The MSP LSD is not a torsen... yet the window sticker says torsen? Bwah?

[shaolin]

I would say GRM is definitely wrong. Every source says tochigi fuji sangyo including reliable magazines like car and driver.

 

[C-Bass]

Heh, reminds me of a BMW dealership here in Raleigh that had window stickers on their Cooper S' when they first came out that said they were turbocharged. I haven't been back by there lately, so I don't know if they've changed it since.

But yeah, my sticker says "torque sensing LSD" too.

 

[TurfBurn]

Yeah I posted that, and I was wrong. That is NOT the LSD in our car according to GRM. Ours is a conical ring. Maybe GRM is wrong? I dunno. What, has anyone grenaded their LSD and opened it up? Whats in there, a cone clutch or a bunch of gears?

Just installed mine today/yesterday.. there are NO visible springs in there... a number of different gear sets and at least one solid plate.. but no springs... DEFINITELY doesn't look like the one on that awards page at all.

 

[TurfBurn]

Here are some pics for you of the insides of the MSP LSD...

 

[muohio]

I think the problem is that when some of us say Torsen, we mean torque sensing like Kleenex is a brand but we refer to all facial tissues by the same name.

I also found this on the web which shows the same differential mentioned above, but has a slightly different name and states that it uses a cone clutch setup.

http://www.marklines.com/en/presen/tochigifuji.jsp

 

[Notorious]

Actually Torsen in a sense is a type of lsd. Torsen actually comes from TORque SENsing lsd. The lsd used in the msp is torque sensing, and doesn't require loss of traction before sending power to the other wheel, quite the opposite actually. Howstuffworks.com has a pretty good article on it with schematics and pictures, better off going there than me trying to fumble around and try to explain the thing.

torsen is a heavily misused term from what I've been learning. Torsen is actually a brand, but most people refer to it as a "type" of LSD. In the type sense the MSP is a torsen of sorts I believe... as it is torque sensing, it doesn't require actual slippage from my understanding to generate the torque bias (whereas for example a viscous coupling LSD does). A Quaife is also referred to often as a Torsen differential, it is torque sensing, but it is not a torsen it is actually an ATB (auto torque biasing) differential.

So what I'm getting at is that if I'm correct on the MSP LSD being torque sensing as I belive it is, then they could call it a torsen TYPE differential it is NOT a Torsen (R) differential.

 

[TurfBurn]

Actually Torsen in a sense is a type of lsd. Torsen actually comes from TORque SENsing lsd. The lsd used in the msp is torque sensing, and doesn't require loss of traction before sending power to the other wheel, quite the opposite actually. Howstuffworks.com has a pretty good article on it with schematics and pictures, better off going there than me trying to fumble around and try to explain the thing.

That's pretty much what I was saying (that you don't need to lose traction etc) but Torsen is actually a brand... just like Kleenex as was pointed out above... it was a brand before it was a type... it's a patented form of differential. But now people often refer to any kind of torque sensing differential as a torsen diff. When torsen is actually a registered trade mark name...

Here is the company/brand website:
www.torsen.com

 

[DistantTea]

So did Mazda use the word Torsen on the window sticker or not?

 

[Glowmunkey]

So did Mazda use the word Torsen on the window sticker or not?

No.

 

[DistantTea]

Then never mind. I was told mazda specificly used the work "Torsen" on their window sticker.

 

[Newf]

I think some of you have too much time on your hands

Honestly, stuff like this gets started by speculation/rumors and people just guessing. My LSD works. Nuff said.

 

[Savoire]

I think some of you have too much time on your hands

Honestly, stuff like this gets started by speculation/rumors and people just guessing. My LSD works. Nuff said.

(lol) That's what I thought all the way !

 

[Notorious]

Yea i completely agree with you, i was just kind of expanding on what you were saying.

That's pretty much what I was saying (that you don't need to lose traction etc) but Torsen is actually a brand... just like Kleenex as was pointed out above... it was a brand before it was a type... it's a patented form of differential. But now people often refer to any kind of torque sensing differential as a torsen diff. When torsen is actually a registered trade mark name...

Here is the company/brand website:
www.torsen.com

 

[TurfBurn]

Yea i completely agree with you, i was just kind of expanding on what you were saying.

ahh.. gotchya... I thought you had misread me and were saying that it was NOT what I had said .

torsen... soon to be synanomous with "backpressure" and other highly misunderstood terminology of cars .