Intermittent shift problem, idle (ie stop light) to first ONLY, manual transaxle ???

LostinCanada

Member
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2003 Mazda Protege5
Hi all,

Ok one last gripe to get rid of that has just cropped up again. Sometimes my car goes through a wave where it doesn't want to shift into first gear very easily from idle. Generally seems to happen partway through a drive when things are warm, or maybe a part gets bumped out of alignment or ???

I'll be waiting at a stop light and then go to put the car into first and it mechanically doesn't want to go there - sometimes I have to force it in. No issues while driving or in any other gear - shifting is very nice in this car.

There is a tonne of troubleshooting advice for the automatic model, but nothing in the service manual for manual transaxle (at least that I could find).

All four engine mounts are new within the last 6 months (MAZDA OEM) - the rear was just replaced within the week. Transaxle fluid is all topped up and the clutch fluid level is good.

Anyone had this problem before? Any ideas what to check?

Thanks for any help!
 
LOL... I' been driving manuals most of my life - kind of hard to roll uphill into gear. And bypassing a troublesome gear isn't really the solution I was looking for...Something seems out of adjustment/alignment hoping for some maintenance troubleshooting advice.
 
Ha maybe I'm just used to driving million mile manuals. Every one I've ever driven can take a tiny bump every once in a while to slide into gear. My first gear has always taken an extra nudge to slide in. Just a trait of the transmission I assumed
 
Sometimes the gears just don't line up, but this is a pretty rare occurrence in my experience. I have only had one car that would do it every once in a while, and it wasn't the P5.

When this happens, does the car want to creep forward, and does the idle speed slow down like the clutch is dragging a little? This would indicate a clutch problem, like the hydraulics bleeding down, or the pilot bearing dragging/catching.
 
Hmmm... I'll watch for those traits next time the car is hot and acting up - and report back. Tonight I just drove to a couple stores and back after the car cooled down for a few hours and didn't experience any issue. Seems if I drive it hard down the highway and then do some stop and go city driving is when it happens - but not always consistently.

I noticed when I changed my first three engine mounts 6 months ago, two of which were torn, the car shifted like the gears were buttered for a few months afterwards. It was really noticeable and quite amazing.

This feels mechanical somehow - like something is binding or jamming - just enough. What about the shift linkage or pedal travel? My clutch pedal, which has always squeaked a little, is now squeaking really loudly. Probably unrelated but I was going to peer under there tomorrow and see if I can LPS it or something.
 
OK @MrGiggles,
Had a chance to pay attention for the symptoms you describe and I don't have those. I do have a loudly squeaking pedal though, and googling that produced a lot of results. So I'm thinking of whether I should pull the clutch pedal apart, as well as the clutch master cylinder, and rebuild those with new seals/bushings etc. Has anyone done this, and if yes, any writeups with pictures? Can I even get a seal kit for the master cylinder (new one is $140).

I did find one thread that described issues similar to mine and one forum user asked the OP if he/she had tried pumping the clutch several times at the stop and if that would help it into first. Unfortunately no explanation was given for the test, and no response from the OP. Just for yuks I have been testing this, and it does seem to help. Is this a valid test, and if yes, what does it mean? Master cylinder?

Thanks!
 
If the clutch system is leaking down, pumping the pedal will bring it back for a short while. Could be master or slave, the slave will usually leak fluid though, the master will just bypass, and the fluid level will stay the same.

When it won't go into gear, have you tried just letting the clutch out in neutral for a bit, then trying to go back in gear?
 
I think you're on the right track with looking at the hydraulic system.

The clutch isn't disengaging entirely, but I'm not sure why it would only do it while hot. I would check the fluid level and condition, and then rebuild/replace the master cylinder. Hopefully, it isn't the slave.
 
checked the gear oil?
Pretty common for people to negect the transmission oil. Funky things can start to happen it its low or filthy.
 
@ap123 Yes the gear oil is fine. I changed the fluid several months ago and then topped it up recently when I did the on-the-car ring job. The shaft popped out from the bell housing and I lost some fluid. I've checked it twice since to be sure the transaxle seal isn't leaking - which it doesn't appear to be.

Thanks @pcb - I was looking at those. Didn't see a rebuild kit though - do they not exist?. Yes I realize the aftermarket options are dirt cheap but I'm still pissed I gave my OEM brake calipers to Mazda when I bought aftermarket (junk) calipers from them. I had planned on rebuilding the originals but the 4 new calipers were cheaper than the 2 seal sets. Now I'm stuck with the damn things.

Are there any brand/model reviews for the replacement master cylinders?

My fluid level isn't discernably dropping and the fluid was new 6 months ago when I did the calipers.
 
Ok so that's good then I'm assuming. So do you know of a seal kit for the Master or am do people just chuck and go with aftermarket cylinder replacement?
 
Is it easier if you first put it into 2nd, then 1st? Or is it hard to get it into 2nd also? This could rule out a few things.
 
I'm still pissed I gave my OEM brake calipers to Mazda when I bought aftermarket (junk) calipers from them.

I'm pretty sure you'll have better luck with aftermarket slave and master cylinders...

It's our damn rebuilt rear calipers that are causing us so many problems. I'm pretty sure the rebuilder dudes aren't replacing the internal components when they're being rebuilt.

EDIT... I just checked Rockauto and the is NO core charge for the master or slave cylinders but there IS for brake calipers.

I'm 99% sure you will get brand new components with the cylinders...

Save some big bucks and go aftermarket.

The "hearted" stuff is most preferred by customers.
 
Ok so that's good then I'm assuming. So do you know of a seal kit for the Master or am do people just chuck and go with aftermarket cylinder replacement?

Mazda does show a couple seal kits in their IPL, but they don't specify what they are for. An actual dealer may know what is needed for rebuilding the stock cylinders.
 
Thanks! I'm going to call them tomorrow and find out. I see in the service manual there are instructions for disassembly/assembly and the parts listed for replacement are a bushing, primary cup, spacer, piston and secondary cup component and snap ring (not sure why you couldn't reuse the snap ring). The procedure looks pretty straight forward... They don't say to replace it but I wonder if the return spring gets weak?

 
Thanks @pcb... I was wondering what the hearts meant. Is there a benchmark or percentage of "likes" for a heart symbol? Or 1 or 100 doesn't matter...
 
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