I want at least 130 rwhp

PR5Matt

Member
I want at least 130 fwhp

What do you think of the first round of mods?

AWR Long tube
Unorthodox UDP
CAI
Corksport Exhaust
No cats
Cam gears

Second round:

Modified intake manifold
Wagner stg. II cams or J-Spec intake and Mazdaspeed exhaust
Corksport Throttle body
 
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with those mods i dont think you will have any Rear Wheel Horse Power


hehe.....but with both rounds you might have 130 FWHP

j
 
Whatever you do, don't bother with the J-Spec/Mazdaspeed cams. Either get the wagner ones (if they show a dyno), or get some custom ones ground.

Chris
 
That's just a listing of a bunch of parts. What's the header primary length and diamter? Is it a Tri-Y or 4-1? What brand of CAI, they're not all the same? How thick is the exhaust piping, and does it match the header collector outlet? If you get cams, what are you going to do to get more fuel?


You need a gameplan when you want to make some power. In your case, you want 30 hp more by bolting on a bunch of parts, not knowing if they work well together. Do some research. Make a plan and get parts that'll work together to achieve your goal.

With those parts, I'd say you'd get 120hp, 125 max with cams. Tune it right, maybe 130.
 
Does anyone have links to any info on NA tuning? Like more technical stuff behind it? Because if I do it, all I'm really doing is throwing some parts on too. But I guess it would be useful to know whats what.

This year:
-Have an AEM SRI
-OBX 4-1 Header (same as Forza, minus damn name plate)
-Bosal or Greddy EVO exhaust (2.25" piping)
-Wagner Stage 2 cams if they dyno well, otherwise customs ground to specs yet to be determined. Wagner Stage 2 supposedly go for extra lift without needing a new valvetrain, and increased duration, retain decent idle.
-MPI tuner to tune, along with J&S Safeguard which I already have to work on timing w/o detonation.

Next year:
-HC pistons, maybe P&P while head is cracked, retune.

Chris
 
Gen1GT said:
That's just a listing of a bunch of parts. What's the header primary length and diamter? Is it a Tri-Y or 4-1? What brand of CAI, they're not all the same? How thick is the exhaust piping, and does it match the header collector outlet? If you get cams, what are you going to do to get more fuel?


You need a gameplan when you want to make some power. In your case, you want 30 hp more by bolting on a bunch of parts, not knowing if they work well together. Do some research. Make a plan and get parts that'll work together to achieve your goal.

With those parts, I'd say you'd get 120hp, 125 max with cams. Tune it right, maybe 130.
First off, don't talk to me like I don't know what I am doing. Look at my website. I know my stuff. Second, the parts listed are what's out there and everyone should know what they are and what they do. I just want to hear from people with experience concerning these parts and any variation thereof. As for the T-body, I didn't list it but it would be 62-65mm if available. I know that 130 is a lofty goal with this engine, but why not? As far as the cams who knows anything about the Wagner stage IIs?

Dude, it is nice that you contribute here, but don't start talking to people like they don't know what they are doing until you know them better. You have did pretty good with that old car of yours, but you are not an expert. No one is an expert about everything automotive. When you do this stuff like I have been for years you are always learning. Each car and engine has its own subtle differences, that is why we should talk to others, swallow our pride and ask questions and ask for help. If this was a Mustang forum, I probably wouldn't even contribute much (at least where pushrod performance is involved), but I like to hear what others have done. You learn by doing and listening.
 
batmang said:
id go with a magnaflow exhaust over a bosal. bosal's look ridiculous and so does the greddy, their both huge. the magnaflow has 2.25" piping and i paid $343 shipped from www.justmagnaflow.com , heres a video clip of my car.

http://www.mazsports.com/media/Mazdasports-Magnaflow_Cat_Back_Clip.wmv

i have the aem sri, magnaflow cat back and i also have the tein s-tech springs.
Thanks a lot! I had Magnaflow on my old fOCUS but it was as loud a f**k with the 4-2-1 long-tube header. I am thinking about CorkSport because they go ahead and replace the second cat. Saves having to buy a midpipe.
 
There are a few things to consider here. First, with our cars going N/A the optimum exhaust size is 2.25"- according to manufacturer dyno's from jic racing and magnaflow. With headers- see the dyno charts. For example with intake, just a muffler, and shorty header mp5smuggler pulled 121 whp...
http://www.msprotege.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=11189

Cams, light engine management, and a full exhaust instead- could get you where you want to be.
 
shinzen said:
There are a few things to consider here. First, with our cars going N/A the optimum exhaust size is 2.25"- according to manufacturer dyno's from jic racing and magnaflow. With headers- see the dyno charts. For example with intake, just a muffler, and shorty header mp5smuggler pulled 121 whp...
http://www.msprotege.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=11189

Cams, light engine management, and a full exhaust instead- could get you where you want to be.
Thanks a lot! That really helps. I agree that 2.25 is about all I would need.
 
GEN1GT,

Sorry I am cranky today. I have a kidney stone in me the size of a pea, and I am in a lot of pain, plus I am at work...
 
Dude, sorry if I offended you. I thought I was answering the question the best way I could. You asked about your first mods and I gave my opinion. Bolt ons are guesswork, and there's not much you can do about that. The only other option is custom work, and that's the route I took. It's more expensive, but you know exactly what you're getting and can have everything made to your specs.

I chose 2.5" exhaust because of my 170whp goal, running upwards of 8500rpm. If I was going for 150 at 7500 or so, 2.25" would be fine.
 
batmang said:
id go with a magnaflow exhaust over a bosal. bosal's look ridiculous and so does the greddy, their both huge. the magnaflow has 2.25" piping and i paid $343 shipped from www.justmagnaflow.com , heres a video clip of my car.

http://www.mazsports.com/media/Mazdasports-Magnaflow_Cat_Back_Clip.wmv

i have the aem sri, magnaflow cat back and i also have the tein s-tech springs.
What does the magnaflow have as far as a resonator or secondary cat? If I get a header, I don't want to be a straight pipe. SpicyMchaggis already said it sounds horrible. Is there a resonator? Or a cat? Or both?

Also, people complained about surface rust with the magnaflow. Has it been an issue yet? You've only had it for a short time though...

Chris
 
PR5Matt said:
What do you think of the first round of mods?

AWR Long tube
Unorthodox UDP
CAI
Corksport Exhaust
No cats
Cam gears

Second round:

Modified intake manifold
Wagner stg. II cams or J-Spec intake and Mazdaspeed exhaust
Corksport Throttle body
I think you will make it with the right cams and some tuning. Don't forget to keep us updated (if possible, with dyno's after each mod).


scorch70
 
DooMer_MP3 said:
What does the magnaflow have as far as a resonator or secondary cat? If I get a header, I don't want to be a straight pipe. SpicyMchaggis already said it sounds horrible. Is there a resonator? Or a cat? Or both?

Also, people complained about surface rust with the magnaflow. Has it been an issue yet? You've only had it for a short time though...

Chris
Chris, Matt, Scorch, et al--

P5 is running Injen CIA, Magnaflow CB and EssentialSPEED shorty header to maintain both cats (Colorado is an emissions test state), although I might be able to dump cat #1 and run #2 only. Something for futurethink.

With the setup above, the engine cranks 105 ponies with 115 lbs/ft of twist. That's it, but those are dynoed, not "probably" numbers. Scorch and I had the same basic mods before we installed different headers and our dyno #s were slightly different, but this can be expected with different dynos, even of the same manufacture. Dynos can and do vary slightly, and that's why it's important to always use the same dyno when pulling runs. Otherwise, you're doing a little apples to oranges stuff.

I went with the ES shorty for reasons stated above, but may put this header on wife's '03 ES, which also has Injen/Magnaflow combo, and move to a 4-2-1. The reason Scorch gained as much WHP as he did is the AWR header design. You'll note the gain in torque is less than half the kick in HP. What we all want is a nice 7-8 WHP gain with an added 8-10 lbs/ft of twist. HPs great, but torque is what makes the wheels go 'round.

BTW, Chris, the Magnaflow CB is a deep mellow purr, absolutely non-rice, even with the header. In fact, the header took the slightly annoying resonance out of the system at cruising speeds--3500-4200 rpm or 70-80+ mph. Once again, though, that's a "bundle of snakes" shorty header, not a direct drop 4/1 as is the AWR, Wagner, Forza, etc.

I, too, wanna see 130+ WHP, but with that, I also want to see 140-150 lbs/ft of urge--at least. Not sure that's possible with current mods I'm looking at.

I still have an ES TB to install, hopefully this weekend, to see what a 17% increase in throat area does for thinner air here at 5280 feet. Maybe zilch with stock EMS. I do know that a minor change in carb mains in my Alfa 2.0L makes an immediate difference in driveability and performance. But then, I don't have to try to outwit a computer chip.

My $.02 worth...
 
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scorch70 said:
I think you will make it with the right cams and some tuning. Don't forget to keep us updated (if possible, with dyno's after each mod).


scorch70
I can't do it after each mod, but at the Bowling Green NMRA Finals I am going to dyno it and the Lightning, but that is not until Sept.1.(bang)
 
What kind of dyno do most of you guys use. The Mustang Chassis dyno shows much lower numbers than a Dynojet or DynaPack.
 
ooohhh 2 pages on N/A and people aren't bickering like kids... wow, Id love to stay involved in this conversation. Since you guys are talking about 130whp... I would also like to reach this mark. I have now an AWR header and hacked the stock air box(temporary). I'm looking at the Racing Beat cat back. I believe they said ID is 2 and a 1/4... what do you guys think? Would this be a good catback to use to open the exhaust up? I will have to make a midpipe, but that shouldnt be a problem.
 
PR5Matt said:
What kind of dyno do most of you guys use. The Mustang Chassis dyno shows much lower numbers than a Dynojet or DynaPack.
Dynojet calibrated daily and before each run of three pulls. It's SAE-corrected with special mods to compensate automatically for altitude, temp and humidity. $55 for three pulls, $100/hr for tuning.
 
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