum/show...-Teardown-amp-Rebuild-w-LSD-amp-5th-Gear-Swap

Although this is the most CORRECT way to install the transmission and give the most stock appearance, it can be costly. $199.00 in parts plus hours in labor.

3.) The last and most costly option is to purchase Mazdaspeed ABS Axles with ABS sensors and wire this into your speedsensor wire. This is my least recommended option, as it is the most labor intensive and expensive. $350+ in parts for axles & abs sensors, and hours in labor.

Clutch compatibility:

As previously mentioned either the Protg, Probe, or 626 clutch will work no problem. I maintained the Protg5 clutch, as it is slightly larger in size.
Here are the comparisons to the clutches, but as mentioned previously, they will all work:

Probe/626 Clutch:
Disc outside diameter 8 1/2", spline inside diameter 15/16", spline count 22.

Protege5 Clutch:
Disc outside diameter 8 7/8", spline inside diameter 15/16", spline count 22.
Hope this thread helps out if anyone runs into these questions, and again thank you everyone for your input.

 

[tweety2300]

If you know how to pull the trans apart yourself the speedo gear is a few bucks at Mazda.

In Oder to swap the clutch you will need the flywheel as well, but that's a waste of time since the probe clutch is smaller

 

[ScratchNSniff]

Awesome Info...

 

[ccrunner2011]

As long as the 1993 – 1997 626 / Probe Vehicle came WITHOUT ABS, the speed sensor is already inside the transmission as well as the gear ring, and the transmission is plug and play. Just install in vehicle and speedometer will work as stock.

If the donor vehicle HAS ABS, then there will be a dummy plug and the speedometer will not work in the Protege5 without modification.

(I lucked out and used a 1994 Mazda 626 w/o ABS , so it was direct bolt on)

Just curious, some P5's have ABS which is where they get their speed on the speedometer from...correct? So why would it matter if the donor transmission was out of a car with ABS? Difference in what exactly?

 

[tweety2300]

A car with abs runs the speedometer off the wheel speed monitor/ abs sensor, which is way more accurate.

Without abs there is a small plastic gear on the differential inside the trans which tells the speedometer how fast the wheels are turning. It's an older cheap method less accurate as well but iirc easier to calibrate

 

[cglez]

Did you notice if your 5th gear is better? what's your rpm@ 60mph

 

[whatusername]

this should b a sticky it has great information in it

 

[mp5build2013]

Did you notice if your 5th gear is better? what's your rpm@ 60mph

yea im interested in his question too... i know if i go 3,000 rpms i will do 69 mph... 70 is actually real close to 3100 if not right on, im running an auto btw.

 

[tweety2300]

yea im interested in his question too... i know if i go 3,000 rpms i will do 69 mph... 70 is actually real close to 3100 if not right on, im running an auto btw.

If you're an auto you can't change your gears unless you do an Mtx swap. With 17s at 70 I run 3250 75 is 3500 etc.

 

[mp5build2013]

If you're an auto you can't change your gears unless you do an Mtx swap. With 17s at 70 I run 3250 75 is 3500 etc.

Yea if i was to do the swap id go with a MT, i have been wanting to do the swap but i have heard the MT has about the same gear ratios as AT, i didnt know there was other transmissions that would fit, i was hoping to get lower rpm's at about 70 or higher. But as im seeing i am probably better off keeping my AT till i blow it, or find a great deal on a MT. I guess 3100 at 70 is good then. i actually think its right below. what makes you run so high?

 

[tweety2300]

Gearing, its not hurting the motor unless you have no oil in it, it's actually where our cars make their peak tourque which will improve mpg. Where as if we ran 2000 rpms at 70 we would have to give more throttle which would hurt gas milage

 

[mp5build2013]

Gearing, its not hurting the motor unless you have no oil in it, it's actually where our cars make their peak tourque which will improve mpg. Where as if we ran 2000 rpms at 70 we would have to give more throttle which would hurt gas milage

ahhh, so let me see if i got this right... you have a bit higher gearing due to your MT correct? which makes you run higher rpms, yet you save gas because there is more power at those are rpms as opposed to speed, so less gas is needed to get you to those 3250 than to get me to my 3100? if i got it right, then i guess we just need to find out if systemroot had better luck with that 626 tranny. if so, i will do a swap to that instead of the pro5's MT. LSD fitment should be the same for both transmissions correct?

 

[RichardC87]

How easy is a swap? Never done anything with a trans before and looking to swap the tranny on my p5. Trans has over 200k and is having synchro issues in third

 

[tweety2300]

When I had mine it didn't look to be horrible, but expect 6-8 hour job though

 

[RichardC87]

okay thanks

 

[RichardC87]

I've read that an 02 626 mt will bolt right on as well. is this true? And is it any stronger? Also what should i look far as far as getting the strongest trans that will bolt right on? Im not opposed to buying a rebuilt trans if I can find a good price