that's why I said the RX-8 Though they're suicide, there are still 4 doors there. As far as the 'need' for the 5th door... come on! you've got a WRX. sedan or wagon? if sedan... guess that proves my point. to me, the difference in space between the 5 and 4 door is minimal. I'm still hoping they bring a sedan version to the states. since those europeans love their hatches, I suppose that's reason enough to believe it's possible.
Geneva: Mazda3 MPS and Mazda3 refresh press release and pics
- Thread starter wongpres
- Start date
spacemonkey said:
35 year old wall street type? LOL I only know a couple but they're all drivin beemers. Anyway.... your price is off, way off. $21-$22k doesn't even buy you a loaded 5 (withough the nav). We can all dream that the MS3 will cost less than the current top of the line but that's just wishful thinking. Though no one can say s*** until it's made official, if I was a betting man (and I am) I'd go with a base price of $23,795 for the stripped down version and $25,120 for the loaded (moonroof, etc) version.
spacemonkey said:
Maybe it's just me but I don't want anyone limiting my torque! That falls in the same category as top speed governers. If I paid for a car with X amount of hp/torque I'd prefer to have it than not. But what about the torque steer? Exactly! I didn't know the SRT-4 had a torque limiter. If that's true, I suppose it's a good thing. Afterall, that car has some pretty serious acceleration and handles pretty well too. Seems like Mazda and (especially) Dodge are taking this FWD thing to a whole new level. And they thought 170 was too much for the MSP! I guess they're getting smarter with how they manage it... what else could explain their decision to get into the 250-300hp range?
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- 10 MS3
CHICO2003 said:
You're right I got a Sedan
. I still think they will bring the Sedan and Hatch!wongpres said:
gee, I wonder who typed up those specs
http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showpost.php?p=2321870&postcount=364
spacemonkey
Member
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- Mazdaslow
CHICO2003 said:
I was only being playful when I said wallstreet type. But in reality that what Mazda said....when they designed the MS6 they were not lookng for the "boy street racer" look. i.e. everyone was like OH AWD....4 DOORS! It must be a STi Competator! They were infact targeting people who want to buy a Subaru Legacy and even Audis by offering a pretty good value at a cheaper price.
My reasoning for the price is as follows
Base Mazda 3 $16-17K depending on dealer....fully loaded $19K. 19K + 1-3K for the engine = 22-23K. Maybe 24K max because of a 6 speed
Difference between a Mazda 3 and MS3. Engine, tranny and some suspention.
I mean it does have similar specs to a Dodge SRT-4 and thats going for $21,295. Same thing based off a Neon (16-17K car) with a fancy engine and tranny. But since the SRT-4 will be discontinued its sales isnt a threat to where Mazda will have to price competatively. I see it as alittle more then that. But I dont see it being sold for $25,000. Because IMO no FWD car should be over $22K Saab found that out the hard way. Acura found that out the hard way and thus they are investing alot in AWD technology. Because you can hmmm buy a WRX impreza for $25K. And when you are targeting the boy racer type you need to attract them with good value over the next level (WRX). Isnt that why people buy the SRT-4? For $21K thats nearly 4-5K cheaper then the WRX and is full loaded.
But my biggest reason for the price is its closest competator....VW GTI. A VW GTI is a hatch and has a turbo FWD 2.0L engine. And in Europe its sure to be competative in sales next to the ford Focus ST( also a C1 platform like the MS3). And thats priced around $22K. MS3 specs are alittle better so perhaps 23K :dunno: if they charge $25K then thats a disadvantage as consumers will look for other possibilities...its puts a doubt in their mind. ie "is the car really worth $25K when I can get a WRX for that price. or a fully loaded GTI for cheaper."
What does this sound like?
Base Mazda protege $15-17K Full loaded Mazdaspeed PRotege 21-22K
Difference between a Protege and MSP. Tranny, turbo on engine, sound system, rims, suspention....
either way when its released its going to be like the MSP...how they wanted 22K for it. And how delaers threw on another 5K becuase its was a "limited eidition production sports car" And then they had the $3K off and thats when I bought mine for 18K
Not saying they couldnt charge that much...if its a car they already said Mazda isnt looking to make alot of money off of. And given car prices are a bit different then 3 years ago.
I know its not the best example but im trying to look at Mazda's pricing stragegy on the Mazdaspeed 6. But the base price is not all that different from a fully loaded Mazda 6s
And I can see how MS3 can be $25K fully loaded. but I still think thats alot. Keeping in mind that a MS6 has AWD compared to MS3.
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We Are Ninja
Member
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- 2006 Mazdaspeed 6 GT; 2004 Mazda 6 Wagon
IMO, that's right. I used to be a "AWD supremecist". I did the AWD thing when the WRX debuted in the States. I wanted a GC8, but there were none available so I settled for one of the bug-eyed GD chassis' in 2.5RS form. AWD was awesome in adverse conditions, but, in all honesty, it wasn't a whole lot more engaging than any other car I'd driven; at least not in day to day driving. It behaved a whole helluva lot like a soft FWD car. I'm sure the WRX and STi were better and best, respectively, but a well-sorted, well-tuned car is a well-sorted car, well-tuned, regardless of the drivetrain.TheMAN said:
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Here's the write-up at Edmunds.com. I'll quote some from the article, otherwise, follow the link.
"That's because Mazda engineers found a way to stuff the Mazdaspeed 6's turbocharged 2.3-liter inline four under the hood of this five-door hatchback. We had doubted the operation would be possible, given that it was already a squeeze to get this intercooled turbo four into the midsize 6, which had to be fitted with a domed hood."
'"We changed the 3's dash to accommodate the new engine," Program Manager Tatsuo Maeda explained. "There's a slight indentation in the new dash panel to accommodate it. Also, the hood is raised 20mm."'
"...Mazda is giving an "over 250" horsepower estimate for this 3 compared to 274 on the 6, due to different exhaust routing and emissions equipment. Torque should hold steady around 280 at 3,000 rpm."
"...Mazda has released a 6.1-second 0-to-60-mph estimate, though Mazda reps told us the car would do it in "under 6." Top speed is electronically limited to 155 mph."
"A standard limited-slip differential should tighten the Mazdaspeed 3's line when exiting turns, and Mazda says torque steer won't be a problem, thanks to precise control over power delivery through the first four gears."
"What's Edmunds' Take?
The '07 Dodge Caliber SRT-4 looked pretty scary when it debuted in Chicago with 300 hp. But with about 280 lb-ft of torque in the Mazdaspeed 3, it now looks like a much tighter battle. If Mazda's hot hatch weighs in lighter than the portly Caliber, it will likely prevail through the turns. Erin Riches"
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/AutoshowArticles/articleId=109468
"That's because Mazda engineers found a way to stuff the Mazdaspeed 6's turbocharged 2.3-liter inline four under the hood of this five-door hatchback. We had doubted the operation would be possible, given that it was already a squeeze to get this intercooled turbo four into the midsize 6, which had to be fitted with a domed hood."
'"We changed the 3's dash to accommodate the new engine," Program Manager Tatsuo Maeda explained. "There's a slight indentation in the new dash panel to accommodate it. Also, the hood is raised 20mm."'
"...Mazda is giving an "over 250" horsepower estimate for this 3 compared to 274 on the 6, due to different exhaust routing and emissions equipment. Torque should hold steady around 280 at 3,000 rpm."
"...Mazda has released a 6.1-second 0-to-60-mph estimate, though Mazda reps told us the car would do it in "under 6." Top speed is electronically limited to 155 mph."
"A standard limited-slip differential should tighten the Mazdaspeed 3's line when exiting turns, and Mazda says torque steer won't be a problem, thanks to precise control over power delivery through the first four gears."
"What's Edmunds' Take?
The '07 Dodge Caliber SRT-4 looked pretty scary when it debuted in Chicago with 300 hp. But with about 280 lb-ft of torque in the Mazdaspeed 3, it now looks like a much tighter battle. If Mazda's hot hatch weighs in lighter than the portly Caliber, it will likely prevail through the turns. Erin Riches"
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/AutoshowArticles/articleId=109468
Quit nagging about torque steer already.
Oh, and no, you can't, in fact, have your cake and eat it too.
That's why we don't drive 50-mpg AWD 4-passenger Formula 1 cars with a navigation system and touch-screen monitor and a hot chick stuffed under the steering column giving us road-head all the time. JEEZ!!
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MightyMouse
Member
Been waiting a long time for this, going to go to the dealer tonight and put a deposit on one. Anybody know what colours they will come in?
Finally! I was zipping through these posts wondering when someone would say how much the beast weighs. 247 / 2826 = .0874 HP/wt. ratio. Now if I can just find the MS6 thread where did the calculations for a whole slew of cars . . . . Whoa, just noticed thats the weight for the 3 hatch. With stiffening work, etc. the MS3 has to weigh more.nate0123 said:
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im now realizing the cost of a built motor and bigger clutch + my trade in would = a new MS3. 6 speed and a bigger motor to start off with sounds nice too. the more im thinking about it the less im hating it and seeing its potential. maybe ill wait til theres 0% financing and $2000 trading dollars againand get into another new speed. id get a brand loyalty discount too. this is sounding better and better. any idea of the starting price in CDN?
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- 2003 Subaru WRX Wagon, 2000 Miata
http://www.mazdausa.com/MusaWeb/displayPage.action?pageParameter=upcomingMS3
click on the Visit Auto Show link to see a new flash page they put up.
click on the Visit Auto Show link to see a new flash page they put up.
