Unfortunate situation, new owner... What to do??!

[Always Forgive]

Hello all. Forgive me if this is being posted in the wrong forum, as it is my first post. I recently purchased a 2007 Mazdaspeed 3 GT with 26xxx miles on it, one previous owner. The Carfax report showed dealer service records across the entire span of ownership, all from the dealership that sold the car originally. I have had the car for 11 days, and yesterday morning I was left on the side of the road with what appears to be a blown engine, the only thing I had done to the car after taking delivery was an oil change. The car came with a cat-back system and that's it, as far as I can tell, no other modifications under the hood or to the drivetrain. I contacted the dealership that originally sold the car in 2007, and the service manager was very nice and helpful. She said to me, over the phone, that my car had been in before and that the engine had been replaced! I was totally sickened upon hearing this, and I am concerned that I will be getting f**ked in this situation. The car is still under Mazda's 60 month/60,000 powertrain warranty as far as I have been told, and not only that, I have been doing some reading and making some phone calls in my effort to collect info before I head to the dealer in a few days. It seems that this engine has a "high" failure rate, and several engines have failed in similar fashions to mine, no warning, no CEL or oil pressure/level indicators and no noise or driveability issues. I haven't even gotten plates or made a payment on the car yet, so I'm terribly upset.

Cliffsnotes: New Speed3 owner, engine failure, replaced once before I became 2nd owner, worried about warranty coverage.

Forgive my rant, I'm just trying to have some sort of level headed approach and make sure this works out. Thanks!

 

[b e z]

There were a lot of issues with the 07 models and mazda seemed to fix these issues with the 08.5 and 09s. My guess would be that the car was modded from the previous owner and before they sold it they parted it out, very common. I would still be very upset to find out that the motor has been replaced once and you did not know about this but I would imagine mazda would be taking care of you in this instance. So I would guess that the dealership has the car and you are waiting to hear back from them?

 

[Always Forgive]

b e z, the car is in front of my apartment right now, it will be towed to the dealership Tuesday morning. They are setting me up with a loaner car for as long as my car is in the shop, but I haven't gotten a definite answer yet obviously because the car hasn't been inspected. Nothing is certain. I do agree with you, if the car was modified/parted out prior to me owning it then I have no control over that, but I haven't done anything except the oil change, hopefully I don't inherit the previous owner's issues.

 

[b e z]

You havent had the car long enough to really do anything anyways so I dont see how they could possibly blame you for this. Now if they replace the motor again I would say you should be safe then but it seems like when mazda replaces either the turbo or the motor it eventually fails again. But for now lets hope they take good care of you and fix it no problem.

 

[Always Forgive]

That's exactly my standpoint. I have been working in the service/parts industry for over a decade and have built many modified cars, so I am fully aware of what not to do. The exhaust came on the car, and I think we all know that isn't going to cause engine failure. I am concerned about the possibility of an aftermarket tune (COBB/Hypertech etc.) that may be stored in the ECU somewhow. If so, I would think that the car would behave much differently with all of the stock parts back on, no?

 

[boosted1]

That's exactly my standpoint. I have been working in the service/parts industry for over a decade and have built many modified cars, so I am fully aware of what not to do. The exhaust came on the car, and I think we all know that isn't going to cause engine failure. I am concerned about the possibility of an aftermarket tune (COBB/Hypertech etc.) that may be stored in the ECU somewhow. If so, I would think that the car would behave much differently with all of the stock parts back on, no?

There would be evidence internally, that the ECU was altered. As stated, there is a very good possibility that the engine failure is a result of a overly aggressive tune. For certain, an HT would not be the culprit. Is there any indications underhood, that wires were altered?

 

[Always Forgive]

boosted1, I have been under the hood extensively after this incident and haven't found anything out of the ordinary, but I also don't have anything to compare to. If there were to be tuning related issues, wouldn't it be somewhat obvious? I came from a WRX, and if I were to have taken my stage 2+ parts off of the car and left the tune, it would experience some sort of driveability issue for sure. Different platform with the Mazda, but I would think similar principles?

 

[TiGraySpeed6]

same principles apply here too.

add to that that an AP or HT can only be involved with one ECU, it's highly unlikely that the PO wouldn't have "divorced" the tuner from the vehicle so it could be sold.

Sorry for your hassles- no doubt it's giving you a bad taste of what is actually a very fun platform

 

[b e z]

Im with Tigray, if someone had modded the car with a tune and then decided to part it out they definitely removed the tune.

 

[Always Forgive]

TiGraySpeed6, I'm assuming what you're saying is that the previous owner could have "unmarried" an AP or Hypertech and kept it for resale or future use, leaving the car, and me, with a tune unsuitable for stock parts? If that's the case I'm certain I'll be f**ked with the warranty situation, makes sense however. Too much fuel, too little fuel, boost, timing etc. could all be reasons for this failure. Wonderful. I'm honestly not discouraged as much as I thought I would be with this situation, just worried sick. I appreciate the advice you guys have given me thus far!

 

[b e z]

If they unmarried the car from a tune it returned it to stock so there is no fear there, unless they ran the car with aftermarket parts on stock tune, which in turn will either cause knock or make the fuel trims off.

 

[TiGraySpeed6]

other way around-

AP as an example: the AP will only speak to a single ECU. (married) In order to sell the AP to another mazda owner, your PO would have to "divorce" the AP from your car, thus returning the ECU to the OEM tune, before that AP could be "married" to another vehicle.

that is, once unmarried, or divorced, the stock original OEM tune is put back on the ECU.
Otherwise too many folks would purchase, install a tune, then pass it to their buddy to install a tune and so on

 

[Always Forgive]

Ah, got it. That's what i figured. Thank you for clarifying.

 

[meicalnissyen]

I am thinking more about the aftermarket exhaust, I know they sold it with it on the car, but MNA could still deny based on that alone

 

[Always Forgive]

I'm concerned as well, even with the original converters in place, it's still an aftermarket part. I did inform the service writer of this, and that it came on the car. I'm hoping the fact that the engine has been replaced once before is enough to get this to work out. I'm going to take detailed pictures of the car as it sits now as well, just to protect myseLf from any future problems.

 

[Wurf]

I am thinking more about the aftermarket exhaust, I know they sold it with it on the car, but MNA could still deny based on that alone

+1

They really shouldn't, but I would not be remotely surprised if they did.
All the things I've read here about MNA and the way they've handled some customers in the past, I wouldn't put it past them.
At the same time I have read some stories where MNA did the right thing and replaced blown turbos without any drama and few questions so who knows.

Per another poster, an HT tune is safe in these cars with stock turbo and typical bolt-on mods assuming the PO selected the proper hardware when setting up the HT. If for example they had some off brand Ebay SRI or something not listed in the supported list from HT, and chose the wrong unit, they could have hurt the motor but I doubt that's likely. I doubt they ran an HT at all.

I'm guessing ( pure speculation ) because it's an 07 the PO ran the first gen Mazdaspeed CAI on the car that didn't have an air straightener and unkowingly leaned it out for awhile. Be curious to know how it died. Amazing you only had it a short while and it died.

Best of luck to you OP. Hope it works out for you and you get a new motor, or at least a rebuilt unit.

 

[MSMS3]

I'd be more concerned that the car was modded and UNTUNED. That can certainly put a lot of stress on engine internals if air to fuel ratios are high, if boost is run higher than stock on the small K04 turbo and not tapered toward redline, if there are boost spikes, which can happen with a downpipe and no tuning.

And then there's the issue of modding extensively and not upgrading the stock fuel pump. That is a known issue. This is a direct injection engine with fuel rail pressures of about 1700 psi. If the fuel pump cannot keep up with demand and load, it will "take a crap" so to speak, and this can result in a lean out of the engine with resultant piston damage. Our high pressure cam driven fuel pump shares the same internals as the 2.0 turbo VW and Audi. They had similar issues with the fuel pump running out of steam on modded engines. So, there is a well-developed aftermarket for fuel pump internals that work for our car too. If your prior owner did not upgrade the pump and installed a lot of mods, or had a bad tune with over-aggressive mapping, that could have caused the failure. That damage could have been before the car was "returned to stock" and might not show up for a while. Sort of a straw that broke the camel's back.

The dealer should be able to determine the cause of failure when they do the inspection and tear down.

Now, the good news: Yes, there is good news. Assuming the dealer does treat you right under the warranty, since it's not your fault in any way, you get a new engine. That means a new turbo with the upgraded positive crankcase ventillation system (new design intake manifold), new high pressure fuel pump, new everything. You should be starting from scratch. As stated above, the ECU has already been flashed back to stock if it was not already. The dealer will give you an updated flash and you should be good as gold.

Then, if you do decide to upgrade the car yourself, I'd recommend you be careful to avoid doing anything that could jeoparodize your warranty, which will probably be limited to the duration of the remaining warranty on the car. A good mod to make that is Mazda approved is the official Mazdaspeed cold air intake, which you can get directly from the dealer or from independent vendors. It is approved for warranty and will give you an instant 15-20 whp gain over the very highly restrictive stock air box. Other than that, I'd leave it alone and enjoy the power until your warranty runs out then consider other power additions that are sensible and properly coordinated to stay safe, or simply stay stock.

I don't think the engine failure should be considered as a negative. Look at it this way: How many owners of cars of that year and mileage have a zero mileage totally new engine?

 

[ohioan]

Always forgive, where in the great northeast are you ...roughly?

 

[Always Forgive]

Morning all, thanks for all of the advice and input! I will be keeping this thread updated as things progress. The dealership is giving me a loaner car in the mean time, I'm taking that as a good thing. Wurf, like you said, its hit or miss with car companies these days, but the engine has been replaced once before under warranty, by Mazda... that's my leg to stand on. MSMS3, my original intent with this car was to keep it as close to stock as possible, my interests and direction with cars has changed over the past year or so. If and when I get the car back with the repairs made, it will further reinforce that fact... ohioan, I am from New Jersey.

 

[Always Forgive]

Sad news, the dealership is denying warranty as of this afternoon for the following reasons...
1) Air inlet tube clamps are other than Mazda OEM
2) Air box hold down missing
3) Exhaust nut on manifold to turbo missing
4) Clamp for factory bypass valve is other than Mazda OEM
5) Aftermarket boost gauge installed by previous owner, was not hooked and functioning
The car had no driveability issues or signs of anything needing to be repaired or replaced when I was having my mechanic change the oil and due a brief visual inspection. I have started the appeal process for warranty coverage through Mazda North America becuase none of these things indicate a direct correlation to engine failure, but, according to the dealership the show "signs of modification or intent to alter the vehicle's stock equiptment". I am sick to my stomach over this, becuase the engine has been replaced at this dealership before I took ownership and the car is still under 60/60k powertrain warranty.