Autogefühl drives and reviews new Mazda CX-60 PHEV

That's supposed to be their much improved wet clutch 8-speed. I have the old 7-speed dry clutch version which is even worse. The take-off behavior is downright crude if you prefer to step off the line gently. It just sits there and shudders for 3-4 seconds because it has been programmed not to "slip" the clutch to prevent wear and heat buildup so instead it modulates between two plate pressures. I can't believe an entire team of engineers put this through testing and all went "yep, this works fine" at the end. Between that and the outright stumbling and clutch engagement failures it's like having a 14 year old who's just learning stick for the first time shifting for you.

I don't think Mazda will have a tough time doing better than Kia/Hyundai did, but DCTs by their very nature are kind of crude at low speeds and at take-off, so sadly we all have to trade refinement for efficiency these days.
 
It's a MCT. Very similar to what Mercedes uses. It's basically a normal Planetary gearset, but replaces the torque convertor with a clutch.

The big difference is here below...
DCT's have 2 shafts, one for odd gears, the other for even. In normal operation, it'll predict your next gear and quickly shift to the other shaft when needed, but you get bad hesitation if it ready's the wrong gear because it needs to select a different one.

MCT's are planetary gearsets so it selects gears like a normal transmission would.

The biggest con for clutches vs torque convertors are low speed starts, but with electrification, I think this won't be a big deal. The vehicle will likely start with electric propulsion with a fully locked clutch.
 
The biggest con for clutches vs torque convertors are low speed starts, but with electrification, I think this won't be a big deal. The vehicle will likely start with electric propulsion with a fully locked clutch.
This is certainly true for the hybrid model, but there is going to be a gasoline only inline-6 model too that won't have the benefit of this.
 
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2018 CX-9 GT
The inline 6 should be a mild-hybrid, not gasoline only. See the powertrain video here:
Thread 'Mazda Large Product Technology Forum'
https://mazdas247.com/forum/t/mazda-large-product-technology-forum.123877682/

And screenshot:
5FBDDA38-17F6-4B13-A41A-3B0F5C4BA5F2.png
https://mazdas247.com/forum/t/mazda-large-product-technology-forum.123877682/
 
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'17, Mazda 6 GT
The full review of the CX-60 in Germany just dropped. Interesting, seems like a lot of things improved since the pre-model presentation however it seems not to have the same Mazda sportiness as the other models.

My guess is that it is related to the plugin hybrid drive train, therefore the six cylinder engines should do way better.

 
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2021 CX-9 Sig
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2021 CX-5 GT
What I don't understand is that the move to the RWD architecture was supposed to result in a more sporty drive. But the reviews say the opposite, that the old CX-5 feels sportier.

If that is the case, what do you get to the move to a RWD system?
 
What I don't understand is that the move to the RWD architecture was supposed to result in a more sporty drive. But the reviews say the opposite, that the old CX-5 feels sportier.

If that is the case, what do you get to the move to a RWD system?
The added weight of the PHEV is probably the biggest reason for this. We will need to wait for the much lighter inline-6 to determine what is possible with the new RWD platform.
 
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2022 CX-5 Turbo
The added weight of the PHEV is probably the biggest reason for this. We will need to wait for the much lighter inline-6 to determine what is possible with the new RWD platform.
I 100% agree. I recall when I was 50lbs lighter .... :LOL:
 

cx5boo333

2021 Cx5 GT AWD
The added weight of the PHEV is probably the biggest reason for this. We will need to wait for the much lighter inline-6 to determine what is possible with the new RWD platform.
I just looked it up and the difference in weight between the rav4 gas vs plug in hybrid is around 600 pounds minimum. That's crazy! I had no clue plug in hybrids added THAT much weight. Now I'm extra excited to see the new motor variants :D
 
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2018 CX-9 GT
What I don't understand is that the move to the RWD architecture was supposed to result in a more sporty drive. But the reviews say the opposite, that the old CX-5 feels sportier.

If that is the case, what do you get to the move to a RWD system?

A RWD architecture doesn’t make handling sportier, what it does is make the power delivery sportier in a sense that it is a more effective way to deliver power to the ground than FWD. In a sense that: the tires do not have the double duty of changing direction AND apply power, the weigth of the vehicle shift back while accelerating increasing traction for power delivery and it is a better layout to distribute vehicle weight evenly. It also prevents torque steer from being an issue.

Other than that a lot of the rest comes from suspension tuning. It looks like Mazda has tuned the cx-60 suspension more towards the luxury/cruising side as opposed to sporty/quick turning setup that it typically used in the past.
 
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'17, Mazda 6 GT
A RWD architecture doesn’t make handling sportier, what it does is make the power delivery sportier in a sense that it is a more effective way to deliver power to the ground than FWD. In a sense that: the tires do not have the double duty of changing direction AND apply power, the weigth of the vehicle shift back while accelerating increasing traction for power delivery and it is a better layout to distribute vehicle weight evenly. It also prevents torque steer from being an issue.

Other than that a lot of the rest comes from suspension tuning. It looks like Mazda has tuned the cx-60 suspension more towards the luxury/cruising side as opposed to sporty/quick turning setup that it typically used in the past.
You don't design double wishbone on couches, usually. The reviews are skewed as everybody else said due to the weight of the car and the weird engine/gearbox power transmission from electric to gas.

I would wait for the i6 to drop or any other gas engines to see the full benefit of this platforn.
 
This review mentioned that the CX-60 does much better than other PHEV when transitioning between engine and electric. I look forward to the inline-6 reviews.


A brief test drive of the 2023 CX-60 in western Germany near Mazda’s European headquarters quickly showcased the merits of such an arrangement, with the powertrain operating with little indication of its dual-source nature. While most PHEVs noticeably switch between gas and electric propulsion, it was only when this one was deliberately set in its electric mode – as well as the occasional clunky transition – that there was any notion of how it all works.
 
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2021 CX-9 Sig
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2021 CX-5 GT
I just looked it up and the difference in weight between the rav4 gas vs plug in hybrid is around 600 pounds minimum. That's crazy! I had no clue plug in hybrids added THAT much weight. Now I'm extra excited to see the new motor variants :D

Wow. I did not realize it was that much heavier. That is nuts.
 
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'17, Mazda 6 GT
The Signature Style model just been previewed in Japan and it shows some of the accessories. Its interesting however I find the use of chrome, too much in your face. A black chrome would be nice.