Data Logging tools for CX-5?

pjensen641

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2013 CX-5 AWD Touring Zeal Red
I have a couple items that I am curious about with the operation of my CX-5 (slow warm up, minor throttle surging). They are things that would be very helpful to diagnose or understand better if I could do some data logging. Is anyone aware of any tools that will work with the CX-5? Would be nice in general just to understand how the ECU behaves under various conditions.
 
Search for OBD II scanners. Some are simple handheld units that only display check engine codes (not what you want) while others interface with a PC and can display and record all kinds of data.
 
Try and find an old Dashhawk.

It's still one of the best dash loggers you can buy. Sadly MSD stopped development on them and selling them quite a few years ago. I have mine hooked up to my CX5 diesel. It's just simply a great device.
 
Thanks for the input folks. I guess I am spoiled. My previous vehicle was a Subaru WRX. There is a whole web community at OpenECU.org that has shareware for data logging with a simple USB to OBDII cable. Sadly, they only seem to be working with Subie and Mitsu. I guess that is the price to pay when you own a vehicle meant for economy instead of performance :-(

Sassimac - Does the Dash Hawk show a complete set of parameters like timing, fuel trim/IDC, knock sensor count, throttle body position etc etc (not even sure all the items this ECU monitors)? I thought a lot of those devices were more of a generic monitor meant to replace gauges (like engine temp, RPM, etc)
 
PJensen641:

A lot of the PID's depend on the car. The Dashhawk attached to my old CX7 showed everything you mentioned. Not sure about injector duty cycle. I seriously never even thought about that one!

It will also show AFR's as well. And they are accurate. I tested it up against an exhaust gas analyser. The Dashhawk showed 14.8:1 and the analyser showed 14.86:1.

If you do find one, the best software level in 2.4Beta9 from memory. I have a copy if you end up wanting it.
 
PJensen641:

A lot of the PID's depend on the car. The Dashhawk attached to my old CX7 showed everything you mentioned. Not sure about injector duty cycle. I seriously never even thought about that one!

It will also show AFR's as well. And they are accurate. I tested it up against an exhaust gas analyser. The Dashhawk showed 14.8:1 and the analyser showed 14.86:1.

If you do find one, the best software level in 2.4Beta9 from memory. I have a copy if you end up wanting it.


Cool, thanks for the Info. Looks like the DH are like hens teeth though!

After more research, I have come across this, which seems like a great solution. Bluetooth device with several free and purchase based software solutions. Works with several Windows and Android apps. Found it by searching forums discussing the Dash Hawk. There is even a Mazda specific PID extension package that can be purchased for going above and beyond the generic OBDII PIDs.

http://www.scantool.net/scan-tools/obdlink-mx.html
 
In case anyone is interested, I bought the device I linked to above. It works really well. I have downloaded Dashcommand with Mazda parameter and Torque Pro from the Android marketplace. I have only used it in the car for a couple hours, and taken a couple data logs. Here is a VERY quick review.

OBDLink MX: Awesome! I literally plugged it in and had it paired to my devices in less than 2 minutes. Very simple to pair. There is one tiny button on the device to push for pairing mode. Just pair up as normal with your android device. I am using a Galaxy Note 10.1 tablet, and will probably also use. I havent touched the device since I plugged it in, just fire up the engine and it wakes up and pairs with your device.

No Negatives yet.

Torque Pro ($5): Very nice, but lacks Mazda parameters. Has all the standard SAE PIDs and probably some more. Has logging capability that I havent used yet. Has DTC, live data, diagnostics, and a simplified data logger which graphs realtime data points on screen. The simplified DataLogger works really nice for simple plots that you can view real-time or while out driving. The array of gauge types and simplicity to customize your own dashboards is excellent. I much prefer the gauges in Torque Pro to that of DashCommand.

Negatives: No Mazda extended PIDs (that I can find). More about Mazda PIDs below in my review of Dashcommand.

DashCommand ($20 with Mazda PIDs). Not quite as user friendly or pretty as Torque Pro as far as custom gauge set ups. It does have some cool prepared Dashboards. It has all the functionality of Torque pro, plus Mazda Extended PIDs and maybe higher end datalogging capability (*havent used Torque Pro Datalogging much yet). It also has some interesting things going on with calculating shift points and horespower etc. Probably not too useful for the CX5. It asks you to enter things like drag coefficient, BSFC, VE, gear ratios etc. The datalogging for DashCommand is best analyzed at home on a laptop after exporting to a .csv. Honestly, I would use Torque Pro UNLESS you want the Mazda PIDs. Dashcommand seems geared more towards performance crowd who are trying to do custom tuning.

OK, so what can you see for Mazda PIDS? For me, the main one is Knock Retard, which is the learned timing retard based on knock events. This parameter is nice to look at if you are trying to decide if increased octane ratings may benefit in power and economy. It also has Cam timing positions, injector flow, and some Mazda specific PIDs that overlap the SAE ones (maybe more accurate?). There may be more, but I havent messed with them yet. I am going to take a look at the Cam timing positions today, since that is another important SkyActiv parameter.

Negatives: Clunky custom dash with limited gauges (e.g. no digital readouts etc). Datalogging is powerful, but somewhat of a PITA to get to a CSV format. You must download a trial version of the companies ScanXL to export. The pre-made Dashboards are very pretty, but annoying in that you cant change anything.


So, what have I learned so far?
I see very little knock retard, but I had just filled up with premium. Max retard I see is -1.5 degrees VERY infrequently. Considering that it is common to run 20 to 35 degrees advance, the 1.5 is negligible. I will log again with 87 later. Initial impression is that there will be no benefit to running premium.

The thing that has me wondering a little bit is that I see a long term fuel trim that is up in the 15% range at cruise. This may be due to cold temps or the fact that I had run about 3 tanks of 10% ethanol prior to filling with 91 straight gas. This would explain why I am seeing measured fuel economy down in the 25-26mpg range. I will reset the ECU and log again. I would eventually like to understand how much ethanol affects the mileage (we all know its a 5-10% theoretical reduction). I also believe that our winder blended gas here really sucks to. I normally get 29-30 mpg in the summer.

One other interesting item I have seen is that the MAP is indeed very high during cruise (26-28 inHg in the manifold vs 28.9 inHG barometric). I posted an article on this board which explains why. Essentially it is part of the quasi-Atkinson cycle operation. The intake valves actually control engine power and keep the throttle plate mostly open to reduce pumping losses.

So why am I doing this? Mostly just to learn. Its not like there is much in the way of tuning potential, nor am I really interested. I would like to have some data that confirms what the best fuel to use is, what the best cruise speed is etc. I also may use it as a test bed to get in to some of the systems engineering capabilities of OBD and CAN as that would be useful for my job.
 
I got one of those for about $20 (rofl). You don't have to enter all of the parameters, just the easy ones will work. TP is useful for times, and comparing the effects of different mods (the horsepower calculation is not far off and really as long as you use the same parameters, you can use it for comparison and/or testing. I'll have to look at Dashcommand, TP does not come with extended pids, but you can import them.
 
pjensen641

Thanks for the information!
As you wrote, the high MAP is to be expected.. in fact the car has a separate vacuum pump.

I'll be looking forward to seeing the results of you experiments with different octane/ethanol levels. My guess is that you will observe some significant knock retard with the 87 octane fuel under high engine loads.
 
I got one of those for about $20 (rofl). ......

I saw those were available. As a personal preference, I don't buy cheap Chinese knockoffs. Both because they tend be hit or miss, and because of political reasons. If the extra quality is there, its worth it to me. All the reviews for both this one and the Chinese ones convinced me that the value was there.

I work at a manufacturing site for some high end hydraulic pump and transmissions (the kind used by CAT and John Deere etc). A significant portion of my job is dealing with quality problems from Chinese crap. A large volume of crap that comes from China gets used for a short time and then fills out landfills full of garbage. Its also why many can't find jobs here in the States. I have worked with many Chinese engineers. Most are clueless and/or have no interest in quality. To each their own though, and certainly sometimes the chinese stuff makes sense.
 
When I am rich I'll consider buying US "made" items at 5x the price. People qq about working at MCd's or $8.00 and hour for 10 yrs at an entry level position.. I doubt low price electronics actually made in America (not just designed) will happen anytime soon. Hit and miss is correct, my personal experience has been hit.
 
I got one of those for about $20 (rofl).
What one did you get Chis and where from? It doesn't show up in your post. Has it been reliable and would you continue to recommend?
I have recently purchased a diesel CX5 in Australia and I would also be interested in recommendations from others for both OBD11 and software. My preference is to use my Android smart phone and I want to get water temp and voltage as well as view and handle any fault codes when I am in the bush well away from a dealer. Will it allow me to connect to my factory fitted TomTom nav?
 

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