Aftermarket speakers - NO BASS?

[JeffEmbracedDC]

Hey, guys.

So I just installed a set of CDT Eurosport speakers in the front doors. It's a 3-way set with a 6" woofer, 4" mid, and 1" tweeter. It's about a $1,500 set of speakers.

I'm using an Alpine PDX 1.150 pushing about 300 watts to each door. So everything's hooked up, i sealed the door panel with closed cell foam and tape all over - completely sealed. I switch the filters on the amp off (no HPF, LPF, etc). Full signal. I switch it on. Everything looks good. All drivers are pumping nice and hard...

So what's the problem? Even though my 6" driver is pumping hard.. it's almost SILENT! The mid and tweeter are loud as they should be but the woofer sounds as if it weren't even there.

So just to answer a few more questions
- Yes, the speakers, amp, and crossovers are hooked up correctly.
- Yes, high pass filter is OFF. Running full signal.
- Yes, the door is sealed.
- Yes, the mounting is extremely sturdy.
- Yes, the are in phase.
- Yes, I am running sufficient wire gauge (12g to woofers, 12g to mids, 14g to tweeters - probably way overkill)

I've used this model of speaker in other installs (jetta, etc) with FANTASTIC results. All of a sudden I put them in a Mazda with these mounting rings and it sounds as if they don't even exist.

So basically I'm wondering if anyone else has had similar issues with the Mazda 3 / speed 3.

Thanks, guys.

-Jeff

 

[Ninja3030]

One of your 6" is probably out of phase ( - and + reversed on one of them).

 

[JeffEmbracedDC]

Already done that. Tried changing the phase of both of them one at a time. No difference

-Jeff

 

[hectik1]

Do you/did you check the filters on your amp?

 

[JeffEmbracedDC]

yeah the filters are all shut off. No LPF, no HPF. Full signal. The speaker is moving like it should - there's just VERY VERY little sound. probably only about 8% volume. I've also taken the crossovers out of the equation and fed the full signal in to one woofer just for a test and same result. speaker moves like normal but is almost silent. I will try to take a video tomorrow.

-Jeff

 

[Rix6]

sounds like the speakers are not properly sealed. You absolutely must have an air tight seal between the front of the speaker and the back of the speaker or pressure will leak front to rear and kill your bass response.

 

[JeffEmbracedDC]

They're as air tight as door panels can be. Every little crack, space, bolt hole, fitting, etc has been sealed with closed cell adhesive foam sheet. They are 10x more sealed than any other door panel that I have installed in and I've never had a problem before. I have the feeling that it's the angled mounting ring system possibly constricting air flow to the back of the cone possibly. I may have to go with a more flush design. But yeah they're sealed like no one's business. You'd suffocate if you were a bug in there.

And I've also tried without so much sealing to cause some sort of port effects with the same results.

-Jeff

 

[Rix6]

I am not talking about the door sealing - I am talking about the speaker itself. Did you caulk it or use some other type of sealant when you fastened it into the door? If it is not air tight from front to back of speaker you will lose bass...

 

[JeffEmbracedDC]

Yeah of course. Completely sealed with closed cell foam double sided tape and even silicone in certain places. absolutely 100% sealed around the entire thing.

 

[dpstrand]

Double check phase. Just reverse + and - on one of them and give it a test listen. Sounds like an out of phase problem to me.

 

[JeffEmbracedDC]

Double check phase. Just reverse + and - on one of them and give it a test listen. Sounds like an out of phase problem to me.

checked Even when faded all of the way to one side (remove left channel all together) it's the same thing. The two channels aren't cancelling each other out. Like I said before I unhooked the crossovers and fed the full signal in to one woofer and had the same result. Very little sound, driver moving a lot. I am lead to believe it may be the lack of air flow behind the cone (view here http://www.flickr.com/photos/jeffjassky/3880678218/). All of the holes you see there have been filled and sealed including the huge one behind the 4" driver.

-Jeff

 

[JeffEmbracedDC]

I'm going to get some regular flat mounting adapters tomorrow and see what happens. Hopefully I can find a local audio shop that has 6x8 to 6.5 rounds.

 

[Breezy]

Maybe you got some bad speakers? Have you asked the mfr?

 

[JeffEmbracedDC]

I'm pretty positive the speakers are good. They seem to be pumping really hard like they should be. I'm going to swap them out with another speaker today that I know works well and see what happens... but I'm pretty sure the speakers are good. But yeah actually I have called the manufacturer. I sent them photos and a description of the system and they're going over the issue with their engineers to see what might be the problem. I gave them a link to this thread as a reference. I'm gonna try flat mounting rings and swapping drivers today. wish me luck.

-Jeff

 

[JeffEmbracedDC]

I installed the speakers in another vehicle and they work FANTASTICALLY. The problem is definitely not the speakers themselves. I picked up some mounting rings today but they seem to be the wrong size. I'll have to put something together myself. Hopefully flush mounting will solve my problem!

 

[billyrohm]

What kind of head unit

 

[AutoSoundCentral]

Sounds like you did a lot of troubleshooting.

This would be my next steps:
1. Unhook one speaker set at the amplifier- turn on system and see what happens (with one speaker connected try reversing polarity)
2. Disconnect all speakers from the amp and hook up a different speaker and see how it sounds with the amp.
3. Swap out the amp or use the factory radio amp and see how the speaker sounds.
One of those three situations should have you figure something out- especially since you said you took one side of the set and it worked great on a different vehicle.
Hope that helps figure something out.

 

[JeffEmbracedDC]

Well I tried the flush mounting. Bass was slightly louder. I ended up making some tweaks to my angled mount and a number of other tweaks to the door panel, speaker, wiring, mounting and amp and it's improved to an acceptable level. Not quite what I was hoping but as good as it will get without taking a completely different approach. It actually sounds amazing - just not a ton of low end. It plays down to about 90hz well so a subwoofer should fill out the system nicely.

 

[Ninja3030]

From what I see on your pictures, your woofer is fixed on your door pannel, which is clipped on your door. You really want your woofer to be mounted rigid on your door. All loose on clip of panel door probably absorb your base.

 

[meicalnissyen]

I installed the speakers in another vehicle and they work FANTASTICALLY. The problem is definitely not the speakers themselves. I picked up some mounting rings today but they seem to be the wrong size. I'll have to put something together myself. Hopefully flush mounting will solve my problem!

Well, since you clearly have a good Idea of what your doing, I have one thought

that oval shaped piece of plastic on the door panel, did you trim it completely away??

I wonder, since you likely have correct electrical install, mebbe the cone cant physically move ??