Cryo treated gears vs GTX gears

[TurfBurn]

the problem with cryo is that if you talk with nearly any metallurgist they all say it is crap... from the experience I have (albeit limited) with metallurgy classes and materials I know enough to say that cold will not promote the grain growth needed to strengthen metals. In all honesty cryo, if it does anything, gets it's gains from the heat treatment that is done at the end... if you really want to make gains get shot peening and heat treatment done.. not black magic, unprovable, not scientifically accepted in the metals industry cryo. The simple fact is that if you can't prove the metallurgy behind it.. then there isn't anything happening. Metallurgy is a HUGELY studied and understood science that has been done to incredible levels.. and cryo just does not hold water with the professors/scientists/metallurgists. One of my professors is a leading authority in metallurgy and has been called in all over the US to consult on metal fatigue failures and many others and I sat down with him on a conversation about cryo and he stated very clearly that while there is plenty of anecdotal eveidence for cryo there was ABSOLUTELY NO scientific evidence that showed anything of value from it... plain and simple..

so you have a choice... believe the stories, or believe the science... the stories say cryo works... the science says it doesn't...

 

[SNike05]

Tim I agree with everything TurnBurn said. Being in the study myself simply cooling the material will not help you in what you are trying to achieve. Like TurfBurn I will talk to my professors tomorrow about this. Did you read my previous post?

 

[Bigg Tim]

I read everything and I appreciate everyone's answer. I am just trying to get as much info as I can before I decide anything. I'm not diving into anything without checking it out. I'll have to look into it more on the scientific end I guess.

 

[TurfBurn]

I read everything and I appreciate everyone's answer. I am just trying to get as much info as I can before I decide anything. I'm not diving into anything without checking it out. I'll have to look into it more on the scientific end I guess.

Don't forget heat treatment.... just the "plain old" type... that will yield some gains but you need to know what the gear material is to do it effectively... you could have it flame hardened too... there are plenty of more "reliable" options out there.

 

[smo0f]

tim, just save up for nick's set. i think you know that guy

 

[Bigg Tim]

tim, just save up for nick's set. i think you know that guy

Nah, the whole point of this is to do it cheap and see how the car feels with 2wd instead of 1wd. If I still don't like it.......it's GONE!!!!!!!

 

[turbo_p5]

Ive cryoed my gears a 1 1/2 ago havent tested it out on slicks yet. Ill update when i do though.

 

[vindication]

Ive cryoed my gears a 1 1/2 ago havent tested it out on slicks yet. Ill update when i do though.

how is your car comming along? you gonna run it anytime soon? pics and stuff please. been a while. also, link to a new thread about it

 

[Bigg Tim]

Ive cryoed my gears a 1 1/2 ago havent tested it out on slicks yet. Ill update when i do though.

There he is, the one who did the gears. Have you beat on them any to see if they are indeed more brittle? I am still looking into this and if I do decide to do it, I am going to get an extra gear treated and have a strength test done on a treated versus a non treated gear to see if it does make it stronger.

oh yeah, do you have any independant info/tests on it?

 

[tekkie]

has anyone tried shot peening the gears? I heard that the DSM guys are doing that with success

right now I am leaning towards that

 

[TurfBurn]

has anyone tried shot peening the gears? I heard that the DSM guys are doing that with success

right now I am leaning towards that

I agree... I would do this first.... I may do it myself when I build up my second transmission here in the next couple months.

 

[MazdaSpeed626]

Have you beat on them any to see if they are indeed more brittle?

I'm not sure, but it sounded like you used the word brittle in the context of it being a good thing....

but like i said, i'm not sure.

anyways, if you REALLY want stronger gears, go to a machinist with a set of your gears, tell him to machine you some new gears out of forged steel.....better yet, get chro-moly gears to reduce rotating mass and gain some power out of it. if you're really serious, change your gear ratios so you come up to the top of 5th gear right when you get to the end of a 1/4 mile run......i'm rambling now.

 

[Bigg Tim]

I'm not sure, but it sounded like you used the word brittle in the context of it being a good thing....

but like i said, i'm not sure.

anyways, if you REALLY want stronger gears, go to a machinist with a set of your gears, tell him to machine you some new gears out of forged steel.....better yet, get chro-moly gears to reduce rotating mass and gain some power out of it. if you're really serious, change your gear ratios so you come up to the top of 5th gear right when you get to the end of a 1/4 mile run......i'm rambling now.

Yeah, I meant brittle, like easy to break. It has been said that cryoing makes the parts more brittle. I was asking if he beat on it harder then normal to see if indeed the process did make them weaker.

I'm looking at cryo as a cheaper alternative. There are big dog gear sets out there that will not break with what the FS-DE can put out, but I don't want to spend that kind of coin.

 

[XclusiveLV]

Can someone please tell me where i can find these hardened aftermarket gears that everyone keeps talking about? I'm currently deployed to Iraq and will have quite a bit of tax-free "loot" when I get back to the states in a couple of months so I wont mind spending high-dollar to make sure that I wont bust another tranny. I'm sure i'll be needing these as I'll be aiming for 400+hp on my next rebuild. Thanks in advance

 

[vindication]

well, ken at protegegarage sells the upgraded GTX gears and whatnot as a package for like under $1k. Now if you want to go balls out, Nick at MPI sells a whole package or you can just get whatever you want for the tranny. Thing is, since it is basically custom and bulletproof, it's gonna cost a pretty penny. Kens package should be good for like 500hp I figure.

 

[TurfBurn]

I'll be testing the GTX gears in the future here... I have a set that is going into one of my transmissions. We can get them for you as well, but we'll be the same price as Ken... so feel free to get them from whomever you prefer.

 

[wicked]

what year,and make,and trim do these gears come out of?

I would order them from you guys,but I highly doubt you could sell them to me for the price I can get localy.


thanks though

 

[tekkie]

anyone try this Mikronite ? http://www.mikronite.com/testData.asp

there is a place that does this not far from me and I am thinking about this now

 

[NeverSober]

Im with turf.......yea you freeze them they get closer.........but then take them out of the freezer what happens? It goes back to how it was..............

 

[Bigg Tim]

So looking into cryoing more, I heard that EMCO gears cryo's all their gears. Anyone know anything different on that? I also talked to a racer in Tuscon, AZ and he had is tranny done and it last 2 YEARS, vs 2-3 races!!! Sounds like it works to me, he had no affiliations to any cryo company either, just real world proof. So I'm thinking that if Nascar, EMCO and the government do this process, then it has to work. Once I get my parts, I'm getting it done.