Please clarify the mileage at the time of failure. I read you had 27K and 1 year left on the powertrain warranty.. I assume you had a 5 year 60,000 mile powertrain warranty. With the way I understand this, your vehicle head cracked at only 33,000 miles. Am I understanding this correctly?
2.5T Engine Coolant Leaking TSB
- Thread starter Hawke
- Start date
The invoice doesn’t mention any transmission fluid or transfer case gear oil, but it does include the drain plug crush washers and oil seals for those, so if they replaced those the fluid would have come out — but here is no mention of the fluid for those on in invoice with zero balance.
So my question is for those who are familiar with the actual TSB repair procedure for coolant leak/head replacement on the CX-9/CX-5 if the transmission and transfer case got a drain and fill as part of this repair.
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Vehicle had 27k miles when I noticed coolant level had dropped after smelling slight burnt coolant in the cabin. Who knows how long it would have taken to really manifest into a full blown leak with coolant all over the place, could have been another 10k or 20k miles. Overall have been very happy with the CX-5, but it really sucked to encounter this issue. Hoping the repair holds, so far so good.
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I agree that this is a faulty design and shouldn't happen. Manufacturer warranties exist solely to cover defects. If it is expected that engines should run without major repair until 150,000 miles for example, than that would have to be fought for, perhaps regulated. Just as EV batteries are mandated to be warrantied to 100,000 miles.
So the typical 60K powertrain warranty is there to protect buyers from manufacturing defects. Do I think it should be higher? Yes, but it isn't. If the engine explodes at 60,001 miles, the manufacturer has no obligation to help. It's strictly good will at that point. If it is a known defect, the company can do good by the customer and help to preserve loyalty and reputation.
Hyundai and Kia made a big deal out of their 100K powertrain warranties. They still managed to weasel out of covering many issues. Industry standard is 60K though and expecting that to be ignored just doesn't make sense. I think because there's an expectation that engines are supposed to last the general life of a car that it makes us think that we should have protection for that time. There is no lifetime warranty though. 60k means 60k.
Thanks for the clarity.. I hate to think that it only lasts that low of mileage before failure. I have a 2020 CX-9 that gets driven very little due to me now working from home mostly. I have been tracking a minor coolant drop in the coolant tank but this could be normal evaporation. It's not ever dropped to the ADD Line as of yet. I pull into a garage and never smell coolant. This vehicle only has 5,000 miles on it and will likely fail after the 5 year warranty is up. I did a recent oil change and see no sign of leakage yet. I did check my VIN Number and it does fall within the range of the TSB Coolant leak/Cracked Head issue. So far this vehicle is used on trips and does not get short tripped hardly ever.
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- Plano, Texas, USA
When Mazda redesigned the cylinder head and exhaust manifold gasket, and acknowledged “driving over bumps” could make the head crack and leaking coolant, this simply indicates Mazda has admitted the design flaw on the head from the 2.5T. 60K-mile powertrain warranty or not, this head crack problem will be expensive to fix, and it makes the car owners getting into a difficult situation and have to make a tough decision how to handle it if there’s no warranty. It depends on the car manufactures to handle this problem which is also a difficult situation for them and how much money they want to spend. This all should be blamed on Mazda itself, not to have a proper design on cylinder head modification from original 2.5L NA head, and not to have a full longevity test to the new head at beginning. Similar pattern happens to the cylinder head modification on the 2.5L NA with cylinder deactivation, the head could crack and leaking oil.
So whether or not the Mazda would want to become a Hyundai or Kia on quality and reliability? That’s Mazda’s call.
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- Plano, Texas, USA
Honestly with so little miles you’re driving, your 2.5T could be fine for the next 10 years. But the problem is the unknown. Even Mazda can’t tell you how long your inferior cylinder head can last. It’s like a ticking time bomb but you just don’t know when it’d blow up.
If you can live under such unknown pressure, or you have some money saved just for such problem in case it happens without warranty, you can keep the 2020 CX-9 and enjoy the ride. Or you can have a plan to unload your CX-9 at a proper time and get a diffrtent vehicle.
What you are saying is kind of what I thought too. It's likely the mileage per year will pick up to some degree as we retire out one or more of our older vehicles. But at least it should be paid off by the time it fails. As long as the rest of the vehicle is in good shape, I'd most likely just have it repaired.. I may even source a 2022-2023 engine from a junk yard if that happens to be a viable option at the time. I wasn't worried about it very much until I read where this CX-5 failed at 27K. I was thinking how many have failed at much more mileage and thought I should be able to get a decent amount of usage out of it. Around where I live it could be totaled out from a deer way before the leak occurs.
CX_MCHNE
Thread Necromancer
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- CA
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- 2019 GTR
2019 CX-5 GTR, 21K miles. Just noticed coolant is at the Low mark. Going to inspect under the car to see what I can see. If I see some green stuff I'll head to the dealer. I have CS axle-back and short-ram intake. Anyone have any info on whether those would affect Mazda's decision to repair this issue free?
You may be able to see the back of the head and look for coolant or dried green residue. A mechanic's mirror (like an oversized dentist's mirror) and a flashlight may help.
I was able to get an extended service contract (what is often erroneously called an extended warranty) for less than $2k from my credit union. The fine print does not limit the covered engine repairs to "oil lubricated parts" so it'll cover a cracked head. It'll also cover other repairs except the usual wear parts, so I think I'll do OK with this. It covers a reasonable future time and mileage that I don't think I'll fully use on this 2016. By the way, any unused time or mileage when the car is sold is refundable, but most don't claim it.
I'm thinking more of extended service contracts after our 2017 Toyota Prius Prime needed an HVAC repair costing $5k. We traded the car in for a new EV rather than fix it, but didn't trade to the dealership that diagnosed the repair.
I'm thinking more of extended service contracts after our 2017 Toyota Prius Prime needed an HVAC repair costing $5k. We traded the car in for a new EV rather than fix it, but didn't trade to the dealership that diagnosed the repair.
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It’s very tight to get to the TSB location 1 on the exhaust manifold bolt and past that to get to TSB location 2 where the head cracks.
I got a $30 endoscope for iPhone on Amazon with a built-in LED flashlight and sent it in from the passenger side just between the turbo and exhaust manifold - you can follow the 2 exhaust manifold studs down to a tray (metal exhaust gasket) and use that to guide the bore scope to the TSB location 1 and then onto TSB location 2. You have to pop the bore scope out of the tray to get around to TSB location 2. It takes some twisting of the scope cable but eventually you can get a picture of it.
Here is location 2 with green coolant drips from a small crack on the head.
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Also found the CX-9 coolant leak engine tear down video from Car Wizard on YouTube “Why does it cost $4k to replace $50 gasket” super helpful understanding where I needed to look.
Picture below is the metal exhaust gasket (tray) on the head. The bottom of this picture faces down when attached to the lower block and the 4 exhaust ports face to the back of the car, so this is what it looks like if you’re sitting in the passenger seat and could see through the firewall, with the head tilted forward 90 degrees.
So you slide the bore scope from the upper right, down past the two exhaust studs on the right, hit the bottom right corner of the tray (metal exhaust gasket) and follow the tray along the bottom from right to left, go past the middle bottom stud (TSB location 1) and keep following along the bottom of the tray to the lower left exhaust stud, and then twist the bore scope cable to pop out of the tray to get to TSB location 2, which is that small rectangle with rounded corners sticking out from the head (cast aluminum).
It takes several tries to get a good shot of TSB location 2, but this is what worked for me, ymmv.
It also goes without saying to wait for the engine to cool off before slowly threading the bore scope in and out — but also driving for a bit will create fresh coolant spray that is easier to see, so I did that and waited for the engine to cool off and then sent the endoscope in.
Picture below is the metal exhaust gasket (tray) on the head. The bottom of this picture faces down when attached to the lower block and the 4 exhaust ports face to the back of the car, so this is what it looks like if you’re sitting in the passenger seat and could see through the firewall, with the head tilted forward 90 degrees.
So you slide the bore scope from the upper right, down past the two exhaust studs on the right, hit the bottom right corner of the tray (metal exhaust gasket) and follow the tray along the bottom from right to left, go past the middle bottom stud (TSB location 1) and keep following along the bottom of the tray to the lower left exhaust stud, and then twist the bore scope cable to pop out of the tray to get to TSB location 2, which is that small rectangle with rounded corners sticking out from the head (cast aluminum).
It takes several tries to get a good shot of TSB location 2, but this is what worked for me, ymmv.
It also goes without saying to wait for the engine to cool off before slowly threading the bore scope in and out — but also driving for a bit will create fresh coolant spray that is easier to see, so I did that and waited for the engine to cool off and then sent the endoscope in.
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