6MT Endangered?

[Buger]

Its a given that a manual trans SUV in the US wouldn't be as popular as an auto trans. And its also a given that the dealer would rather have an automatic since more of the buying public will want one so it is easier to sell. The dealerships just tell people who want the manual version that they don't have any and try to sell them an automatic in stock anyway.

The only reason I posted the example with the Durangos and Pathfinders is that the # of available CX-5 for each trim may not correspond to their actual production or sales #s. I'm kind of a numbers guy so just wanted to point out that 1.8% of CX-5 sport in dealer inventory doesn't mean that only 1.8% are being produced or sold in the US. As mentioned, I haven't seen any specific #s for this.

I also take it as a given that the 6MT sport is valuable as it allows Mazda to advertise the 35mpg highway as the highest highway mpg of any SUV including hybrids. Until skyactiv, Mazda hasn't really been competitive in fuel economy with other makers so it is great to see that they have really made strides forward in this regard. Despite all the givens, Mazda has always done things their own way so I don't think the 2.0 disappearing from the CX-5 is a given.

 

[dad of jon]

Yeah "American Exceptionalism" is at play, we always get screwed in the trim level charades game.

but in the uk we get screwed over price (argh)

 

[dad of jon]

Just curious... Do you know the approximate proportion of Auto vs. Manual sales in the UK? I've heard it's close to 50-50, but that may be old information... Thanks.

an unscientific poll of my colleagues cars in the the staff car park give 18 manual 2 autos.
however a totally made up poll of over 60's does give a 50/50 split.

 

[Bombadil]

I'm not sure what the take rate for manual CX-5s is. Last year, the manual take rate for Mazda 5s in Canada was 11%.

Even if only 1.8% of CX-5s are in stock at any given time, is it because people special order them because they want a specific colour and don't mind waiting, or do they get snatched up as soon as they hit the lot?

If they were selling as fast as they hit the lots, you would see far, far more of them coming in. Mazda would love to have a hot selling vehicle that pushed them up the sales charts. However the fact that they aren't even bothering to release a 2.5L MT tells us a lot. It means that they have reason to believe there is no significant demand for them.

 

[Bombadil]

I hope they offer the USA diesel with a stick. The British CX-5 with 2.2L diesel, 2WD, and 6-sp MT gets the US equivalent of 57 mpg highway and 43 city !!!!!

 

[Buger]

I hope they offer the USA diesel with a stick. The British CX-5 with 2.2L diesel, 2WD, and 6-sp MT gets the US equivalent of 57 mpg highway and 43 city !!!!!

The EPA testing will give lower #s but I would like to see more diesel stick shifts. I might be in the market for a Mazda3 in a year or 2 if they have a diesel with 6MT. Hopefully any rising oil issues will be resolved with the new Mazda6 diesel when it comes to the US already.

 

[ALafya]

Those are unlikely numbers. Also, unlikely to get a MT, but instead will be sold as top level trim, at a premium, with AT only.
I think ~15% better in MPG over the 2L gas engine is about right. However, apples to apples comparison requires factoring in the premium you'd pay for diesel. Here, it is about 7-10%, so only 5-7% better in $ per mile.
Don't forget the DPF issue causing fuel to dilute the oil. This engine may not be suited for short drives and will be more expensive to maintain.

 

[Bombadil]

The numbers Mazda posts for the UK versions are very high. With the 2.0L, FWD, and MT, the Mazda UK page lists the gas mileage as 37 city and 55 highway, in British gallons. Adjusting this for US gallons yields 31/45, which is much higher than US EPA estimates.

The UK CX-5's are also offered in high level trims with the MT. So Mazda is building these but choosing to not ship them to the USA.

 

[ttflyer]

but in the uk we get screwed over price (argh)

I think this has a lot to do with it as well... Cars are way expensive in Europe and I think people try and save the money where they can. Add in the cultural differences where Europeans take driving a bit more seriously then Americans - they have to pass a real test and actually know things like traffic laws to get a drivers license - and the higher number of MT cars makes sense...

 

[skeener]

Found this on Autoblog: "The 2.0-liter is the only 2014 CX-5 that can be had with Mazda's very good six-speed manual transmission, meanwhile, though product planners hinted that we may be seeing a 2.5L/6MT combo later in the model year."

 

[Bombadil]

Let's hope they do the right thing and make this available in the USA.

 

[CX-SV]

Found this on Autoblog: "The 2.0-liter is the only 2014 CX-5 that can be had with Mazda's very good six-speed manual transmission, meanwhile, though product planners hinted that we may be seeing a 2.5L/6MT combo later in the model year."

If any truth to that, then more likely the 2.0L is endangered.

 

[NinjaNoises]

If any truth to that, then more likely the 2.0L is endangered.

If this happens, I will cry for buying the 2.0 MT and not waiting...

 

[rjdee]

I would be surprised if they drop the 2.0. It makes a lot of manufacturing sense to have the motor in a couple different vehicles. If they drop the 2.0 from the CX5 that only leaves the Mazda3 using the 2.0 skyactive. I'll also argue that if they ever release a diesel then it's redundant to have 3 engines available in for the CX5. The sales volume wouldn't be there to support it.

Back to the tranny, I bought the manual since they have much better durability and maintainability than many automatics now. Replacing or rebuilding a modern automatic transmission is as expensive as replacing the engine. There are many stories of blown auto transmissions. I have much better confidence in being able to get a new clutch at a reasonable price than having a new transmission last to 150k miles. The amount of tech in the new transmissions is great for efficiency but makes me doubtful of the reliability. We'll have wait about 5-8 years to see for sure.

 

[ttflyer]

Found this on Autoblog: "The 2.0-liter is the only 2014 CX-5 that can be had with Mazda's very good six-speed manual transmission, meanwhile, though product planners hinted that we may be seeing a 2.5L/6MT combo later in the model year."

Well that just blew my plan out of the water. Thanks for the heads up! I was planning on buying a 2.0 MT as soon as my local dealer could get it my color in (first week of March, I think). But now I'm going to hold my fire for awhile and see if this pans out. I've had the good'ole CRV (MT) for about eight years. What's another six months? And besides, it's a great car and running fine . I know I'm dreaming here, but maybe they are planning to bring the 2.5L/6MT on one of the better "lines." I would gladly pay more for a better package if it were available...

 

[ttflyer]

Back to the tranny, I bought the manual since they have much better durability and maintainability than many automatics now. Replacing or rebuilding a modern automatic transmission is as expensive as replacing the engine.

Which is exactly why I started driving MT cars. I had a slushbox go out and paid about 2/3rds of what the car was worth to fix it - only to have it fail again a year later. So I vowed "never again!" Then I realized how much more control over the whole car I had with a MT and how much more fun and interactive an experience it was... Now I'm a MT snob .

 

[Bombadil]

I give credit to Mazda for putting more fun & control into their SkyActiv automatic transmissions. With full control over what gear you are in and with the tranny locking up for nearly 90% of the time, it's a lot better than your typical slushbox stuck in D(rive). That is, if it is reliable over 150,000 to 200,000 miles.

My aging Integra has a 5sp stick. Driving Integras with ATs is not the same experience at all. Sluggish, numb, pedestrian. The Mazda3 and CX-5 w/ATs are much better.

Still, it's a lot of fun working a stick shift and it would be great if they release a 2.5L MT. That would be a blast on the twisty turnies.

 

[Buger]

Thanks to Hank3 for posting the recent Edmunds article. It is a first time I've seen some #s from Mazda regarding the 6MT sales. It is expectedly low at 7% yet much higher than the 1.8% which was mentioned earlier in an attempt to extrapolate info by looking at cars.com online inventory. In the end, offering a manual trans in an SUV is another thing that sets Mazda apart from the norm and I'm glad they are continuing with it (reportedly) despite the small sales #s.

http://www.edmunds.com/mazda/cx-5/2014/road-test.html

In the Mazda 6, the 2.5-liter engine is offered with a six-speed manual or a six-speed automatic transmission, but if you want a manual in your 2014 CX-5, you'll have to drop back to the 2.0-liter Sport model, as the automatic is standard with the 2.5-liter engine. It's too bad, because the manual is startlingly good. However, Mazda officials tell us the take rate for the three-pedal CX-5 is a disappointing 7 percent.

 

[Bombadil]

Thanks to Hank3 for posting the recent Edmunds article. It is a first time I've seen some #s from Mazda regarding the 6MT sales. It is expectedly low at 7% yet much higher than the 1.8% which was mentioned earlier in an attempt to extrapolate info by looking at cars.com online inventory. In the end, offering a manual trans in an SUV is another thing that sets Mazda apart from the norm and I'm glad they are continuing with it (reportedly) despite the small sales #s.

That is an interesting, and disappointing number. And it is one that could well be getting worse over time, as MT sales on a new vehicles sometimes spike a bit when it is first offered. This is also a result of Mazda's own decision to offer it only on the Sport model. And given that they aren't currently offering it on any 2.5L, that 7% is bound to be dropping. For the message being delivered to prospective CX-5 owners is that if you want the MT, then you are restricted to only their most stripped down, 2.0L engine model. Whereas if it was offered on a 2.5L Touring, that's a much nicer option.

 

[pt00323i]

after driving my 2.0/6mt for few month now, I really don't mind the under power, yes is kind of slow during take off and on ramps, but if you keep the revs up 3500+ it does pull pretty well. and once it gets going 70-80mph it pulls just fine, on long steep grade I usually shift to 5th gear, I also can't complain about the gas mileage, one tank from Bay area to LA

But if they had a 2.5L/6mt at the time of purchase I might consider that, I can live with 1-2mpg hit.

either way thumbs up for Mazda for bring in the manual!! no other company is willing to do so.